Re: [time-nuts] How phase stable is rg59 or alternate coax

2016-11-22 Thread David G. McGaw
Note that partial air core (9913) and foam dielectric is better than solid polyethylene. David N1HAC On 11/21/16 5:39 PM, Mark Spencer wrote: At one point I contemplated running Andrews "Heliax" for my GPS antenna. Part of the rationale was due to the data presented in page 2 of the follow

Re: [time-nuts] How phase stable is rg59 or alternate coax

2016-11-21 Thread Mark Spencer
At one point I contemplated running Andrews "Heliax" for my GPS antenna. Part of the rationale was due to the data presented in page 2 of the following paper. http://ivs.nict.go.jp/mirror/meetings/v2c_wm1/phase_stability.pdf I subsequently decided to stay with my existing run of plenum rated R

Re: [time-nuts] How phase stable is rg59 or alternate coax

2016-11-21 Thread Scott Stobbe
When I first took a look at some of the coax datasheets I couldn't find anything. I was able to find the following paper "phase stability of typical navy radio frequency coaxial cables" http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/628682.pdf I attached the table from the last page. They estimate RG59 to

Re: [time-nuts] How phase stable is rg59 or alternate coax

2016-11-21 Thread John Ackermann N8UR
Several years ago I measured the delay of about 80 feet of LMR400 feeding a GPS antenna, much of which was lying on a black shingle roof in the Georgia sun. I checked in early afternoon when the sun was beating, and in the wee hours of the morning, to get the greatest temperature delta. My re

Re: [time-nuts] How phase stable is rg59 or alternate coax

2016-11-21 Thread jimlux
On 11/21/16 6:38 AM, Scott Stobbe wrote: If you had 30 ft of rg59 outdoors seeing maybe 10 degC swings everyday, would the propagation time be stable to ps? ns? Figure it's copper, so 16 ppm/deg C. velocity factor is about 2/3, so 30 ft is about 45 nanoseconds. about 1ps/degree Really, you

Re: [time-nuts] How phase stable is rg59 or alternate coax

2016-11-21 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message , Scott Stobbe writes: >If you had 30 ft of rg59 outdoors seeing maybe 10 degC swings everyday, >would the propagation time be stable to ps? ns? ps ? No way - *ever* ns ? Probably, but it depends a lot on the exact materials and manufacturing. -- Poul-Henning Kamp

[time-nuts] How phase stable is rg59 or alternate coax

2016-11-21 Thread Scott Stobbe
If you had 30 ft of rg59 outdoors seeing maybe 10 degC swings everyday, would the propagation time be stable to ps? ns? On Sun, Nov 20, 2016 at 7:04 PM Hal Murray wrote: > > Is that even a sensible question? Is there a better way to phrase it? > > > The problem I'm trying to avoid is that the w