Re: [TLS] WGLC for "Deprecating TLSv1.0 and TLSv1.1"

2019-05-03 Thread Peter Gutmann
Kathleen Moriarty ​ writes: >MD5 is not discussed in the current version of RFC7525. I would add it, if this is guidance for general use then it should cover all the bases, if SHA-1 is a MUST NOT then MD5 is a REALLY REALLY REALLY MUST NOT. (Technically SHA-1 is still safe for ephemeral signing,

[TLS] I-D Action: draft-ietf-tls-exported-authenticator-09.txt

2019-05-03 Thread internet-drafts
A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Transport Layer Security WG of the IETF. Title : Exported Authenticators in TLS Author : Nick Sullivan Filename: draft-ietf-tls-expo

Re: [TLS] WGLC for "Deprecating TLSv1.0 and TLSv1.1"

2019-05-03 Thread Kathleen Moriarty
On Fri, May 3, 2019 at 4:09 PM Kathleen Moriarty < kathleen.moriarty.i...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Sent from my mobile device > > On May 3, 2019, at 3:56 PM, Eric Rescorla wrote: > > > > On Fri, May 3, 2019 at 10:31 AM Peter Gutmann > wrote: > >> Having said that, given an RFC saying MUST NOT 1.0

Re: [TLS] WGLC for "Deprecating TLSv1.0 and TLSv1.1"

2019-05-03 Thread Kathleen Moriarty
Sent from my mobile device > On May 3, 2019, at 3:56 PM, Eric Rescorla wrote: > > > >> On Fri, May 3, 2019 at 10:31 AM Peter Gutmann >> wrote: >> Having said that, given an RFC saying MUST NOT 1.0 and 1.1 which is what the >> original discussion was about, why not also add MUST NOT MD5 and

Re: [TLS] WGLC for "Deprecating TLSv1.0 and TLSv1.1"

2019-05-03 Thread Eric Rescorla
On Fri, May 3, 2019 at 10:31 AM Peter Gutmann wrote: > Having said that, given an RFC saying MUST NOT 1.0 and 1.1 which is what > the > original discussion was about, why not also add MUST NOT MD5 and SHA1 in > TLS > 1.2 to the text? > This seems like a reasonable proposal. -Ekr > Peter. > >

Re: [TLS] WGLC for "Deprecating TLSv1.0 and TLSv1.1"

2019-05-03 Thread Viktor Dukhovni
> On May 3, 2019, at 1:30 PM, Peter Gutmann wrote: > > Having said that, given an RFC saying MUST NOT 1.0 and 1.1 which is what the > original discussion was about, why not also add MUST NOT MD5 and SHA1 in TLS > 1.2 to the text? And perhaps MUST EtM, ... which starts to look a lot like "must TL

Re: [TLS] WGLC for "Deprecating TLSv1.0 and TLSv1.1"

2019-05-03 Thread Peter Gutmann
Benjamin Kaduk writes: >I'll make the obligatory note that SHA-2 is fine Sure, and that was the really strange thing with TLS 1.2, why not just say SHA-2 or better only, rather than adding mechanisms that were much, much weaker than its predecessors? So the simple fix is just to use SHA-2 only

Re: [TLS] WGLC for "Deprecating TLSv1.0 and TLSv1.1"

2019-05-03 Thread Benjamin Kaduk
On Fri, May 03, 2019 at 04:53:44PM +, Peter Gutmann wrote: > Hubert Kario writes: > > >And the practical research: > >https://eprint.iacr.org/2016/131.pdf > >https://www.iacr.org/archive/asiacrypt2009/59120136/59120136.pdf > >only confirms that. > > That would be the practical research that

Re: [TLS] WGLC for "Deprecating TLSv1.0 and TLSv1.1"

2019-05-03 Thread Peter Gutmann
Hubert Kario writes: >And the practical research: >https://eprint.iacr.org/2016/131.pdf >https://www.iacr.org/archive/asiacrypt2009/59120136/59120136.pdf >only confirms that. That would be the practical research that says: Due to these constraints, the practical impact of our second preimage

[TLS] Deprecated signature algorithms in RFC8446

2019-05-03 Thread Tobias Reiher
Hi, the example handshake traces for TLS 1.3 (RFC8448) seems not to fully comply to the TLS 1.3 standard (RFC8446). RFC8446 in 4.2.3. says that an implementation must not offer deprecated algorithms in the signature algorithms extension: "In TLS 1.2, the extension contained hash/signature pairs.

Re: [TLS] WGLC for "Deprecating TLSv1.0 and TLSv1.1"

2019-05-03 Thread Hubert Kario
On Friday, 3 May 2019 16:56:54 CEST Martin Rex wrote: > Hubert Kario wrote: > > We've been over this Martin, the theoretical research shows that for > > Merkle- Damgård functions, combining them doesn't increase their security > > significantly. > > You are completely misunderstanding the results

Re: [TLS] WGLC for "Deprecating TLSv1.0 and TLSv1.1"

2019-05-03 Thread Martin Rex
Hubert Kario wrote: > > We've been over this Martin, the theoretical research shows that for Merkle- > Damgård functions, combining them doesn't increase their security > significantly. You are completely misunderstanding the results. The security is greatly increased! Nobody is afraid of the

Re: [TLS] WGLC for "Deprecating TLSv1.0 and TLSv1.1"

2019-05-03 Thread Kathleen Moriarty
On Thu, May 2, 2019 at 7:51 PM Martin Thomson wrote: > Thanks Kathleen, these look like good changes. > > Nits in the proposed BCP195 section: Lose the "p" in mpost and s/off of/on/ > Thank you, Martin! > > On Fri, May 3, 2019, at 01:12, Kathleen Moriarty wrote: > > Thank you for your feedback

Re: [TLS] WGLC for "Deprecating TLSv1.0 and TLSv1.1"

2019-05-03 Thread Hubert Kario
On Wednesday, 1 May 2019 01:49:52 CEST Martin Rex wrote: > Martin Thomson wrote: > > On Sat, Apr 27, 2019, at 07:29, Viktor Dukhovni wrote: > >> The sound-bite version is: first raise the ceiling, *then* the floor. > > > > Yep. We've done the ceiling bit twice now. > > Once in 2008 when we publi