RE: [time-nuts] FW: Bulletin C number 30, nixie clock

2005-07-14 Thread jim_johnson
Thanks Tom, Someone wrote right back and explained that to me. I assumed it was a Java app because the directory "java" was in the path. I never even bothered to try "view source", thinking it might have been protected (via php for example) if it was a commercial product. Nice job on the pro

Re: [time-nuts] FW: Bulletin C number 30, nixie clock

2005-07-14 Thread Tom Van Baak
Hi Jim, The nixie tube leap second countdown clock at http://www.leapsecond.com/java/nixie.htm is actually written in javascript so all you have to do is use your browser "view source" button to have a look at the source code; free for all. /tvb http://www.leapsecond.com/time-nuts.htm - O

Re: [time-nuts] Re: UTC - A Cautionary Tale

2005-07-14 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Rob Seaman writes: >But note that this includes millions of amateur astronomers as well. >If you haven't looked recently at commercially available amateur >telescopes, they are paragons of civil time handling. I know. I upgraded my old 4" Newtonian to an ETX1

Re: [time-nuts] Re: UTC - A Cautionary Tale

2005-07-14 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Jack Hudler" writes: If they can tell the difference, why do they use the word "time" when they keep telling us that "everybody" needs earth rotational orientation ? Poul-Henning >It's not that we can't tell the difference; we just can't forecast the >difference.

Re: [time-nuts] Re: UTC - A Cautionary Tale

2005-07-14 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Mike S writes : >At 08:27 AM 7/14/2005, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote... > >>I find it surreal that astronomers cannot tell the difference >>between precision time and the Earth rotational orientation. > >But then again, you've demonstrated yourself to be an idiot incapabl

Re: [time-nuts] Re: UTC - A Cautionary Tale

2005-07-14 Thread John Ackermann N8UR
Rob Seaman wrote: > Hi, > > John Ackermann says: > >> By the way -- Rob's message was held as a non-member submission >> which I approved. Unless he's subscribed to the list in the >> meantime, he won't see any responses unless you separately cc him. > > > Thanks for approving the message - it

RE: [time-nuts] FW: Bulletin C number 30

2005-07-14 Thread jim_johnson
Hi Tom, Works just fine in both IE ver. 5.5 SP2 and in Firefox ver. 1.0. However, in both browsers the application eventually stops, with a little window popping up saying that the demo mode is over and I need to refresh the window in order for the app to continue. Are you selling this applic

[time-nuts] Re: UTC - A Cautionary Tale

2005-07-14 Thread Rob Seaman
Hi, John Ackermann says: By the way -- Rob's message was held as a non-member submission which I approved. Unless he's subscribed to the list in the meantime, he won't see any responses unless you separately cc him. Thanks for approving the message - it wasn't clear from the list's web

Re: [time-nuts] Re: UTC - A Cautionary Tale

2005-07-14 Thread David Forbes
Brooke, True. However, the timescale in which Leap Hours are interesting is also that in which 5 digit years are required, so those problems can both be fixed by the COBOL programmers in the late 9990s. [humor] GPS time is not a thing that astronomers want to use in the long run, although th

Re: [time-nuts] Re: UTC - A Cautionary Tale

2005-07-14 Thread Brooke Clarke
Hi David: My concern is that if the time between leaps gets to be long then there will be another Y2K type problem. I.e. programmers will ignore the Leap Hour, figuring that they will be dead when it occurs, and when it does there will be many broken programs. The GPS time scale does not ha

Re: [time-nuts] Solving the UTC drift problem

2005-07-14 Thread Dr. David Kirkby
David Forbes wrote: A modest proposal: Instead of adding randomly-placed leap seconds to UTC or allowing UTC to drift from UT1 etc, the timing community should just change the second's definition from time to time as needed. That is, dither the Cs transition frequency between 9,192,631,770 Hz

[time-nuts] Re: UTC - A Cautionary Tale

2005-07-14 Thread David Forbes
At 11:13 PM -0700 7/13/05, Rob Seaman wrote: Howdy, This is a little missive from an astronomer on the delicate subject of the divergence of UTC from UTx. It seems that those bastards in the precision timing community want to abandon UTC's leap seconds entirely because they are too much trou

RE: [time-nuts] Re: UTC - A Cautionary Tale

2005-07-14 Thread Jack Hudler
It's not that we can't tell the difference; we just can't forecast the difference. -Original Message- I find it surreal that astronomers cannot tell the difference between precision time and the Earth rotational orientation. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 [EMAIL

[time-nuts] TVB's nixie clock

2005-07-14 Thread rlutwak
I've long been disappointed that I can't set my PC clock display (in the corner of the screen) to MJD. I'll save TVB's link for a (relatively) quick MJD clock. -RL -- Robert Lutwak, Senior Scientist Symmetricom - Technology Realization Center 34 Tozer Rd. Beverly, MA 01915

[time-nuts] Let's tone things down...

2005-07-14 Thread John Ackermann N8UR
All -- I'm not (yet) prepared to moderate messages or ban anyone from the list, but I'd like everyone to remember that this is intended to be a high signal-to-noise ratio place for people to seriously discuss a shared passion in time and frequency measurement. A lot of the folks who contribute t

Re: [time-nuts] Re: UTC - A Cautionary Tale

2005-07-14 Thread Mike S
At 08:27 AM 7/14/2005, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote... >I find it surreal that astronomers cannot tell the difference >between precision time and the Earth rotational orientation. But then again, you've demonstrated yourself to be an idiot incapable of rational argument. What is surreal is that peopl

Re: [time-nuts] Re: UTC - A Cautionary Tale

2005-07-14 Thread John Ackermann N8UR
By the way -- Rob's message was held as a non-member submission which I approved. Unless he's subscribed to the list in the meantime, he won't see any responses unless you separately cc him. John Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: >In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Rob Seaman writes: > > > >>I find

Re: [time-nuts] Re: UTC - A Cautionary Tale

2005-07-14 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Rob Seaman writes: >I find it surreal that it is the precision timing community who are >arguing that the public have no need for access to precision time. Normal people need (precision) time. Astronomers need Earth rotational orientation. I find it surreal tha

[time-nuts] Re: UTC - A Cautionary Tale

2005-07-14 Thread Rob Seaman
Howdy, This is a little missive from an astronomer on the delicate subject of the divergence of UTC from UTx. It seems that those bastards in the precision timing community want to abandon UTC's leap seconds entirely because they are too much trouble, and he's hopping mad. Note that my me

Re: [time-nuts] FW: Bulletin C number 30

2005-07-14 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
Has any of the timesignals (GPS, WWV, MSF, DCF etc) started announcing the leap second yet ? -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 [EMAIL PROTECTED] | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be

Re: [time-nuts] FW: Bulletin C number 30

2005-07-14 Thread John Ackermann N8UR
Very cool, Tom. It works fine on Firefox/Linux here. John Tom Van Baak wrote: >So, after a 7 year delay my >nixie tube Leap Second countdown clock >is back in action. Check out: > >http://www.leapsecond.com/java/nixie.htm > >If the page doesn't display properly with your >web browser pleas

Re: [time-nuts] Solving the UTC drift problem

2005-07-14 Thread Robert Lutwak
Most of the world's atomic clocks are employed as frequency standards. In addition to the telecom applications, they are used in positioning and navigation, precision measurement, and, yes, a few for timekeeping. Those who care for time to be synchronized with the sunrise are relatively small

Re: [time-nuts] Solving the UTC drift problem

2005-07-14 Thread Tom Van Baak
> Instead of adding randomly-placed leap seconds to UTC or allowing UTC > to drift from UT1 etc, the timing community should just change the > second's definition from time to time as needed. That is, dither the Bad idea. Here's the math. An average of one leap second a year is equivalent to a

Re: [time-nuts] Solving the UTC drift problem

2005-07-14 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, David Forbes writes: >At 8:25 AM +0200 7/14/05, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: >>In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, David Forbes writes: >>>A modest proposal: >>> >>>Instead of adding randomly-placed leap seconds to UTC or allowing UTC >>>to drift from UT1 etc, the timing com

Re: [time-nuts] Solving the UTC drift problem

2005-07-14 Thread David Forbes
At 8:25 AM +0200 7/14/05, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, David Forbes writes: A modest proposal: Instead of adding randomly-placed leap seconds to UTC or allowing UTC to drift from UT1 etc, the timing community should just change the second's definition from time to ti