Re: [nyphp-talk] Learning to program the right way

2012-01-23 Thread Froilan Cajayon Mendoza
s. > > > > > > > > > As you can see from the above, this also explains /why/ programming > > > books suck so much. It's a lot of extra verbage to go step by step > > > through the testing/commit process - and programmers are by nature > >

Re: [nyphp-talk] Learning to program the right way

2012-01-23 Thread Joseph Crawford
Taken from Zend Framework A Beginners Guide which is the most up to date book about Zend Framework which targets ZF 1.10 mysql> CREATE TABLE IF NOT EXISTS user ( -> RecordID INT(4) NOT NULL AUTO_INCREMENT, -> Username VARCHAR(10) NOT NULL, -> Password TEXT NOT NULL, -> PRIMARY KEY (RecordID) -> )

Re: [nyphp-talk] Learning to program the right way

2012-01-23 Thread Greg Rundlett (freephile)
> > > I'm curious if there are any other items people think should be > incorporated into this tutorial. > I think that there have been books like this (For example, a book from 2004 written by George Schlosshnagle: http://www.amazon.com/Advanced-PHP-Programming-George-Schlossnagle/dp/0672325616)

Re: [nyphp-talk] Learning to program the right way

2012-01-23 Thread Mark Armendariz
It seems this might be an unpopular opinion around here, but I think it's a great idea to include all of the above. It teaches that while these things may be optional, the option is to remove them from your process, not to add them. It's important that these ideas are introduced early so that

Re: [nyphp-talk] Learning to program the right way

2012-01-23 Thread Philip Camilleri
Once again, though, Gary, I think you're mixing two separate issues. Details about escaping & sql-injection have no place in sample-code, except in that chapter that has to do with these issues. That said, if you want to write a book about PHP that goes through the lengths of outlining source-cont

Re: [nyphp-talk] Learning to program the right way

2012-01-23 Thread Justin Dearing
Gary, Version control, unit tests, etc are not learning to program. They are learning software engineering. Quite frankly, if you started "Software engineering 101" like this, it would probably add another course between this course and a data structures and algorithms course at a university. Also

Re: [nyphp-talk] Learning to program the right way

2012-01-23 Thread Gary Mort
I personally think that when instructing someone in how to program for a language, one should include good practices - including choosing good data structures for the example code and explaining why they are chosen. That is another issue I have with programming books, they often include some t

Re: [nyphp-talk] Learning to program the right way

2012-01-23 Thread Federico Ulfo
Everybody wants to see fast results, and starting with Hello World is always the best way. Also starting from the basics is good because once you master the logic of OOP and procedural programming you can move from one language to another. About Git and Unit, I agree partially, if you decide to go

Re: [nyphp-talk] Learning to program the right way

2012-01-23 Thread Rukbat
I have to strongly second this. Learning programming means learning algorithms and data structures. Learning the job a programmer does includes version control, unit testing and many other things. Learning a language or ten is one of those other things, but it's not part of learning programm

Re: [nyphp-talk] Learning to program the right way

2012-01-23 Thread leam hall
Gary, Part of me thinks this is a great idea. Another part of me thinks you're thinking inside the box. Why not have a "How to really program" class where you introduce these topics, functional and OOP, MVC, go over the basics of a few languages, and stuff like that? I would have loved something

Re: [nyphp-talk] Learning to program the right way

2012-01-23 Thread Philip Camilleri
hi Gary, to be honest I would argue that such things as Version Control and Unit Testing do not really belong in a language-specific text-book or tutorial. After all, one does not try to teach program control, binary logic, control and data structures, and the like in a language-specific text-book

[nyphp-talk] Learning to program the right way

2012-01-23 Thread Gary Mort
One thing that has annoyed me more and more over time is the way books and classes go about teaching /how/ to program in a language. They all start off with "Hello World" and then progress slowly form there to more and more complicated things. I've noticed that even Ruby books, the poster chi

[nyphp-talk] Tech Event / Refinery29

2012-01-23 Thread Jorge Lopez
Hello, Just wanted to give people a heads up about an event we're hosting at Refinery29! http://msw-fe.eventbrite.com/ The lineup is pretty amazing: - Damian Galarza - Thrillist - Benjamin Wilson - Refinery29 - Pau Santesmasses -