On 2015-02-04 00:02, Mirimir wrote:
On 02/03/2015 04:59 AM, Alfredo Palhares wrote:
VPN -> Tor
VPN connection to Tor == Tor connection through VPN
getting your anonymity (Tor) more privately (VPN)
easy setup; VMs not needed; firewall prudent; use PayPal for VPN
safe with Tor browser;
Zyrko
podpis
30 sty 2015 11:25 "Andrew Roffey" napisał(a):
> Squeak:
> > Hello,
> >
> > Relative newbie here, and I was wondering if someone could help me
> > with something please. I keep seeing people describing connections to
> > the Tor and is VPN connections in the following two ways:
> >
>
On 02/03/2015 04:59 AM, Alfredo Palhares wrote:
>> VPN -> Tor
>>VPN connection to Tor == Tor connection through VPN
>>getting your anonymity (Tor) more privately (VPN)
>>easy setup; VMs not needed; firewall prudent; use PayPal for VPN
>>safe with Tor browser; easy to fail with other
> VPN -> Tor
>VPN connection to Tor == Tor connection through VPN
>getting your anonymity (Tor) more privately (VPN)
>easy setup; VMs not needed; firewall prudent; use PayPal for VPN
>safe with Tor browser; easy to fail with other apps
I use VPN -> Tor if the the end point is outsi
Thanks again.
On 2/1/2015 6:09 PM, Zenaan Harkness wrote:
If you don't feel competent setting up sshd and ssh tunneling say, or
managing the security updates for your own virtual private server, or
customizing your firewall and TOR configuration so you are certain
about what's travelling through
On 02/02/2015 10:00 AM, l.m wrote:
>
> "Mirimir" wrote:
> Sorry, I wasn't clear. I meant that nobody here has made an argument
> that "VPN -> Tor" is "definitely not good". I agree that leeroy seems
> to
> favor Case 2 aka "Using a VPN to connect to Tor".
>
> Well lets try to setup an experiment.
"Mirimir" wrote:
Sorry, I wasn't clear. I meant that nobody here has made an argument
that "VPN -> Tor" is "definitely not good". I agree that leeroy seems
to
favor Case 2 aka "Using a VPN to connect to Tor".
Well lets try to setup an experiment. I'll get you started. It doesn't
require you to be
On 02/02/2015 03:06 AM, Bill Berry wrote:
>> As I recall, nobody in this thread has actually opined that "VPN -> Tor"
>> is "definitely not good". People have quoted Grugq to that effect, from
>> a 2012 presentation. But nobody here has made an argument for it.
>
> I think leeroy presented some co
As I recall, nobody in this thread has actually opined that "VPN -> Tor"
is "definitely not good". People have quoted Grugq to that effect, from
a 2012 presentation. But nobody here has made an argument for it.
I think leeroy presented some compelling reasons why in his case 1
(easier to do cor
"Joe Btfsplk" wrote:
I gather the one with "more variables in my favor" is Case 2 - Using
VPN
to connect to Tor?
That is the one (some) have said is definitely not good - yes? Still
others may have said that VPN connecting to Tor, isn't as bad as some
have indicated?
Observation: There are a
On 02/01/2015 03:46 PM, Joe Btfsplk wrote:
> On 2/1/2015 3:51 PM, l.m wrote:
>> Now I'm not saying either is better [Case 1, Tor connect to a VPN;
>> Case 2, VPN connect to Tor]
>> but I prefer the one with more variables in my favor.
>>
>> --leeroy
> Thanks. I read Case 1 & 2 - couple times (need
On 2/2/15, Joe Btfsplk wrote:
> On 2/1/2015 4:17 PM, Zenaan Harkness wrote:
>> Good luck, Zenaan
> Thanks Zenaan, for detailed reply.
> Knowing that this is only a mailing list - not a Tor or VPN wiki, your
> diagrams & scenarios further show (to me) how complex these issues are.
Indeed they are
On 2/1/2015 4:17 PM, Zenaan Harkness wrote:
Good luck, Zenaan
Thanks Zenaan, for detailed reply.
Knowing that this is only a mailing list - not a Tor or VPN wiki, your
diagrams & scenarios further show (to me) how complex these issues are.
In spite of your & some others' excellent attempts,
On 2/1/2015 3:51 PM, l.m wrote:
Now I'm not saying either is better [Case 1, Tor connect to a VPN; Case 2, VPN
connect to Tor]
but I prefer the one with more variables in my favor.
--leeroy
Thanks. I read Case 1 & 2 - couple times (need a few more).
I gather the one with "more variables in my
On 2/2/15, Joe Btfsplk wrote:
> On 2/1/2015 4:11 AM, Bill Berry wrote:
>> My take (on his take :) ) was that;
>>
>> a) trusting a VPN for security is a bad idea because no VPN operator is
>> going to go to jail for you (see HideMyAss and Sabu etc)
> More details about the reference to HideMyAss &
On 02/01/2015 05:08 AM, Paul Syverson wrote:
> On Sun, Feb 01, 2015 at 12:36:30AM -0700, Mirimir wrote:
>> On 01/31/2015 11:53 PM, Seth wrote:
>>> On Sat, 31 Jan 2015 17:47:20 -0800, Mirimir wrote:
>>
> [snip]
>>
>> that getting your anonymity more privately makes it less anonymous.
>
> Whoa! Tha
"Joe Btfsplk" wrote:
This VPN & Tor (or Tor & VPN) subject - and its discussion here has
become complex.
Maybe too complex for all but a handful of folks?
What's complex? Intelligence agencies are reportedly targeting all VPN
providers. Governments are targeting encryption of communications in
t
On 02/01/2015 05:08 AM, Paul Syverson wrote:
> On Sun, Feb 01, 2015 at 12:36:30AM -0700, Mirimir wrote:
>> On 01/31/2015 11:53 PM, Seth wrote:
>>> On Sat, 31 Jan 2015 17:47:20 -0800, Mirimir wrote:
>>
> [snip]
>>
>> that getting your anonymity more privately makes it less anonymous.
>
> Whoa! Tha
re: HideMyAss
http://www.quora.com/LulzSec/How-did-Topiary-get-busted
http://www.wilderssecurity.com/threads/hidemyass-provides-fbi-with-logs-for-lulzsec.308290/
http://blog.hidemyass.com/2011/09/23/lulzsec-fiasco/
On 01/02/15 15:21, Joe Btfsplk wrote:
On 2/1/2015 4:11 AM, Bill Berry wrote:
On 2/1/2015 4:11 AM, Bill Berry wrote:
My take (on his take :) ) was that;
a) trusting a VPN for security is a bad idea because no VPN operator is
going to go to jail for you (see HideMyAss and Sabu etc)
More details about the reference to HideMyAss & Sabu, Re: them not going
to jail for users?
On Sun, Feb 01, 2015 at 12:36:30AM -0700, Mirimir wrote:
> On 01/31/2015 11:53 PM, Seth wrote:
> > On Sat, 31 Jan 2015 17:47:20 -0800, Mirimir wrote:
>
[snip]
>
> that getting your anonymity more privately makes it less anonymous.
Whoa! That phrase blew my mind and is almost certainly the phras
On 02/01/2015 03:11 AM, Bill Berry wrote:
>
> My take (on his take :) ) was that;
>
> a) trusting a VPN for security is a bad idea because no VPN operator is
> going to go to jail for you (see HideMyAss and Sabu etc)
> b) he assumes most VPN accounts can be tied back to you; almost no-one
> is go
My take (on his take :) ) was that;
a) trusting a VPN for security is a bad idea because no VPN operator is
going to go to jail for you (see HideMyAss and Sabu etc)
b) he assumes most VPN accounts can be tied back to you; almost no-one
is going to bitcoin+tor every interaction with their VPN p
On 01/31/2015 11:53 PM, Seth wrote:
> On Sat, 31 Jan 2015 17:47:20 -0800, Mirimir wrote:
> I didn't make the claim, I just linked to it. If you want to
> challenge the claim, best take it up with the person making it.
Hey, no problem. But when I see misinformation, I say something.
> I think
On Sat, 31 Jan 2015 17:47:20 -0800, Mirimir wrote:
On 01/31/2015 11:12 AM, Patrick Schleizer wrote:
See also:
https://trac.torproject.org/projects/tor/wiki/doc/TorPlusVPN
| you -> VPN/SSH -> Tor
|
| You can route Tor through VPN/SSH services. That might prevent
| your ISP etc from seeing tha
On 01/31/2015 10:03 AM, Seth wrote:
> On Fri, 30 Jan 2015 18:25:38 -0800, Mirimir wrote:
>> How is that any worse than adversaries correlating traffic between your
>> ISP and entry guards with traffic between exit nodes and destinations?
>
> He addresses VPNs and Tor about 45 min into the talk:
>
On 01/31/2015 11:12 AM, Patrick Schleizer wrote:
> See also:
> https://trac.torproject.org/projects/tor/wiki/doc/TorPlusVPN
| you -> VPN/SSH -> Tor
|
| You can route Tor through VPN/SSH services. That might prevent
| your ISP etc from seeing that you're using Tor (VPN/SSH
| Fingerprinting below).
See also:
https://trac.torproject.org/projects/tor/wiki/doc/TorPlusVPN
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On Fri, 30 Jan 2015 18:25:38 -0800, Mirimir wrote:
How is that any worse than adversaries correlating traffic between your
ISP and entry guards with traffic between exit nodes and destinations?
He addresses VPNs and Tor about 45 min into the talk:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9XaYdCdwiWU
Re
On Fri, 30 Jan 2015 18:25:38 -0800, Mirimir wrote:
How is that any worse than adversaries correlating traffic between your
ISP and entry guards with traffic between exit nodes and destinations?
He addresses VPNs and Tor about 45 min into the talk:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9XaYdCdwiWU
Re
On 01/30/2015 10:42 PM, grarpamp wrote:
> On Fri, Jan 30, 2015 at 9:25 PM, Mirimir wrote:
>> On 01/30/2015 06:19 PM, Seth wrote:
>>> If I remember correctly it has to do with the ability to correlate VPN
>>> traffic on the last 'leg' of the connection from you to your VPN
>>> provider vs traffic o
On Fri, Jan 30, 2015 at 9:25 PM, Mirimir wrote:
> On 01/30/2015 06:19 PM, Seth wrote:
>> If I remember correctly it has to do with the ability to correlate VPN
>> traffic on the last 'leg' of the connection from you to your VPN
>> provider vs traffic on the last leg of journey from Tor exit to you
On Fri, Jan 30, 2015 at 07:15:30PM -0700, Mirimir wrote:
> On 01/30/2015 06:48 PM, grarpamp wrote:
> > On Fri, Jan 30, 2015 at 7:54 PM, Mirimir wrote:
> >> JonDoNym / JAP
> >
> > I'm seeing references to this tool pop up recently in various
> > places. Keep in mind the controversie from years ago
On 01/30/2015 06:19 PM, Seth wrote:
> On Fri, 30 Jan 2015 16:54:06 -0800, Mirimir wrote:
>> Yes, he does. But I don't get why. Maybe someone can explain.
>
> If I remember correctly it has to do with the ability to correlate VPN
> traffic on the last 'leg' of the connection from you to your VPN
>
On 01/30/2015 06:48 PM, grarpamp wrote:
> On Fri, Jan 30, 2015 at 7:54 PM, Mirimir wrote:
>> JonDoNym / JAP
>
> I'm seeing references to this tool pop up recently in various
> places. Keep in mind the controversie from years ago
> and read the label on the tin carefully. That's not to say
> it's
On Fri, Jan 30, 2015 at 7:54 PM, Mirimir wrote:
> JonDoNym / JAP
I'm seeing references to this tool pop up recently in various
places. Keep in mind the controversie from years ago
and read the label on the tin carefully. That's not to say
it's not fit for use once you understand its fitness.
http
On Fri, 30 Jan 2015 16:54:06 -0800, Mirimir wrote:
Yes, he does. But I don't get why. Maybe someone can explain.
If I remember correctly it has to do with the ability to correlate VPN
traffic on the last 'leg' of the connection from you to your VPN provider
vs traffic on the last leg of jo
On 01/30/2015 05:27 AM, Squeak wrote:
> Hi Guys,
>
> Thanks for the prompt replies, they are really helpful. The image you
> posted Bill Berry was especially illuminating, thanks!
>
> So VPN -> Tor is what I'm currently doing with Tunnelblick and TBB, but
> could somebody detail how and with whi
On 01/30/2015 12:04 PM, Seth wrote:
> On Fri, 30 Jan 2015 03:18:50 -0800, Mirimir wrote:
>
>> On 01/30/2015 03:30 AM, Bill Berry wrote:
>>> This image explains VPN + tor quite well;
>>>
>>> https://vigilantcanuck.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/vpn-tor.png
>>>
>>> IMO this setup is a pretty sensible
On Fri, 30 Jan 2015 03:18:50 -0800, Mirimir wrote:
On 01/30/2015 03:30 AM, Bill Berry wrote:
This image explains VPN + tor quite well;
https://vigilantcanuck.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/vpn-tor.png
IMO this setup is a pretty sensible idea given the recent
de-anonymisation attacks (e.g. CMU).
On Fri, Jan 30, 2015, at 12:27 PM, Squeak wrote:
> Hi Guys,
>
> Thanks for the prompt replies, they are really helpful. The image you
> posted Bill Berry was especially illuminating, thanks!
>
> So VPN -> Tor is what I'm currently doing with Tunnelblick and TBB, but
> could somebody detail how
To use Tor => VPN, you can use the Socks proxy option in your tunnel software I
believe.
To grasp the subtle difference, I imagine that every application that need to
speak to a remote server asks itself the question "Where iz Internet?'.
With the proxy, you signify to the application that In
Hi Guys,
Thanks for the prompt replies, they are really helpful. The image you
posted Bill Berry was especially illuminating, thanks!
So VPN -> Tor is what I'm currently doing with Tunnelblick and TBB, but
could somebody detail how and with which programs you would achieve Tor
-> VPN please?
On Fri, Jan 30, 2015 at 10:05:46AM +, Squeak wrote:
> Hello,
>
> Relative newbie here, and I was wondering if someone could help me with
> something please. I keep seeing people describing connections to the Tor
> and is VPN connections in the following two ways:
>
> Tor -> VPN
> VPN -> Tor
VPN + Tor may also be useful if you're on a connection where you definitely
don't want your local ISP (or perhaps someone else on/with access to the
same network) to see that you're using Tor.
In this case, the ISP may not be a BT or a Verizon, but a hotel wireless
provider, employer, starbucks et
Hi,
Here are a couple of typical use scenarios for both setups.
PC => Tor => VPN => Internet :
Gives the traditional advantages of a VPN to a Tor routed connection. Meaning
that the connection from Tor Exit Node to outside is encrypted so it adds
confidentiality to anonymity.
Also, this conf
On 01/30/2015 03:30 AM, Bill Berry wrote:
> This image explains VPN + tor quite well;
>
> https://vigilantcanuck.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/vpn-tor.png
>
> IMO this setup is a pretty sensible idea given the recent
> de-anonymisation attacks (e.g. CMU). If your Tor connection gets
> comprimised,
This image explains VPN + tor quite well;
https://vigilantcanuck.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/vpn-tor.png
IMO this setup is a pretty sensible idea given the recent
de-anonymisation attacks (e.g. CMU). If your Tor connection gets
comprimised, all the Feds have (hopefully) is your VPN IP.
The b
On 01/30/2015 03:05 AM, Squeak wrote:
> Hello,
>
> Relative newbie here, and I was wondering if someone could help me with
> something please. I keep seeing people describing connections to the Tor
> and is VPN connections in the following two ways:
>
> Tor -> VPN
> VPN -> Tor
>
> So if I fire u
Hi,
> Tor -> VPN
For this way, your real Internet requests will be made by your VPN server.
So you just expose directly your identity : given the IP the server at the
other side will see, it’s possible to back to your VPN provider, and so on to
your real identity (VPN logs, VPN auth, billing in
Squeak:
> Hello,
>
> Relative newbie here, and I was wondering if someone could help me
> with something please. I keep seeing people describing connections to
> the Tor and is VPN connections in the following two ways:
>
> Tor -> VPN
>
> VPN -> Tor
It is perhaps better described as Tor over V
Squeak:
> Hello,
>
> Relative newbie here, and I was wondering if someone could help me with
> something please. I keep seeing people describing connections to the Tor
> and is VPN connections in the following two ways:
>
> Tor -> VPN
> VPN -> Tor
>
> So if I fire up Tunnelblick, connect to my V
Hello,
Relative newbie here, and I was wondering if someone could help me with
something please. I keep seeing people describing connections to the Tor
and is VPN connections in the following two ways:
Tor -> VPN
VPN -> Tor
So if I fire up Tunnelblick, connect to my VPN provider and then open
TB
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