Re: [rspec-users] "Why not MockEverthing" or why use fixtures for all tests?

2008-03-19 Thread Glenn Ford
On Mar 19, 2008, at 3:21 PM, David Chelimsky wrote: > On Wed, Mar 19, 2008 at 2:10 PM, Glenn Ford <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >> On Mar 19, 2008, at 1:03 PM, David Chelimsky wrote: >>> Again - this is a matter of granularity. The whole point of having >>> granular examples is to enable you to m

Re: [rspec-users] "Why not MockEverthing" or why use fixtures for all tests?

2008-03-19 Thread David Chelimsky
On Wed, Mar 19, 2008 at 2:10 PM, Glenn Ford <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On Mar 19, 2008, at 1:03 PM, David Chelimsky wrote: > > Again - this is a matter of granularity. The whole point of having > > granular examples is to enable you to make changes to the system > > easily via refactoring. S

Re: [rspec-users] "Why not MockEverthing" or why use fixtures for all tests?

2008-03-19 Thread Glenn Ford
On Mar 19, 2008, at 1:03 PM, David Chelimsky wrote: > On Wed, Mar 19, 2008 at 10:42 AM, Glenn Ford <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: [Big Snip] >> >> >>> >>> There are a few bad assumptions in your colleague's response, so to >>> set the record straight: >>> >>> * test coverage and tests which u

Re: [rspec-users] "Why not MockEverthing" or why use fixtures for all tests?

2008-03-19 Thread David Schmidt
On Mar 19, 2008, at 8:42 AM, Glenn Ford wrote: > My primary concern when writing my specs that are to cover complicated > features is that I do NOT want false confidence. If I write a spec, > and it passes, I want that to mean it works in my app. When the spec > goes green, my next step is to g

Re: [rspec-users] "Why not MockEverthing" or why use fixtures for all tests?

2008-03-19 Thread David Chelimsky
On Wed, Mar 19, 2008 at 10:42 AM, Glenn Ford <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> [Big Snip] > > > > > > There are a few bad assumptions in your colleague's response, so to > > set the record straight: > > > > * test coverage and tests which use the interaction-based test > > approach are not mutua

Re: [rspec-users] "Why not MockEverthing" or why use fixtures for all tests?

2008-03-19 Thread Glenn Ford
>> [Big Snip] > > There are a few bad assumptions in your colleague's response, so to > set the record straight: > > * test coverage and tests which use the interaction-based test > approach are not mutually exclusive > * you can have crappy tests which take the state-based approach and > crappy te

Re: [rspec-users] "Why not MockEverthing" or why use fixtures for all tests?

2008-03-18 Thread Zach Dennis
Hello, On Tue, Mar 18, 2008 at 4:15 AM, David Schmidt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hello fellow RSpec users. > > Before you all start warming up your flame throwers please let me explain my > Subject line. > > I've been working over 4 months on a large Rails project with a few other > developers.

Re: [rspec-users] "Why not MockEverthing" or why use fixtures for all tests?

2008-03-18 Thread James Deville
On Mar 18, 2008, at 6:36 AM, Alan Larkin wrote: > David Schmidt wrote: >> Hello fellow RSpec users. >> >> Before you all start warming up your flame throwers please let me >> explain my Subject line. >> >> I've been working over 4 months on a large Rails project with a few >> other developers. Te

Re: [rspec-users] "Why not MockEverthing" or why use fixtures for all tests?

2008-03-18 Thread Alan Larkin
David Schmidt wrote: > Hello fellow RSpec users. > > Before you all start warming up your flame throwers please let me > explain my Subject line. > > I've been working over 4 months on a large Rails project with a few > other developers. Test coverage was spotty at best, though they *were* >

Re: [rspec-users] "Why not MockEverthing" or why use fixtures for all tests?

2008-03-18 Thread David Chelimsky
On Tue, Mar 18, 2008 at 5:04 AM, Chris Parsons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi David > > > On 18 Mar 2008, at 08:15, David Schmidt wrote: > > > Here is his email to me, less his signature as I don't want to make > > this personal. I'd like to see what the RSpec user community has to > > say in

Re: [rspec-users] "Why not MockEverthing" or why use fixtures for all tests?

2008-03-18 Thread Chris Parsons
Hi David On 18 Mar 2008, at 08:15, David Schmidt wrote: > Here is his email to me, less his signature as I don't want to make > this personal. I'd like to see what the RSpec user community has to > say in response to his comments, below: [snip email] For me, it basically boils down to: use

[rspec-users] "Why not MockEverthing" or why use fixtures for all tests?

2008-03-18 Thread David Schmidt
Hello fellow RSpec users. Before you all start warming up your flame throwers please let me explain my Subject line. I've been working over 4 months on a large Rails project with a few other developers. Test coverage was spotty at best, though they *were* RSpec tests. One of the other d