Re: Did we really release 8.04?

2008/7/11 Matthew Paul Thomas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > That doesn't require a script. For example, bugs targeted to > intrepid-alpha-2, sorted by number of duplicates: > Cool, didn't know that! A

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Tue, Jul 15, 2008 at 09:16:04AM +0100, Matt Zimmerman wrote: > On Mon, Jul 07, 2008 at 12:10:45PM +0300, Rakotomandimby Mihamina wrote: > > Matt Zimmerman wrote: > >> If you were unaware that this was going on, perhaps we could do a better > >> job > >> of communicating this type of effort with

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Mon, Jul 07, 2008 at 12:10:45PM +0300, Rakotomandimby Mihamina wrote: > Matt Zimmerman wrote: >> If you were unaware that this was going on, perhaps we could do a better job >> of communicating this type of effort with the public. > > I would suggest a kind of summary of bugs (and their progress

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

> > Voting could also reduce noise from "me too!" comments. (On the other > hand, there's the risk that the reduction in "me too!" comments might be > outweighed by the increase in "this bug has X votes, why hasn't it been > fixed?" comments.) > Sometimes useful information gets buried among ton

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

Hi Scott, Scott Ritchie [2008-07-07 13:59 -0700]: > It would be much nicer if it was really easy to copy your current > machine into a VM. This isn't just for generating more QA though - > having such a testbed would be an ideal way to demo an upgrade as part > of a much larger migration as well.

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Bryce Harrington wrote on 07/07/08 21:55: > > On Mon, Jul 07, 2008 at 10:52:44PM +0300, Timo Jyrinki wrote: >... >> I think the single most needed feature in Launchpad regarding this >> would be the possibility for voting, as done in bugzilla. > > I

Re: Did we really release 8.04? - users as developers

> The first step is maybe to start taking in much higher account users > contributions. My experience is that patches can stay in launchpad for > months and in those cases it is entirely up to who contributed those to > bother people until they ack a fix. I am not talking about my often > blind one

Re: Did we really release 8.04? - users as developers

Il giorno lun, 07/07/2008 alle 13.22 -0700, Bryce Harrington ha scritto: > > So I would encourage looking at ways we can help the average bug > reporter take on more of the work of troubleshooting the bugs they > find. After all, they by definition already have the necessary > equipment and envir

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

2008/7/7 Evan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > I started a discussion on the dev cycle on this list a while back > Yes, I remember that discussion. I think those ideas you had were good, it was a bit of a pity that they were not implemented into the release process. Hopefully things will change for the

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

2008/7/7 Bryce Harrington <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: >> I think the single most needed feature in Launchpad regarding this >> would be the possibility for voting, as done in bugzilla. > > I don't know if I necessarily agree with this. Voting may feel good > from a user perspective and certainly couldn't

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

Olá Oliver e a todos. On Monday 07 July 2008 12:50:19 Oliver Grawert wrote: > Am Montag, den 07.07.2008, 12:42 +0100 schrieb (``-_-´´) -- Fernando: > > * the manual way, rename the source.list hardy mentions to intrepid and do > > an apt-get dist-update; > > > you know that this is highly discou

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

Olá Markus e a todos. On Monday 07 July 2008 13:08:34 Markus Hitter wrote: > You confirm my point, thanks. I knew this myself already, but how do > you get this out to the thousands of potential beta testers? > > MarKus As I said, those you have the resources (extra PC, virtual OS, etc) and th

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

Scott Kitterman wrote: > On Monday 07 July 2008 08:50, Cory K. wrote: >> Scott Kitterman wrote: >>> I think the only path to better tested releases is higher quality test >>> releases. >> Sad fact is people don't install the alpha/betas at the same level as >> final. So more actual testing/feedback

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Mon, Jul 07, 2008 at 10:52:44PM +0300, Timo Jyrinki wrote: > 2008/7/7 Emmet Hikory <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > While we all tend to be busy much of the time, perhaps there are ways > > that we can improve the view of bugs in need of attention, or > > otherwise help understand which bugs are likely

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Tue, Jul 08, 2008 at 12:25:40AM +0900, Emmet Hikory wrote: > Scott Kitterman wrote: > Setting up an automatic install / upgrade / remove / purge tester > would be good, perhaps using piuparts or similar infrastructure, > although this requires considerable resources in terms of local > stora

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

2008/7/7 Emmet Hikory <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > While we all tend to be busy much of the time, perhaps there are ways > that we can improve the view of bugs in need of attention, or > otherwise help understand which bugs are likely to be perceived as > painful to users at release time. I think the s

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

hi, Am Montag, den 07.07.2008, 19:42 +0200 schrieb Przemysław Kulczycki: > Oliver Grawert pisze: > > hi, > > Am Montag, den 07.07.2008, 12:42 +0100 schrieb (``-_-´´) -- Fernando: > >> * the manual way, rename the source.list hardy mentions to intrepid and do > >> an apt-get dist-update; > >> > > y

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Monday 07 July 2008 14:07, Mackenzie Morgan wrote: > On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 2:01 PM, Mathias Gug <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On Mon, Jul 07, 2008 at 01:57:26PM -0400, Daniel Robitaille wrote: > >> On Mon, 07 Jul 2008, Emmet Hikory wrote: > >> > This isn't a CLI vs. GUI issue, it's that so

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Mon, 07 Jul 2008, Scott Kitterman wrote: > On Mon, 7 Jul 2008 13:57:26 -0400 Daniel Robitaille <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > >update-manager has a cli client? Never heard of it. How do you call it? > > > sudo do-release-upgrade +1 for the availability of that command -1 for it's name.

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Mon, 7 Jul 2008 13:57:26 -0400 Daniel Robitaille <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >update-manager has a cli client? Never heard of it. How do you call it? > sudo do-release-upgrade Scott K -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe a

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 2:07 PM, Mackenzie Morgan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 2:01 PM, Mathias Gug <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> On Mon, Jul 07, 2008 at 01:57:26PM -0400, Daniel Robitaille wrote: >>> On Mon, 07 Jul 2008, Emmet Hikory wrote: >>> > This isn't a CLI vs. GUI

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 2:01 PM, Mathias Gug <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Mon, Jul 07, 2008 at 01:57:26PM -0400, Daniel Robitaille wrote: >> On Mon, 07 Jul 2008, Emmet Hikory wrote: >> > This isn't a CLI vs. GUI issue, it's that some upgrade cases don't >> > work well for special reasons. So

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 1:57 PM, Daniel Robitaille <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > update-manager has a cli client? Never heard of it. How do you call it? The CLI utility is do-release-upgrade, part of the update-manager-core package. Some more details can be found in the Server Guide: https://

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Mon, Jul 07, 2008 at 01:57:26PM -0400, Daniel Robitaille wrote: > On Mon, 07 Jul 2008, Emmet Hikory wrote: > > This isn't a CLI vs. GUI issue, it's that some upgrade cases don't > > work well for special reasons. Some of these are difficult to encode > > in terms of provides, conflicts, and

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Mon, 07 Jul 2008, Emmet Hikory wrote: > This isn't a CLI vs. GUI issue, it's that some upgrade cases don't > work well for special reasons. Some of these are difficult to encode > in terms of provides, conflicts, and replaces, and some are even > impossible. Upgrade Manager (which also has

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

Oliver Grawert pisze: hi, Am Montag, den 07.07.2008, 12:42 +0100 schrieb (``-_-´´) -- Fernando: * the manual way, rename the source.list hardy mentions to intrepid and do an apt-get dist-update; you know that this is highly discouraged since it wont catch teh special cases update-manager has

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 12:48 PM, Martin Pitt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Mackenzie Morgan [2008-07-07 12:26 -0400]: >> The one thing I would like to point out regarding PA is that there >> isn't anyone in charge of sound in Ubuntu anymore. After Daniel Chen >> stepped down after Feisty, nobody el

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

Mackenzie Morgan [2008-07-07 12:26 -0400]: > The one thing I would like to point out regarding PA is that there > isn't anyone in charge of sound in Ubuntu anymore. After Daniel Chen > stepped down after Feisty, nobody else took over. Luke Yelavich is taking over audio infrastructure maintenance.

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 11:20 AM, Pär Lidén <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > 2. Be more conservative about including new software, especially when it > comes to system components affecting many programs. Of course PA is the case > where it went wrong in Hardy, but it similar things could happen in the >

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 11:43 AM, Luke L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=769112 > > NOW people realize that something is wrong with the dev cycle! > I started a discussion on the dev cycle on this list a while back https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-dev

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=769112 NOW people realize that something is wrong with the dev cycle! -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Monday 07 July 2008 09:04, Matt Zimmerman wrote: > On Mon, Jul 07, 2008 at 08:30:28AM -0400, Scott Kitterman wrote: > > This is not sustainable in the long term. Before long people will be > > saying, "Everyone know not to upgrade Ubuntu until the first point > > release". Then we don't get th

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

Scott Kitterman wrote: > I think the only path to better tested releases is higher quality test > releases. > Personally, I think it means we need to be doing a much better job of testing > and bug fixing as developers. <...> > The moral of the story is that my project had increased in complexity

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

2008/7/7 Scott Kitterman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > On Monday 07 July 2008 08:50, Cory K. wrote: > > Sad fact is people don't install the alpha/betas at the same level as > > final. So more actual testing/feedback was done after release. I can > > tell you for sure this was the case for Ubuntu Studio.

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 10:53 AM, Emmet Hikory <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Mackenzie Morgan wrote: >> Oliver Grawert wrote: >>> (``-_-´´) -- Fernando wrote: * the manual way, rename the source.list hardy mentions to intrepid and do an apt-get dist-update; >>> you know that this is h

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

Mackenzie Morgan wrote: > Oliver Grawert wrote: >> (``-_-´´) -- Fernando wrote: >>> * the manual way, rename the source.list hardy mentions to intrepid and do >>> an apt-get dist-update; >>> >> you know that this is highly discouraged since it wont catch teh special >> cases update-manager has fun

Cloned virtual test machines (was: Did we really release 8.04?)

Am 07.07.2008 um 15:12 schrieb Scott Kitterman: > There was some discussion at UDS about developing the ability to > trivially > clone a host machine into a VM so that users could easily test > their setups. You can do this already. On the host machine, set aside a spare partition for the

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On 2008/07/07 13:18 (GMT+0200) Markus Hitter apparently typed: > Yes, a lot of alpha-beta-sonstewas Releases are usually available, > but also yes, they are well hidden from the interested person. FWIW, and I know nothing I say here is likely to change anything, but I consider Launchpad a night

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 10:00 AM, Sebastian Breier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > It's not that I don't want to test the alphas, it's the fear that I > might not be able to do my work tomorrow. > And separate alpha installs just don't do the testing job. ;) This is true. I tried to dual boot Edgy wh

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 7:50 AM, Oliver Grawert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > hi, > Am Montag, den 07.07.2008, 12:42 +0100 schrieb (``-_-´´) -- Fernando: >> * the manual way, rename the source.list hardy mentions to intrepid and do >> an apt-get dist-update; >> > you know that this is highly discour

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 5:06 AM, Sebastian Breier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > The problem is that even with all the alpha/beta/rc testing available to > Ubuntu, the most tests are only done when the release is out. There's also no chance whatsoever that the subset of users that beta-test, even if

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

Am Montag, den 07.07.2008, 14:04 +0100 schrieb Matt Zimmerman: > On Mon, Jul 07, 2008 at 08:30:28AM -0400, Scott Kitterman wrote: > > This is not sustainable in the long term. Before long people will be > > saying, "Everyone know not to upgrade Ubuntu until the first point > > release". Then we

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

Hi, On Monday 07 July 2008 15:12:13 Scott Kitterman wrote: [..] > > I suspect that we may be in a similar position with Ubuntu. We need to > radically rethink testing and how test results get back into fixes. I > believe that Ubuntu has gotten more complex and we need to match our > test/fix met

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Mon, Jul 07, 2008 at 08:30:28AM -0400, Scott Kitterman wrote: > This is not sustainable in the long term. Before long people will be > saying, "Everyone know not to upgrade Ubuntu until the first point > release". Then we don't get the end user base to test until .1 and we have > to bugfix

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Monday 07 July 2008 08:50, Cory K. wrote: > Scott Kitterman wrote: > > I think the only path to better tested releases is higher quality test > > releases. > > Sad fact is people don't install the alpha/betas at the same level as > final. So more actual testing/feedback was done after release. I

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

Scott Kitterman wrote: > I think the only path to better tested releases is higher quality test > releases. Sad fact is people don't install the alpha/betas at the same level as final. So more actual testing/feedback was done after release. I can tell you for sure this was the case for Ubuntu Stu

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

On Mon, 07 Jul 2008 11:06:16 +0200 Sebastian Breier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >Am Montag, den 07.07.2008, 09:33 +0100 schrieb Matt Zimmerman: >> On Sun, Jul 06, 2008 at 03:27:46PM -0400, Scott Kitterman wrote: >> > Do we need to reconsider how we approach getting to a release? For an LTS >> > r

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

Am 07.07.2008 um 13:42 schrieb (``-_-´´) -- Fernando: > On Monday 07 July 2008 12:18:27 Markus Hitter wrote: >> Right now I tried to find downloads and/or upgrade instructions for >> the next release, but it's almost impossible to find them beginning >> at the main site. There is a menu Community

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

hi, Am Montag, den 07.07.2008, 12:42 +0100 schrieb (``-_-´´) -- Fernando: > * the manual way, rename the source.list hardy mentions to intrepid and do an > apt-get dist-update; > you know that this is highly discouraged since it wont catch teh special cases update-manager has functions for ? ci

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

Olá Markus e a todos. On Monday 07 July 2008 12:18:27 Markus Hitter wrote: > Right now I tried to find downloads and/or upgrade instructions for > the next release, but it's almost impossible to find them beginning > at the main site. There is a menu Community -> Get Involved, but no > menti

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

Am 07.07.2008 um 11:06 schrieb Sebastian Breier: > The problem is that even with all the alpha/beta/rc testing > available to > Ubuntu, the most tests are only done when the release is out. Yes, a lot of alpha-beta-sonstewas Releases are usually available, but also yes, they are well hidden

Re: Did we really release 8.04?

Am Montag, den 07.07.2008, 09:33 +0100 schrieb Matt Zimmerman: > On Sun, Jul 06, 2008 at 03:27:46PM -0400, Scott Kitterman wrote: > > Do we need to reconsider how we approach getting to a release? For an LTS > > release should we just add 2 months on the schedule? It was done > > officially for