Re: Unicode 11 Georgian uppercase vs. fonts

2018-07-28 Thread Alexey Ostrovsky via Unicode
On Sat, Jul 28, 2018 at 5:34 AM, Peter Constable wrote: > > Many Georgian scientists working with script and language are not fans > of "uppercase" font styles. > > >With all my respect, N2608R2 is right and N4712 is wrong about case in > Georgian. > Can you comment, then, on N4776, in which the

Re: Unicode 11 Georgian uppercase vs. fonts

2018-07-27 Thread Alexey Ostrovsky via Unicode
On Fri, Jul 27, 2018 at 9:11 PM, Richard Wordingham via Unicode < unicode@unicode.org> wrote: > On Fri, 27 Jul 2018 07:00:31 -0700 > Asmus Freytag via Unicode wrote: > > > To get back to Markus' original question on how to handle this for > > ICU: it seems more and more that Georgian should be

Re: Unicode 11 Georgian uppercase vs. fonts

2018-07-27 Thread Alexey Ostrovsky via Unicode
On Fri, Jul 27, 2018 at 5:04 PM, Michael Everson via Unicode < unicode@unicode.org> wrote: > > It is in present continuous tense, so, samples from 19th century are not > valid. (They are probably also not valid formally, but I have to check > those books first.) > What is “formal validity”? Those

Re: Unicode 11 Georgian uppercase vs. fonts

2018-07-27 Thread Alexey Ostrovsky via Unicode
On Fri, Jul 27, 2018 at 5:02 PM, Michael Everson via Unicode < unicode@unicode.org> wrote: > > Then how can you prove it is a case and not a stylistic variation? Let's > compare with a case of Hebrew or Arabic, for example. > Well, go ahead. Compare it. Show some example of Hebrew or Arabic that

Re: Unicode 11 Georgian uppercase vs. fonts

2018-07-27 Thread Alexey Ostrovsky via Unicode
On Fri, Jul 27, 2018 at 4:55 PM, Michael Everson via Unicode < unicode@unicode.org> wrote: > >> You have me to thank for undoing that mistake. And some other mistakes. > We all make mistakes. > > I would like to avoid personal discussions if possible. > You are addressing the author of N2608R2

Re: Unicode 11 Georgian uppercase vs. fonts

2018-07-27 Thread Alexey Ostrovsky via Unicode
On Fri, Jul 27, 2018 at 4:26 PM, Michael Everson via Unicode < unicode@unicode.org> wrote: > No, James is mistaken. Georgian is structurally casing, and *the > difference is not stylistic, but orthographic*. Other people made the argument you are making, Alex. My Georgian colleagues > and I made

Re: Unicode 11 Georgian uppercase vs. fonts

2018-07-27 Thread Alexey Ostrovsky via Unicode
On Fri, Jul 27, 2018 at 3:58 PM, Michael Everson via Unicode < unicode@unicode.org> wrote: > > It is a mistake or misinterpretation of evidence provided (modern > samples and samples from 19th c., provided in N4712 in the same context, > are of different nature, it is clear even from images) and

Re: Unicode 11 Georgian uppercase vs. fonts

2018-07-27 Thread Alexey Ostrovsky via Unicode
On Fri, Jul 27, 2018 at 3:44 PM, Michael Everson via Unicode < unicode@unicode.org> wrote: > You have me to thank for undoing that mistake. And some other mistakes. We > all make mistakes. > I would like to avoid personal discussions if possible. > > Those institutes were consulted. I met with

Re: Unicode 11 Georgian uppercase vs. fonts

2018-07-27 Thread Alexey Ostrovsky via Unicode
On Fri, Jul 27, 2018 at 3:34 PM, James Kass via Unicode wrote: > There's nothing preventing the Georgian user community to continue to > consider this a stylistic difference. Yes. The only issue here is that Unicode encoding does not reflect the actual state, but (implicitly) promotes some

Re: Unicode 11 Georgian uppercase vs. fonts

2018-07-27 Thread Alexey Ostrovsky via Unicode
It is a mistake or misinterpretation of evidence provided (modern samples and samples from 19th c., provided in N4712 in the same context, are of different nature, it is clear even from images) and §8 of the document states opposite. The criteria for presence of orthographic distinction between

Re: Unicode 11 Georgian uppercase vs. fonts

2018-07-26 Thread Alexey Ostrovsky via Unicode
Hi there! "The Georgian community understood" — sorry, but here "the Georgian community" means a small group of Georgian font designers who promote upper-case for effectively caseless Georgian. Many Georgian scientists working with script and language are not fans of "uppercase" font styles.