Another good choice for beginners is the Push-E Cat. An all EPP speed 400 motor glider. We've had a couple of folks learn on the Push-E at our filed. The biggest benefit is the minimum down time from a crash something that seems to discourage a lot of beginners. You could even make an aileron version. Web site is at; http://www.rc-aero.com/kits/pushe/ _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]