texascavers Digest 16 Jan 2009 14:18:13 -0000 Issue 689
Topics (messages 9906 through 9920):
Re: The TEXAS CAVER Is Now Online!!!!
9906 by: Mark.Alman.l-3com.com
9907 by: Mark.Alman.l-3com.com
9908 by: Lyndon Tiu
9909 by: Keith Goggin
9910 by: Mark.Alman.l-3com.com
9911 by: Lyndon Tiu
9912 by: Joe Ranzau
9913 by: J. LaRue Thomas
9914 by: Lyndon Tiu
9915 by: Keith Goggin
9916 by: Denise P
9917 by: Lyndon Tiu
9918 by: Mark.Alman.l-3com.com
9919 by: Mark.Alman.l-3com.com
9920 by: Bill Bentley-Webmail
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--- Begin Message ---
At the meeting Sunday morning (and it was a very large turnout), I don't
recall one person being in favor of raising dues.
We may revisit this in April and go to the two-tiered membership,
A lower fee for electronic access only and a higher fee for a mailed TC.
We'll see how the response for this goes, but the reaction and sign up
seems to be positive and going well.
If anyone has other suggestions and ideas in keeping the TSA viable and
still affordable for folks, I suggest you be sure to make the meeting at
the TSA Convention.
We'll see y'all then and I'm glad to see this exchange of ideas. It
would have been better to have had them at the meeting Sunday, though.
Thanks,
Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: speleoste...@tx.rr.com [mailto:speleoste...@tx.rr.com]
Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 10:57 PM
To: texascavers@texascavers.com; Terri Sprouse
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] The TEXAS CAVER Is Now Online!!!!
---- Terri Sprouse <posada...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Peter thinks the solution is to raise the dues and keep printing the
hard
copies. I agree. <<
So do it. Raise my dues. So what if it's another $10 a year? Ten dollars
a year? If that breaks you, then you surely can't buy batteries for your
LED light either.
Bill
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--- Begin Message ---
I learned something a LOOOOOONG time ago in one of the boring training
meeting we had here at work and it applies to a LOT of aspects in life:
NEVER WRITE SOMETHING THAT YOU WOULD BE UNCOMFORTABLE HAVING OTHERS READ
ON THE FRONT PAGE OF THE PAPER.
If you'll go by this simple edict, and I do, you'll never have a problem
with the wrong person reading the wrong thing.
'Nuff said.
Mark
________________________________
From: Denise P [mailto:pepabe...@hotmail.com]
Sent: Friday, January 16, 2009 7:11 AM
To: TexasCavers
Subject: RE: [Texascavers] The TEXAS CAVER Is Now Online!!!!
I see Terri's point about not having the CAVER able to be electronically
distributed all over, and folks losing their privacy. I know she gets up
to all kinds of mischief on trips she doesn't want her conservative
employers to know about! :)
Could we make it where it's read only (not downloadable) on the web
site? People who want a hardcopy could continue to receive one in the
mail.
I personally do not want a hardcopy or my dues raised (though I could
afford it, I'd rather not pay more, I support all kinds of organizations
in addition to the TSA), so I like this option.
I do not think the goal here is to eliminate all hardcopies, only those
for people who do not want them (a logical decision that saves money for
the TSA and a tree or two/barrel of oil). I really think the CAVER will
always be in print.
My two cents,
Denise
> Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 20:28:00 -0800
> From: posada...@yahoo.com
> To: texascavers@texascavers.com
> Subject: Re: [Texascavers] The TEXAS CAVER Is Now Online!!!!
>
>
> Peter thinks the solution is to raise the dues and keep printing the
hard copies. I agree. Peter uses the Texas Caver as a resource - so long
term access is important. We have all of the Texas Cavers dating back to
1961 on our book shelves. Computers, programs, online data storage
systems crash, become outdated and change a lot, but data stored in the
bookcase is stable and reliable. The last thing we want is to look up
one day and realize that we have lost this source of information on
explored caves.
>
> The prospect of having trip reports available online to non-members
(or to any large group of people in digital format) scares the hell out
of me. Most times, people on a caving trip have absolutely no control
over what is written about them in a trip report.
>
> I would not like for anything that I write about in a trip report to
be easily forwarded to or accessible by the general public, employers,
clients, etc. . . . I don't want to gratuitously offer any more info on
anybody. The internet is grabby enough. Do we really want to feed that
monster?
>
> Gezus
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Fri, 16 Jan 2009 07:08:13 -0600 mark.al...@l-3com.com wrote:
> We may revisit this in April and go to the two-tiered membership,
> A lower fee for electronic access only and a higher fee for a mailed TC.
Q: I forgot how we agreed on this. Is it by default, starting Q1 2009 - that
everyone will NOT get a mailed hard copy unless they specifically request for
it? And they only have to request once and all future copies will be mailed out
to them or is it one request per issue?
Depending on the A to the above Q. An option is to sit this out and wait and
observe how things go. If the majority are happy with the electronic version
and only a few are being mailed out. Then we have solved the primary goal of
having electronic copies - saving money.
I think a majority will opt for the electronic copy anyways. Only a few will
want mailed hard copies. For the few that want it, let them have it.
I (not getting a hard copy) personally don't mind paying the same membership
amount as a person who is getting his hard copy.
I believe most don't mind either.
--
Lyndon Tiu
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
So do it. Raise my dues. So what if it's another $10 a year? Ten dollars a
year? If that breaks you, then you surely can't buy batteries for your LED
light either.
Amen to that. Hell, I'll even pay double so some poor caver doesn't have to
cave in the dark. An extra 10 bucks a year is <$0.03/day. I'd rather spend my
time hunting parking lots for enough spare change to cover the increase than I
would spending it driving to a copy shop to get the thing printed (for even
more money!).
Why not have a Hard Copy rate and a Digital Only Rate (say, 10 dollars less -
or whatever the actual cost of publication is)?
Keith
________________________________
From: "speleoste...@tx.rr.com" <speleoste...@tx.rr.com>
To: texascavers@texascavers.com; Terri Sprouse <posada...@yahoo.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 10:56:40 PM
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] The TEXAS CAVER Is Now Online!!!!
---- Terri Sprouse <posada...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Peter thinks the solution is to raise the dues and keep printing the hard
copies. I agree. <<
So do it. Raise my dues. So what if it's another $10 a year? Ten dollars a
year? If that breaks you, then you surely can't buy batteries for your LED
light either.
Bill
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--- Begin Message ---
No, Lyndon.
We agreed to strongly encourage everyone to sign up in the Members
Section on the TSA website.
By doing so, this would indicate that you would be accessing the site
for each TC that comes out.
If you're on this Members List, you will NOT be receiving a hard copy.
We will gauge the response. We have 20 signed up, so far.
We may have to tweak this setup and, possibly, revisit in April.
More than one person has suggested going all electronic on the TC and
charging more for those that want the hard copy.
Lots of ideas and discussions and that's a good thing.
See you this evening, Lyndon. Drive careful and thanks for helping out!
Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: Lyndon Tiu [mailto:l...@alumni.sfu.ca]
Sent: Friday, January 16, 2009 7:36 AM
To: texascavers@texascavers.com
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] The TEXAS CAVER Is Now Online!!!!
On Fri, 16 Jan 2009 07:08:13 -0600 mark.al...@l-3com.com wrote:
> We may revisit this in April and go to the two-tiered membership,
> A lower fee for electronic access only and a higher fee for a mailed
TC.
Q: I forgot how we agreed on this. Is it by default, starting Q1 2009 -
that everyone will NOT get a mailed hard copy unless they specifically
request for it? And they only have to request once and all future copies
will be mailed out to them or is it one request per issue?
Depending on the A to the above Q. An option is to sit this out and wait
and observe how things go. If the majority are happy with the electronic
version and only a few are being mailed out. Then we have solved the
primary goal of having electronic copies - saving money.
I think a majority will opt for the electronic copy anyways. Only a few
will want mailed hard copies. For the few that want it, let them have
it.
I (not getting a hard copy) personally don't mind paying the same
membership amount as a person who is getting his hard copy.
I believe most don't mind either.
--
Lyndon Tiu
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--- Begin Message ---
On Fri, 16 Jan 2009 13:11:18 0000 pepabe...@hotmail.com wrote:
> Could we make it where it's read only (not downloadable) on the web
> site?
>
Not possible with the internet. In any form (pdf, html, ascii, ebcidic, etc),
once you open and read it on your own computer, the binary reprentation of the
text is transferred from the TSA web server to your computer. From there, you
can copy it and distribute it "wontanly".
But, I am sure we can setup the PDF to self destruct after 30 minutes. Poof,
Smoke ;)
--
Lyndon Tiu
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Tiered dues -
A big reason is that this whole thing is run by volunteers. Mark happens to
publish often, but give it a few years and things will change. The people
who maintain the membership lists also volunteer and have high turnover.
Some are really detail oriented and others are not. Most folks I know run
without a complete idea of what they are getting into. Sometimes it is
nothing more than a popularity contest... Use a database you say, sounds
simple but do you know how many people have no clue how to use them?
Keeping the TSA simple is important. What does not seem like a big deal to
this group, has the potential to freak the next group out.
Of course our editor could just work within his budget and not go over (no
offense intended). That would eliminate a lot of this discussion...
Joe
On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 7:41 AM, Keith Goggin <ke...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> *So do it. Raise my dues. So what if it's another $10 a year? Ten dollars
> a year? If that breaks you, then you surely can't buy batteries for your LED
> light either.*
>
> Amen to that. Hell, I'll even pay double so some poor caver doesn't have
> to cave in the dark. An extra 10 bucks a year is <$0.03/day. I'd rather
> spend my time hunting parking lots for enough spare change to cover the
> increase than I would spending it driving to a copy shop to get the thing
> printed (for even more money!).
>
> Why not have a Hard Copy rate and a Digital Only Rate (say, 10 dollars less
> - or whatever the actual cost of publication is)?
> Keith
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* "speleoste...@tx.rr.com" <speleoste...@tx.rr.com>
> *To:* texascavers@texascavers.com; Terri Sprouse <posada...@yahoo.com>
> *Sent:* Thursday, January 15, 2009 10:56:40 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [Texascavers] The TEXAS CAVER Is Now Online!!!!
>
>
> ---- Terri Sprouse <posada...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >> Peter thinks the solution is to raise the dues and keep printing the
> hard
> copies. I agree. <<
>
> So do it. Raise my dues. So what if it's another $10 a year? Ten dollars a
> year? If that breaks you, then you surely can't buy batteries for your LED
> light either.
>
> Bill
>
>
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>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
re: tiered memberships:
Cascade Grotto (Seattle area & north) has had lower dues for electronic
Cascade Caver (.jpg) for many, many years and it seems to work just fine. I
save all mine to a file. If my computer dies or disappears I'm pretty sure
finding replacement Cascade Cavers will be a comparatively minor problem.
I think there's a $3.00 dues break for those of us who are electronic.
Jacqui
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lyndon Tiu" <l...@alumni.sfu.ca>
To: <texascavers@texascavers.com>
Sent: Friday, January 16, 2009 7:45 AM
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] The TEXAS CAVER Is Now Online!!!!
On Fri, 16 Jan 2009 13:11:18 0000 pepabe...@hotmail.com wrote:
> Could we make it where it's read only (not downloadable) on the web
site?
Not possible with the internet. In any form (pdf, html, ascii, ebcidic,
etc), once you open and read it on your own computer, the binary
reprentation of the text is transferred from the TSA web server to your
computer. From there, you can copy it and distribute it "wontanly".
But, I am sure we can setup the PDF to self destruct after 30 minutes.
Poof, Smoke ;)
--
Lyndon Tiu
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--- Begin Message ---
On Fri, 16 Jan 2009 07:40:24 -0600 mark.al...@l-3com.com wrote:
> If you're on this Members List, you will NOT be receiving a hard copy.
>
Ah, oh. OK.
I just signed my rights way when I did that. I didn't even know what I was
doing.
> We will gauge the response. We have 20 signed up, so far.
>
Hmmm, so lets do the math. 20 cavers x $20 = $400 dollars saved. Is this enough
to cover the folks who want hard copies mailed?
If so, then mission accomplished.
The tiered membership and "wontan" distribution issues are another set of
issues we can deal with separately.
> We may have to tweak this setup and, possibly, revisit in April.
>
Yes, sit and observe and see how it works from now till April.
> More than one person has suggested going all electronic on the TC and
> charging more for those that want the hard copy.
>
I feel these are the vocal minority. Not representative of what most
think/want. I think most don't care either ways. We just want to go caving.
We can put this all to a vote in April if it's a really big deal. Otherwise, we
can let it go if it works out alright for most.
>
> Lots of ideas and discussions and that's a good thing.
>
Yes.
> See you this evening, Lyndon. Drive careful and thanks for helping out!
>
I forgot the remote to the DVD! I need to head back home for it. Argh.
You, bring some DVDs along as well.
--
Lyndon Tiu
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Maybe I've misread something, but seems to me that regardless of whether or not
you pay more for a hard copy the digital copies should be available to all paid
members.
________________________________
From: "mark.al...@l-3com.com" <mark.al...@l-3com.com>
To: Lyndon Tiu <l...@alumni.sfu.ca>; texascavers@texascavers.com
Sent: Friday, January 16, 2009 7:40:24 AM
Subject: RE: [Texascavers] The TEXAS CAVER Is Now Online!!!!
No, Lyndon.
We agreed to strongly encourage everyone to sign up in the Members
Section on the TSA website.
By doing so, this would indicate that you would be accessing the site
for each TC that comes out.
If you're on this Members List, you will NOT be receiving a hard copy.
We will gauge the response. We have 20 signed up, so far.
We may have to tweak this setup and, possibly, revisit in April.
More than one person has suggested going all electronic on the TC and
charging more for those that want the hard copy.
Lots of ideas and discussions and that's a good thing.
See you this evening, Lyndon. Drive careful and thanks for helping out!
Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: Lyndon Tiu [mailto:l...@alumni.sfu.ca]
Sent: Friday, January 16, 2009 7:36 AM
To: texascavers@texascavers.com
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] The TEXAS CAVER Is Now Online!!!!
On Fri, 16 Jan 2009 07:08:13 -0600 mark.al...@l-3com.com wrote:
> We may revisit this in April and go to the two-tiered membership,
> A lower fee for electronic access only and a higher fee for a mailed
TC.
Q: I forgot how we agreed on this. Is it by default, starting Q1 2009 -
that everyone will NOT get a mailed hard copy unless they specifically
request for it? And they only have to request once and all future copies
will be mailed out to them or is it one request per issue?
Depending on the A to the above Q. An option is to sit this out and wait
and observe how things go. If the majority are happy with the electronic
version and only a few are being mailed out. Then we have solved the
primary goal of having electronic copies - saving money.
I think a majority will opt for the electronic copy anyways. Only a few
will want mailed hard copies. For the few that want it, let them have
it.
I (not getting a hard copy) personally don't mind paying the same
membership amount as a person who is getting his hard copy.
I believe most don't mind either.
--
Lyndon Tiu
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
So if people made a mistake and signed up not realizing they would be foregoing
their hardcopy of the TC, can they unsign up (down?)?
-Denise> From: mark.al...@l-3com.com> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 07:40:24 -0600>
To: l...@alumni.sfu.ca; texascavers@texascavers.com> Subject: RE: [Texascavers]
The TEXAS CAVER Is Now Online!!!!> > > No, Lyndon.> > We agreed to strongly
encourage everyone to sign up in the Members> Section on the TSA website. > >
By doing so, this would indicate that you would be accessing the site> for each
TC that comes out.> > If you're on this Members List, you will NOT be receiving
a hard copy.> > We will gauge the response. We have 20 signed up, so far.> > We
may have to tweak this setup and, possibly, revisit in April.> > More than one
person has suggested going all electronic on the TC and> charging more for
those that want the hard copy.> > > Lots of ideas and discussions and that's a
good thing.> > See you this evening, Lyndon. Drive careful and thanks for
helping out!> > > Mark> > > > -----Original Message-----> From: Lyndon Tiu
[mailto:l...@alumni.sfu.ca] > Sent: Friday, January 16, 2009 7:36 AM> To:
texascavers@texascavers.com> Subject: Re: [Texascavers] The TEXAS CAVER Is Now
Online!!!!> > > On Fri, 16 Jan 2009 07:08:13 -0600 mark.al...@l-3com.com
wrote:> > We may revisit this in April and go to the two-tiered membership, > >
A lower fee for electronic access only and a higher fee for a mailed> TC.> > Q:
I forgot how we agreed on this. Is it by default, starting Q1 2009 -> that
everyone will NOT get a mailed hard copy unless they specifically> request for
it? And they only have to request once and all future copies> will be mailed
out to them or is it one request per issue?> > Depending on the A to the above
Q. An option is to sit this out and wait> and observe how things go. If the
majority are happy with the electronic> version and only a few are being mailed
out. Then we have solved the> primary goal of having electronic copies - saving
money.> > I think a majority will opt for the electronic copy anyways. Only a
few> will want mailed hard copies. For the few that want it, let them have>
it.> > I (not getting a hard copy) personally don't mind paying the same>
membership amount as a person who is getting his hard copy.> > I believe most
don't mind either.> > --> Lyndon Tiu> >
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_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live™: Keep your life in sync.
http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_t1_allup_explore_012009
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Fri, 16 Jan 2009 07:47:43 -0600 jran...@gmail.com wrote:
> Keeping the TSA simple is important.
+1
--
Lyndon Tiu
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
We can look into this option, Keith.
Another item for your "To Do List", huh. Butch?
Thanks,
Mark
________________________________
From: Keith Goggin [mailto:ke...@sbcglobal.net]
Sent: Fri 1/16/2009 7:58 AM
To: Alman, Mark @ IRP; Lyndon Tiu; texascavers@texascavers.com
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] The TEXAS CAVER Is Now Online!!!!
Maybe I've misread something, but seems to me that regardless of whether or not
you pay more for a hard copy the digital copies should be available to all paid
members.
________________________________
From: "mark.al...@l-3com.com" <mark.al...@l-3com.com>
To: Lyndon Tiu <l...@alumni.sfu.ca>; texascavers@texascavers.com
Sent: Friday, January 16, 2009 7:40:24 AM
Subject: RE: [Texascavers] The TEXAS CAVER Is Now Online!!!!
No, Lyndon.
We agreed to strongly encourage everyone to sign up in the Members
Section on the TSA website.
By doing so, this would indicate that you would be accessing the site
for each TC that comes out.
If you're on this Members List, you will NOT be receiving a hard copy.
We will gauge the response. We have 20 signed up, so far.
We may have to tweak this setup and, possibly, revisit in April.
More than one person has suggested going all electronic on the TC and
charging more for those that want the hard copy.
Lots of ideas and discussions and that's a good thing.
See you this evening, Lyndon. Drive careful and thanks for helping out!
Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: Lyndon Tiu [mailto:l...@alumni.sfu.ca]
Sent: Friday, January 16, 2009 7:36 AM
To: texascavers@texascavers.com
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] The TEXAS CAVER Is Now Online!!!!
On Fri, 16 Jan 2009 07:08:13 -0600 mark.al...@l-3com.com wrote:
> We may revisit this in April and go to the two-tiered membership,
> A lower fee for electronic access only and a higher fee for a mailed
TC.
Q: I forgot how we agreed on this. Is it by default, starting Q1 2009 -
that everyone will NOT get a mailed hard copy unless they specifically
request for it? And they only have to request once and all future copies
will be mailed out to them or is it one request per issue?
Depending on the A to the above Q. An option is to sit this out and wait
and observe how things go. If the majority are happy with the electronic
version and only a few are being mailed out. Then we have solved the
primary goal of having electronic copies - saving money.
I think a majority will opt for the electronic copy anyways. Only a few
will want mailed hard copies. For the few that want it, let them have
it.
I (not getting a hard copy) personally don't mind paying the same
membership amount as a person who is getting his hard copy.
I believe most don't mind either.
--
Lyndon Tiu
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--- Begin Message ---
Send a message to Butch, Denise.
Thanks,
Mark
________________________________
From: Denise P [mailto:pepabe...@hotmail.com]
Sent: Fri 1/16/2009 7:58 AM
To: TexasCavers
Subject: RE: [Texascavers] The TEXAS CAVER Is Now Online!!!!
So if people made a mistake and signed up not realizing they would be foregoing
their hardcopy of the TC, can they unsign up (down?)?
-Denise
> From: mark.al...@l-3com.com
> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 07:40:24 -0600
> To: l...@alumni.sfu.ca; texascavers@texascavers.com
> Subject: RE: [Texascavers] The TEXAS CAVER Is Now Online!!!!
>
>
> No, Lyndon.
>
> We agreed to strongly encourage everyone to sign up in the Members
> Section on the TSA website.
>
> By doing so, this would indicate that you would be accessing the site
> for each TC that comes out.
>
> If you're on this Members List, you will NOT be receiving a hard copy.
>
> We will gauge the response. We have 20 signed up, so far.
>
> We may have to tweak this setup and, possibly, revisit in April.
>
> More than one person has suggested going all electronic on the TC and
> charging more for those that want the hard copy.
>
>
> Lots of ideas and discussions and that's a good thing.
>
> See you this evening, Lyndon. Drive careful and thanks for helping out!
>
>
> Mark
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Lyndon Tiu [mailto:l...@alumni.sfu.ca]
> Sent: Friday, January 16, 2009 7:36 AM
> To: texascavers@texascavers.com
> Subject: Re: [Texascavers] The TEXAS CAVER Is Now Online!!!!
>
>
> On Fri, 16 Jan 2009 07:08:13 -0600 mark.al...@l-3com.com wrote:
> > We may revisit this in April and go to the two-tiered membership,
> > A lower fee for electronic access only and a higher fee for a mailed
> TC.
>
> Q: I forgot how we agreed on this. Is it by default, starting Q1 2009 -
> that everyone will NOT get a mailed hard copy unless they specifically
> request for it? And they only have to request once and all future copies
> will be mailed out to them or is it one request per issue?
>
> Depending on the A to the above Q. An option is to sit this out and wait
> and observe how things go. If the majority are happy with the electronic
> version and only a few are being mailed out. Then we have solved the
> primary goal of having electronic copies - saving money.
>
> I think a majority will opt for the electronic copy anyways. Only a few
> will want mailed hard copies. For the few that want it, let them have
> it.
>
> I (not getting a hard copy) personally don't mind paying the same
> membership amount as a person who is getting his hard copy.
>
> I believe most don't mind either.
>
> --
> Lyndon Tiu
>
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--- Begin Message ---
Mark,
I want to be able to have both hard paper and electronic copies.
I did not know when I registered yesterday that I would be giving up
the paper copies. If that is the case then unsign unregister me.
Also.... And I know it take lots of time, but are all of the previous
copies of TC going to be archived in PDF format and made available too?
The PBSS has no newsletter at this time, but I think that is about to
change soon. Several years ago when we did have a newsletter we
switched from hard copies to electronic PDF and now 99% of the
membership gets pdf copies made available of the PBSS website (Open
for everyone, because we want to encourage membership that way) The
few that don't have a Computer and Internet get theirs printed and
sent to them or picked up at meetings. So far it has worked and so far
so good. It took me a couple of years to scan and convert to PDF all
of the back issues and they are also available as well to all. Never
had any complaints except from me for all the work involved. Oh we did
have a guy email the grotto after reading one of the back issues of
"The Hole News" to complain about a chin strap on a helmet in a
picture or something trivial like that several years ago.
So for my 2 cents worth of my TSA membership is to have both paper and
electronic copies available to paid members and also tackle the task
of making back years issues available in electronic PDF format.
Oh and I have paper copies back to 1978 (thanks to Logan for selling
me a lot of missing ones and back issues at a really good price)
Thanks,
Bill
Quoting Keith Goggin <ke...@sbcglobal.net>:
Maybe I've misread something, but seems to me that regardless of
whether or not you pay more for a hard copy the digital copies
should be available to all paid members.
________________________________
From: "mark.al...@l-3com.com" <mark.al...@l-3com.com>
To: Lyndon Tiu <l...@alumni.sfu.ca>; texascavers@texascavers.com
Sent: Friday, January 16, 2009 7:40:24 AM
Subject: RE: [Texascavers] The TEXAS CAVER Is Now Online!!!!
No, Lyndon.
We agreed to strongly encourage everyone to sign up in the Members
Section on the TSA website.
By doing so, this would indicate that you would be accessing the site
for each TC that comes out.
If you're on this Members List, you will NOT be receiving a hard copy.
We will gauge the response. We have 20 signed up, so far.
We may have to tweak this setup and, possibly, revisit in April.
More than one person has suggested going all electronic on the TC and
charging more for those that want the hard copy.
Lots of ideas and discussions and that's a good thing.
See you this evening, Lyndon. Drive careful and thanks for helping out!
Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: Lyndon Tiu [mailto:l...@alumni.sfu.ca]
Sent: Friday, January 16, 2009 7:36 AM
To: texascavers@texascavers.com
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] The TEXAS CAVER Is Now Online!!!!
On Fri, 16 Jan 2009 07:08:13 -0600 mark.al...@l-3com.com wrote:
We may revisit this in April and go to the two-tiered membership,
A lower fee for electronic access only and a higher fee for a mailed
TC.
Q: I forgot how we agreed on this. Is it by default, starting Q1 2009 -
that everyone will NOT get a mailed hard copy unless they specifically
request for it? And they only have to request once and all future copies
will be mailed out to them or is it one request per issue?
Depending on the A to the above Q. An option is to sit this out and wait
and observe how things go. If the majority are happy with the electronic
version and only a few are being mailed out. Then we have solved the
primary goal of having electronic copies - saving money.
I think a majority will opt for the electronic copy anyways. Only a few
will want mailed hard copies. For the few that want it, let them have
it.
I (not getting a hard copy) personally don't mind paying the same
membership amount as a person who is getting his hard copy.
I believe most don't mind either.
--
Lyndon Tiu
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