From: David Sommerseth <sl+us...@lists.topphemmelig.net> On 28/04/2019 22:42, Orion Poplawski wrote: > On 4/28/19 11:03 AM, Konstantin Olchanski wrote: >> On Sat, Apr 27, 2019 at 02:15:42PM +0200, Maarten wrote: >>> Hello fellow SL users, >>> I having been using SL for a while now, ... >>> there will be no SL8... >>> the future [?] >> >> >> I look at the future throught the mirror of today's problems. >> >> And today's problems in the RH/CentOS/SL universe do not project a bright >> sunny future: >> >> - systemd is a mess up. with luck IBM's purchase will clean house on this >> one. > > I'm pretty sure any chance of systemd being replaced any time soon is > vanishingly small. Embrace it, file bugs, move on with life.
+1 >> - c++, cmake, python, php, etc are always 1-2 versions behind those required >> by packages we need to use > > This has been a problem inherent with "Enterprise" distributions that value > stability over new features. That said, I've found that RHEL7 has been much > more aggressive with updates (sometimes annoyingly so) that EL6 was. Also, > with modules in EL8 hopefully this will be much better. Correct. In addition, there is the devtoolset packages which provides up-to-date compilers as well. I'm doing my primary development on EL-7, testing builds with native EL7 and GCC version 6, 7 and 8. Just install yum-conf-softwarecollections.noarch and you have all the devtoolset variants available. This repo also provides up-to-date PHP and Python packages as well. In regards to up-to-date CMake, Fedora EPEL provides cmake3-3.13.4. SCL isn't necessarily the best approach for all use cases, but it certainly works if you want to make it work. >> - ZFS is not part of the base system, does not play well with kernel updates >> - NIS will be removed in el8, with no replacement (LDAP need not apply >> unless they sorted out handling of autofs maps) > > NIS, seriously? FWIW - I use autofs with LDAP (by way of IPA) extensively > without issue. +1 >> - incoming mess up of X11 via Wayland graphics > > This does not seem tied to any one particular distribution, unless there are > some trying to avoid Wayland altogether? Though I can't imagine that being > viable for long. Isn't Fedora shipping with Wayland enabled by default nowadays? And Ubuntu is moving towards this direction too. IIRC, Wayland is also under tech-preview for RHEL-7. I would be surprised if Wayland wouldn't be shipped in RHEL-8. [...snip...] >> P.S. What's the beef with systemd? Apart from sundry bugs (for example, >> sometimes >> it does not respect the startup order specified in the unit files), we have >> been >> forced to disable all automatic updates (usually a nightly cron job). This is >> because an update of the systemd package triggers/forces the restart of every >> system service (nis, nfs, autofs, etc), effectively a reboot of the machine >> (minus rebooting of the linux kernel). Not a nice thing to happen on >> production >> machines on random nights whenever updated systemd is pushed out (usally 2-3 >> times a year). >> Of course in our experience, about 50% of the time something goes wrong and >> one of the services >> restarted by the systemd update does not restart correctly yielding a dead >> machine. >> Rant over. > > I run with automatic updates and have never seen a systemd update force a > restart of every system service. +1 ... never seen anything like that at all, on something like 20+ SL7 boxes over several years. In addition, there is the "exclude" setting you can add to the yum{,-cron,-cron-hourly}.conf config files. -- kind regards, David Sommerseth