Re: [SLUG] Paying Money for Quality (and software testing)

2006-05-08 Thread O Plameras
Jacinta Richardson wrote: Benno wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Make it RUN; Make it RIGHT; Make it FAST; and Make it NICE. I think the idea that the TDD guys are putting forward is that "Make it NICE" (e.g: automated test suite), means that you can make it "RIGHT" and "

Re: [SLUG] Paying Money for Quality (and software testing)

2006-05-06 Thread Ken Foskey
On Tue, 2006-05-02 at 12:16 +1000, Benno wrote: > I think the idea that the TDD guys are putting forward is that "Make it NICE" > (e.g: > automated test suite), means that you can make it "RIGHT" and "FAST" with > less effort > than if you didn't have an automated test suite. I looked at this

Re: [SLUG] Paying Money for Quality (and software testing)

2006-05-06 Thread Jacinta Richardson
Benno wrote: >>[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >>Make it RUN; >>Make it RIGHT; >>Make it FAST; and >>Make it NICE. > > I think the idea that the TDD guys are putting forward is that "Make it NICE" > (e.g: > automated test suite), means that you can make it "RIGHT" and "FAST" with > less effort > tha

Re: [SLUG] Paying Money for Quality (and software testing)

2006-05-05 Thread Mark Greenaway
On Sat, Apr 29, 2006 at 09:35:19PM +1000, Ken Foskey wrote: > > Don't you think we may be right? > Absolutely. I have written perl modules with test scripts and without. > The ones with test scripts have always been faster to develop. This > sounds absolutely wrong however it is what I have found

Re: [SLUG] Paying Money for Quality (and software testing)

2006-05-01 Thread Benno
On Sun Apr 30, 2006 at 08:49:39 +1000, O Plameras wrote: >[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >>-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- >>Hash: SHA1 >> >>With regards to last night's Slug meeting and using automated testing, >>I think everyone agrees that writing (and using) test cases produces >>higher quality co

Re: [SLUG] Paying Money for Quality (and software testing)

2006-05-01 Thread Martin Pool
On 29 Apr 2006, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > With regards to last night's Slug meeting and using automated testing, > I think everyone agrees that writing (and using) test cases produces > higher quality code with less bugs. My point is that higher quality > output doesn't come for free, it requires

Re: [SLUG] Paying Money for Quality (and software testing)

2006-04-30 Thread telford
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Erik: > telford: > > Erik: > > > It should also be easy to prove by now that either Rob or Peter > > > has written more code than you, or anyone you can name that swears > > > off test driven developement. We say that (as long as you ignore > > > genui

Re: [SLUG] Paying Money for Quality (and software testing)

2006-04-29 Thread O Plameras
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 With regards to last night's Slug meeting and using automated testing, I think everyone agrees that writing (and using) test cases produces higher quality code with less bugs. My point is that higher quality output doesn't c

Re: [SLUG] Paying Money for Quality (and software testing)

2006-04-29 Thread Erik de Castro Lopo
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Erik: > > It should also be easy to prove by now that either Rob or Peter > > has written more code than you, or anyone you can name that swears > > off test driven developement. We say that (as long as you ignore > > genuine knockoffs with only one user) based on our ex

Re: [SLUG] Paying Money for Quality (and software testing)

2006-04-29 Thread Robert Collins
On Sat, 2006-04-29 at 21:40 +1000, Ken Foskey wrote: > On Sat, 2006-04-29 at 19:34 +1000, Robert Collins wrote: > > > wikipedia has a nice little article on this too : > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Test_driven_development. > > There is a step missing from this document. We have to remember to

Re: [SLUG] Paying Money for Quality (and software testing)

2006-04-29 Thread Ken Foskey
On Sat, 2006-04-29 at 19:34 +1000, Robert Collins wrote: > wikipedia has a nice little article on this too : > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Test_driven_development. There is a step missing from this document. We have to remember to test the test code a little bit. Write test. *** Run test, ens

Re: [SLUG] Paying Money for Quality (and software testing)

2006-04-29 Thread Ken Foskey
On Sat, 2006-04-29 at 15:08 +1000, Erik de Castro Lopo wrote: > Don't you think we may be right? Absolutely. I have written perl modules with test scripts and without. The ones with test scripts have always been faster to develop. This sounds absolutely wrong however it is what I have found. Y

Re: [SLUG] Paying Money for Quality (and software testing)

2006-04-29 Thread Robert Collins
On Sat, 2006-04-29 at 16:55 +0800, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > My favourite eg: PTC track (rail) transponder readers. > I watched the 'expert consultant' spend 3500 hours, watched his tries > and > fumbles and finally fail the official 'type testing' acceptance. > In 30 days I wrote the trans

Re: [SLUG] Paying Money for Quality (and software testing)

2006-04-29 Thread jam
On Saturday 29 April 2006 16:11, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > With regards to last night's Slug meeting and using automated testing, > I think everyone agrees that writing (and using) test cases produces > higher quality code with less bugs. My point is that higher quality > output doesn't come for f

Re: [SLUG] Paying Money for Quality (and software testing)

2006-04-29 Thread telford
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Erik: > It should also be easy to prove by now that either Rob or Peter > has written more code than you, or anyone you can name that swears > off test driven developement. We say that (as long as you ignore > genuine knockoffs with only one user) base

Re: [SLUG] Paying Money for Quality (and software testing)

2006-04-28 Thread Erik de Castro Lopo
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- > Hash: SHA1 > > With regards to last night's Slug meeting and using automated testing, > I think everyone agrees that writing (and using) test cases produces > higher quality code with less bugs. My point is that higher quality > out

[SLUG] Paying Money for Quality (and software testing)

2006-04-28 Thread telford
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 With regards to last night's Slug meeting and using automated testing, I think everyone agrees that writing (and using) test cases produces higher quality code with less bugs. My point is that higher quality output doesn't come for free, it requires e