Re: [R] Cautioning optim() users about "Nelder-Mead" default - (originally) Optim instability

2015-11-15 Thread ProfJCNash
Agreed on the default algorithm issue. That is important for users to know, and I'm happy to underline it. Also that CG (which is based on one of my codes) should be deprecated. BFGS (also based on one of my codes from long ago) does much better than I would ever have expected. Over the years

Re: [R] Cautioning optim() users about "Nelder-Mead" default - (originally) Optim instability

2015-11-15 Thread Mark Leeds
and just to add to john's comments, since he's too modest, in my experience, the algorithm in the rvmmin package ( written by john ) shows great improvement compared to the L-BFGS-B algorithm so I don't use L-BFGS-B anymore. L-BFGS-B often has a dangerous convergence issue in that it can

Re: [R] Cautioning optim() users about "Nelder-Mead" default - (originally) Optim instability

2015-11-15 Thread ProfJCNash
Not contradicting Ravi's message, but I wouldn't say Nelder-Mead is "bad" per se. It's issues are that it assumes the parameters are all on the same scale, and the termination (not convergence) test can't use gradients, so it tends to get "near" the optimum very quickly -- say only 10% of the

[R] Cautioning optim() users about "Nelder-Mead" default - (originally) Optim instability

2015-11-15 Thread Ravi Varadhan
Hi, While I agree with the comments about paying attention to parameter scaling, a major issue here is that the default optimization algorithm, Nelder-Mead, is not very good. It is unfortunate that the optim implementation chose this as the "default" algorithm. I have several instances

Re: [R] Cautioning optim() users about "Nelder-Mead" default - (originally) Optim instability

2015-11-15 Thread John C Frain
In econometrics it was common to start an optimization with Nelder-Mead and then switch to one of the other algorithms to finish the optimization. As John Nash states NM gets one close. switching then speeds the final solution. John John C Frain 3 Aranleigh Park Rathfarnham Dublin 14 Ireland

Re: [R] Cautioning optim() users about "Nelder-Mead" default - (originally) Optim instability

2015-11-15 Thread lorenzo.ise...@gmail.com
Thanks a lot, Ravi. Indeed you best understood the point of my email. I am perfectly aware that most of the optimization algorithms find local rather than global minima and therefore the choice of the initial parameters plays (at least in principle) a role. Nevertheless, my optimization problem

Re: [R] Cautioning optim() users about "Nelder-Mead" default - (originally) Optim instability

2015-11-15 Thread Ravi Varadhan
Hi John, My main point is not about Nelder-Mead per se. It is *primarily* about the Nelder-Mead implementation in optim(). The users of optim() should be cautioned regarding the default algorithm and that they should consider alternatives such as "BFGS" in optim(), or other implementations