Re: [time-nuts] ***SPAM*** Re: ***SPAM*** Motorola Oncore UT+ firmware upgrade backup power questions

2015-03-15 Thread Mike Cook
Le 14 mars 2015 à 19:01, Pete Stephenson p...@heypete.com a écrit : On Sat, Mar 14, 2015 at 12:56 PM, Mike Cook michael.c...@sfr.fr wrote: If true, what is the maximum current that can be safely supplied by the pin? As above, is it safe to use a non-rechargeable battery like a CR2032?

Re: [time-nuts] Motorola Oncore UT+ firmware upgrade backup power questions

2015-03-15 Thread Attila Kinali
On Sat, 14 Mar 2015 12:56:05 +0100 Mike Cook michael.c...@sfr.fr wrote: Anyway. Using a CR2032 is OK, at least with my hardware and you get backup for at least 4 years. A CR2032 is a quite huge coin cell. An NVRAM module does not use much power once Vcc goes to zero. In todays low power

Re: [time-nuts] Motorola Oncore UT+ firmware upgrade backup power questions

2015-03-15 Thread Hal Murray
att...@kinali.ch said: A CR2032 is a quite huge coin cell. An NVRAM module does not use much power once Vcc goes to zero. In todays low power modules it's in the order of 100nA max specified. You can assume it to be somewhere in the range of 10nA (probably package leakage limited) and 1uA

Re: [time-nuts] ***SPAM*** Re: ***SPAM*** Motorola Oncore UT+ firmware upgrade backup power questions

2015-03-15 Thread Bob Camp
Hi The “old almanac” issue is *very* normal for early Oncore modules. Some (possibly custom) firmware times out a stored almanac after searching for X hours (minutes?). The original firmware did not time out. You can sit there for a *long* time with a bad almanac …. The real issue is the lack

Re: [time-nuts] Motorola Oncore UT+ firmware upgrade backup power questions

2015-03-15 Thread paul swed
I agree with Atilla from what I have seen. Its actually somewhat difficult to measure this level of current. But all is not lost. Even if the unit is drawing 1-10ua because something is going wrong. Simply add a battery holder and 2 X AAA or AA or ... Whatever it takes to keep the unit going. If

Re: [time-nuts] How does NTP's local clock estimation work in detail?

2015-03-15 Thread Magnus Danielson
Hi, On 03/11/2015 10:37 PM, Tom Van Baak wrote: [5] An Algorithm to Synchronize the Time of a Computer to Universal Time, by Levine, 1995 http://tf.boulder.nist.gov/general/pdf/1064.pdf This is a nice read, but re-applying it to NTP alters the behavior of the noise sources and I question

Re: [time-nuts] Motorola Oncore UT+ firmware upgrade backup power questions

2015-03-15 Thread Chris Albertson
I have one of these UT+ receivers. Backup is not a big deal. How long will the power be off? Certainly not for days and weeks. The backup battery only has to last a few seconds or maybe an hours or two. The real problem with batteries is not how much energy they store but shelf life. You have

Re: [time-nuts] Motorola Oncore UT+ firmware upgrade backup power questions

2015-03-15 Thread Pete Stephenson
On 3/15/2015 8:46 PM, Chris Albertson wrote: I have one of these UT+ receivers. Backup is not a big deal. How long will the power be off? Certainly not for days and weeks. The backup battery only has to last a few seconds or maybe an hours or two. The real problem with batteries is not

Re: [time-nuts] Motorola Oncore UT+ firmware upgrade backup power questions

2015-03-15 Thread Attila Kinali
On Sun, 15 Mar 2015 03:27:06 -0700 Hal Murray hmur...@megapathdsl.net wrote: att...@kinali.ch said: A CR2032 is a quite huge coin cell. An NVRAM module does not use much power once Vcc goes to zero. In todays low power modules it's in the order of 100nA max specified. You can assume it to

Re: [time-nuts] Motorola Oncore UT+ firmware upgrade backup power questions

2015-03-15 Thread Attila Kinali
On Sun, 15 Mar 2015 11:05:53 -0400 paul swed paulsw...@gmail.com wrote: I agree with Atilla from what I have seen. Its actually somewhat difficult to measure this level of current. It's not that difficult. You just need a good DMM. Standard ones will not work as they have resolution limits in

Re: [time-nuts] Motorola Oncore UT+ firmware upgrade backup power questions

2015-03-15 Thread Bob Camp
Hi For a one off / home use application - enter the local “position hold” info into your code. Let the micro send it up to the Oncore ….You will be hitting the “compile” button enough times already that one more isn’t going to slow you down much. Bob On Mar 15, 2015, at 3:46 PM, Chris

Re: [time-nuts] Motorola Oncore UT+ firmware upgrade backup power questions

2015-03-15 Thread Hal Murray
csteinm...@yandex.com said: The Energizer AA and AAA lithium primary batteries (Li/FeS2) have a shelf life exceeding 10 years, Like many things, it's temperature dependent. A classic trick is to store batteries in your freezer. Aside from better shelf life, you can probably find them in

Re: [time-nuts] Motorola Oncore UT+ firmware upgrade backup power questions

2015-03-15 Thread paul swed
Atilla Nor do I expect them to last 10 years, more like 1-2 years if the units drawing the currents mentioned. Being external they are easy to change and measure. Also cheap. Only do this on boards that can't be replaced etc. Regards Paul On Sun, Mar 15, 2015 at 6:40 PM, Attila Kinali

Re: [time-nuts] Motorola Oncore UT+ firmware upgrade backup power questions

2015-03-15 Thread Charles Steinmetz
Attila wrote: A CR2032 is usually of LiMnO2 chemistry, while AA/AAA's are usually ZnMnO2. Also coin cells are optimized for long life times, with very little current drawn, while most AA/AAA are not, or not as much. Ie, i wouldn't expect an AAA cell, and much less an AA cell to last 10 years.