Re: [RE-wrenches] embedded energy in pv

2012-03-15 Thread toddcory
dang... this was from a movie i watched last week. i thought was still on my hard drive... and i cannot find it now... todd On Thursday, March 15, 2012 1:46pm, "Steve Jefferson" said: Could you site a source for this? I googled this and saw nothing like the 1 – 4 tons of coa

Re: [RE-wrenches] No underside access metal biulding attachment

2012-03-15 Thread Solarguy
I did the pullout calculations for 5/16-18 bolts last year and found that to be plenty good. After drill/tap 72 holes with a magnetic chuck drill I won't ever do it again. It's way too labor intensive. And the 24 thread pitch, which would have been stronger, was not available in stainless so we use

Re: [RE-wrenches] No underside access metal biulding attachment

2012-03-15 Thread Allan Sindelar
Yeah, Jay, I think Dynamic Fastener is where I saw the pull-out chart. I believe that 1/4" is equivalent to #14 - can anyone verify this? So the question (to which I don't know the answer) becomes: in heavy gauge steel (Lars mentioned "about 1/8"), will a 1/4 x 20

Re: [RE-wrenches] No underside access metal biulding attachment

2012-03-15 Thread jay peltz
Hi Allan, I get 1/4 x 20 self taping screws from. I think they are even stronger than the TEK screws. dynamicfasterner.com Jay Peltz power On Mar 15, 2012, at 9:40 AM, Allan Sindelar wrote: > Lars, > This has been addressed before on this list, but its been awhile. #14 > self-tapping ("Tek

Re: [RE-wrenches] No underside access metal biulding attachment

2012-03-15 Thread Jeff Irish
EJOTs are a German product designed for this kind of application. They have an application note that discusses purlin thickness, thread size, and pull out strength. Mudge Fasteners carries them in the US. Jeff Irish, PE President Hudson Valley Clean Energy, Inc. and Adirondack Solar 13 Hook Ro

Re: [RE-wrenches] embedded energy in pv

2012-03-15 Thread Tom Elliot
Years ago I had my 15 minutes of fame on the old TechTV network’s show The Screensavers talking about PV and solar energy and got that question at the end of the show. I had just looked up that info and remember that while it varies with manufacturer the numbers for embedded energy recovery for

Re: [RE-wrenches] embedded energy in pv

2012-03-15 Thread Exeltech
PV energy "payback" is listed as 0.7 to 25.5 years, depending on the type of module and the data you elect to use. The preponderance of most opinion/data support 1 to 4 years as the period for the equivalent embodied energy in a PV module to be produced by that module, again depending on the modul

Re: [RE-wrenches] embedded energy in pv

2012-03-15 Thread benn kilburn
Never mind Jim, i found the attachment in your original post, under a different 'subject' title.Thanks,benn DayStar Renewable Energy Inc. benn@daystarsolar.ca780-906-7807 HAVE A SUNNY DAY From: b...@daystarsolar.ca To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2012 14:37:41 -0600

Re: [RE-wrenches] embedded energy in pv

2012-03-15 Thread Steve Jefferson
Could you site a source for this? I googled this and saw nothing like the 1 – 4 tons of coal on the first 5 pages of results. Everything I read and the few power points (even one from 2000) stated that a single module will start creating more energy than used to make it in the 2-5 year range.

Re: [RE-wrenches] embedded energy in pv

2012-03-15 Thread benn kilburn
I was told a few days ago that a PV module will likely never produce the energy it took to make it I bit my lip, disagreed and wished i could recall in detail what i had read in one of the reports/articles i had read in the past on this topic. From what i can remember it is about 2-3 yrs.

Re: [RE-wrenches] embedded energy in pv

2012-03-15 Thread wirewiz
Todd, So true, thanks for the reality check. An energy survey is required here in CT if you want rebate money. Larry Liesner Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -Original Message- From: toddc...@finestplanet.com Sender: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.orgDate: Thu, 15 Mar 20

Re: [RE-wrenches] No underside access metal biulding attachment

2012-03-15 Thread toddcory
i think bob o once said he used ss pop rivets on a job like this. todd On Thursday, March 15, 2012 9:26am, "lars Ortegren" said: Wrenches, We have a project coming up where we are installing a large array on a low slope metal building with metal purlins. Typically we would through bo

[RE-wrenches] embedded energy in pv

2012-03-15 Thread toddcory
i recently read that it takes the equivalent energy of between 1 and 4 tons of coal to make a single pv module. this is why i insist my customers do their efficiency upgrades and learn how to be frugal/conserve before i will even talk about pv with them. renewables powering waste is old parad

[RE-wrenches] No underside access metal building attachment

2012-03-15 Thread Kirpal Khalsa
Lars, We looked into this and found some "threaded pop rivets" they were stainless steel and you had to buy the tool and then you just drill from the top, insert the pop rivet that leaves a threaded shaft facing skyward that you could attach L feet or other attachments to with a nut and washert

Re: [RE-wrenches] No underside access metal biulding attachment

2012-03-15 Thread Allan Sindelar
Lars, This has been addressed before on this list, but its been awhile. #14 self-tapping ("Tek") screws have phenomenal pull-out strength in standard steel purlins. My advice is to research this through your fastener supplier; I have seen charts on pull-out strength of

[RE-wrenches] No underside access metal biulding attachment

2012-03-15 Thread lars Ortegren
Wrenches, We have a project coming up where we are installing a large array on a low slope metal building with metal purlins. Typically we would through bolt our attachment to the purlins, but in this case the building is a self-storage, and access is not an option. Does anyone out there have expe