Re: [time-nuts] GPS interference and history...

2011-06-10 Thread Charles P. Steinmetz
Hal wrote: What would it cost to replace all of it? If you wanted to do something like that, what would "it" cover? How about people like us running old recycled gear? (Z3801A, ThunderBolt, ...) Not a chance. Probably not consumer navigation receivers, either. Maybe public safety users.

Re: [time-nuts] GPS interference and history...

2011-06-10 Thread Max Robinson
The so called atomic clocks that used to be locked to WWVB have switched over to GPs for higher reliability. My WWVB clocks loose lock when ever there is a lightning storm within 50 miles but the GPS clocks stay locked. No one is going to get hurt or killed because of a disabled GPS clock but

Re: [time-nuts] GPS interference and history...

2011-06-10 Thread bownes
That small hemispherical antenna could also have been 900mhz. I have one here @ home that is a combined gps/900mhz antenna from an ambulance tracking system. On Jun 10, 2011, at 22:01, Hal Murray wrote: > > li...@rtty.us said: >> There's an enormous amount of gear out there that gets timing

Re: [time-nuts] GPS interference and history...

2011-06-10 Thread J. Forster
Maybe the site has other sensors, like seizmographs or groundwater level that are not obvious. -John > > li...@rtty.us said: >> There's an enormous amount of gear out there that gets timing off of >> GPS. > > That's an interesting claim. Does anybody have any data on the usage of >

Re: [time-nuts] GPS interference and history...

2011-06-10 Thread Mark Spencer
Some other users of gps timing that I have noted thru observation or have personal knowledge of: Timing for telecom providers (I have seen loran used in the past, but this option is more or less gone in North America now.) Timing for power companies Timing for industrial process control Timin

Re: [time-nuts] GPS interference and history...

2011-06-10 Thread Hal Murray
li...@rtty.us said: > There's an enormous amount of gear out there that gets timing off of GPS. That's an interesting claim. Does anybody have any data on the usage of GPS for timing? I assume there is one in every cell tower and one in every 911 call center. Are there other large categorie

[time-nuts] LightSquared vs old GPS gear: Antennas?

2011-06-10 Thread Hal Murray
Is it possible/interesting to design an antenna that has a low-angle cutoff at 20 or 30 degrees? That probably won't eliminate many satellites that are useful for timing receivers. I'm interested in things like a Z3801A or a ThunderBolt. I'm assuming it is not reasonable to replace the GPS u

Re: [time-nuts] GPS interference and history...

2011-06-10 Thread Magnus Danielson
On 06/10/2011 06:42 PM, Bob Camp wrote: Hi The FCC (like most US agencies) has a mission to promote as well as regulate. The promotion side is what drives them to allocate frequencies in a way that you can reasonably produce gear. They have always come back years later and tried to change things

Re: [time-nuts] GPS interference and history...

2011-06-10 Thread Christopher Quarksnow
Also given that Galileo is subtantially delayed due to European budget constraints http://www.engadget.com/2010/10/07/eus-galileo-satnav-system-orbiting-way-past-budget-delayed-unt/ it does not seem like it can be expected to mitigate the issue for navigation purpose, aside political implications a

Re: [time-nuts] GPS interference and history...

2011-06-10 Thread Bob Camp
Hi The FCC (like most US agencies) has a mission to promote as well as regulate. The promotion side is what drives them to allocate frequencies in a way that you can reasonably produce gear. They have always come back years later and tried to change things around. Every time, the same issues get h

Re: [time-nuts] GPS interference and history...

2011-06-10 Thread ehydra
Thanks Jim! Sorry for posting on time-nuts list with time-offset +1 ;-) corrected. - Henry -- ehydra.dyndns.info Jim Lux schrieb: On 6/10/11 6:55 AM, ehydra wrote: Jim Lux schrieb: The MEO height of GPS was a deliberate choice (again, that GPSWorld series is a fascinating history of how

Re: [time-nuts] GPS interference and history...

2011-06-10 Thread William H. Fite
You folks are all far more knowledgeable than I on these issues so I have a question: To what extent, from both an engineering perspective and from the standpoint of public policy, should it be the obligation of transmitter and receiver manufacturers to design and build devices with sufficient fil

Re: [time-nuts] GPS interference and history...

2011-06-10 Thread shalimr9
The problem is that many FM receivers leak LO signal, so if 2 receivers are next to each others and set 10.7 MHz apart, one will be receiving the LO of the oter. Didier KO4BB Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless thingy while I do other things... -Original Message- From: Chuck Forsberg WA7K

Re: [time-nuts] GPS interference and history...

2011-06-10 Thread Jim Lux
On 6/10/11 6:55 AM, ehydra wrote: Jim Lux schrieb: The MEO height of GPS was a deliberate choice (again, that GPSWorld series is a fascinating history of how it came about). Don't forget that one of the original reasons for GPS was for doing midcourse correction on ICBMs. Where is this GPSWorl

Re: [time-nuts] GPS interference and history...

2011-06-10 Thread ehydra
Jim Lux schrieb: The MEO height of GPS was a deliberate choice (again, that GPSWorld series is a fascinating history of how it came about). Don't forget that one of the original reasons for GPS was for doing midcourse correction on ICBMs. Where is this GPSWorld history located? regard - He

Re: [time-nuts] GPS interference and history...

2011-06-10 Thread Jim Lux
On 6/9/11 10:36 PM, Henry Hallam wrote: On Thu, Jun 9, 2011 at 2:42 PM, Jim Lux wrote: GPS orbits are tough from a radiation standpoint too. In particular, the orbits are considerably worse for radiation than GEO, and photovoltaic panels are quite susceptible to radiation. Of course you co