Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-20 Thread Michael Hennebry
On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, JD wrote: On 08/19/2010 02:15 PM, Michael Hennebry wrote: On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, JD wrote: Problem comes as Michael explains, that when a process needs a large physically contiguous chunk of memory, it might not be available. That said, usually, requests for physically

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-20 Thread Aaron Konstam
On Thu, 2010-08-19 at 16:15 -0500, Michael Hennebry wrote: On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, JD wrote: Problem comes as Michael explains, that when a process needs a large physically contiguous chunk of memory, it might not be available. That said, usually, requests for physically contiguous memory is

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-20 Thread Andrew Haley
On 08/20/2010 03:36 PM, Aaron Konstam wrote: On Thu, 2010-08-19 at 16:15 -0500, Michael Hennebry wrote: On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, JD wrote: Problem comes as Michael explains, that when a process needs a large physically contiguous chunk of memory, it might not be available. That said, usually,

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-20 Thread JD
On 08/20/2010 06:44 AM, Michael Hennebry wrote: On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, JD wrote: On 08/19/2010 02:15 PM, Michael Hennebry wrote: On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, JD wrote: Problem comes as Michael explains, that when a process needs a large physically contiguous chunk of memory, it might not be

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-20 Thread JD
On 08/20/2010 07:36 AM, Aaron Konstam wrote: On Thu, 2010-08-19 at 16:15 -0500, Michael Hennebry wrote: On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, JD wrote: Problem comes as Michael explains, that when a process needs a large physically contiguous chunk of memory, it might not be available. That said, usually,

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-20 Thread Michael Hennebry
On Fri, 20 Aug 2010, JD wrote: On 08/20/2010 06:44 AM, Michael Hennebry wrote: On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, JD wrote: On 08/19/2010 02:15 PM, Michael Hennebry wrote: On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, JD wrote: Problem comes as Michael explains, that when a process needs a large physically contiguous chunk

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-20 Thread Jussi Lehtola
On Fri, 20 Aug 2010 13:22:33 -0500 (CDT) Michael Hennebry henne...@web.cs.ndsu.nodak.edu wrote: It makes sense that if a process insists on physically contiguous memory and can't get it, the process would die, but the above code does not tell the compiler what is to be achieved. In the

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-20 Thread JB
Michael Hennebry hennebry at web.cs.ndsu.nodak.edu writes: If I remember my Kerningham-Ritchie correctly, the answer is yes, since C relies on pointer arithmetic to refer to the elements of the array. The fred and greg variables are pointers to the beginning of the corresponding memory

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-20 Thread JD
On 08/20/2010 11:22 AM, Michael Hennebry wrote: On Fri, 20 Aug 2010, JD wrote: On 08/20/2010 06:44 AM, Michael Hennebry wrote: On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, JD wrote: On 08/19/2010 02:15 PM, Michael Hennebry wrote: On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, JD wrote: Problem comes as Michael explains, that when

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-20 Thread JD
On 08/20/2010 12:00 PM, Jussi Lehtola wrote: On Fri, 20 Aug 2010 13:22:33 -0500 (CDT) Michael Hennebryhenne...@web.cs.ndsu.nodak.edu wrote: It makes sense that if a process insists on physically contiguous memory and can't get it, the process would die, but the above code does not tell the

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-19 Thread Michael Hennebry
On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, Gregory Hosler wrote: If the memory gets fragged and the kernel wants to defrag, e.g. for a memory request from an application, in order to defrag any dirty data portions (those pages that have been written to), the kernel *requires* there to be swap. Otherwise there is

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-19 Thread Patrick O'Callaghan
On Thu, 2010-08-19 at 09:22 -0500, Michael Hennebry wrote: On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, Gregory Hosler wrote: If the memory gets fragged and the kernel wants to defrag, e.g. for a memory request from an application, in order to defrag any dirty data portions (those pages that have been written

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-19 Thread Bryn M. Reeves
On 08/19/2010 03:22 PM, Michael Hennebry wrote: On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, Gregory Hosler wrote: If the memory gets fragged and the kernel wants to defrag, e.g. for a memory request from an application, in order to defrag any dirty data portions (those pages that have been written to), the

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-19 Thread James Mckenzie
Patrick O'Callaghan pocallag...@gmail.com wrote: Sent: Aug 19, 2010 7:33 AM To: users@lists.fedoraproject.org Subject: Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty On Thu, 2010-08-19 at 09:22 -0500, Michael Hennebry wrote: On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, Gregory Hosler wrote: If the memory gets fragged

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-19 Thread Tim
On Thu, 2010-08-19 at 09:22 -0500, Michael Hennebry wrote: I didn't realize that memory could get fragged. An old problem, and one reason why some other OSs *needed* occasional reboots, after a while. Even quitting all running applications, back down to just having the basic desktop, and

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-19 Thread JD
On 08/19/2010 10:46 AM, Tim wrote: On Thu, 2010-08-19 at 09:22 -0500, Michael Hennebry wrote: I didn't realize that memory could get fragged. An old problem, and one reason why some other OSs *needed* occasional reboots, after a while. Even quitting all running applications, back down to

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-19 Thread Michael Hennebry
On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, JD wrote: Problem comes as Michael explains, that when a process needs a large physically contiguous chunk of memory, it might not be available. That said, usually, requests for physically contiguous memory is only needed when wanting to map very large number of DMA pages

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-19 Thread Michael Hennebry
On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: On Thu, 2010-08-19 at 09:22 -0500, Michael Hennebry wrote: On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, Gregory Hosler wrote: If the memory gets fragged and the kernel wants to defrag, e.g. for a memory request from an application, in order to defrag any dirty data

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-19 Thread JD
On 08/19/2010 02:15 PM, Michael Hennebry wrote: On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, JD wrote: Problem comes as Michael explains, that when a process needs a large physically contiguous chunk of memory, it might not be available. That said, usually, requests for physically contiguous memory is only needed

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-19 Thread Gregory Hosler
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 08/19/2010 10:22 PM, Michael Hennebry wrote: On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, Gregory Hosler wrote: If the memory gets fragged and the kernel wants to defrag, e.g. for a memory request from an application, in order to defrag any dirty data portions

Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-18 Thread Sam Varshavchik
I'll probably have a new server with 16 gigs of RAM on the way, soon. With this amount of RAM being sufficient, do I really need a swap partition set up? I do understand that a swap partition is needed for hibernation, but this server does not need to hibernate. pgpfNvSVersCu.pgp

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-18 Thread Andras Simon
On 8/18/10, Sam Varshavchik mr...@courier-mta.com wrote: I'll probably have a new server with 16 gigs of RAM on the way, soon. With this amount of RAM being sufficient, do I really need a swap partition set up? I do understand that a swap partition is needed for hibernation, but this server

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-18 Thread Hannes Frederic Sowa
On Wed, Aug 18, 2010 at 1:00 PM, Sam Varshavchik mr...@courier-mta.com wrote: I'll probably have a new server with 16 gigs of RAM on the way, soon. With this amount of RAM being sufficient, do I really need a swap partition set up? I do understand that a swap partition is needed for

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-18 Thread JB
Sam Varshavchik mrsam at courier-mta.com writes: I'll probably have a new server with 16 gigs of RAM on the way, soon. With this amount of RAM being sufficient, do I really need a swap partition set up? I do understand that a swap partition is needed for hibernation, but this server

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-18 Thread Patrick O'Callaghan
On Wed, 2010-08-18 at 11:37 +, JB wrote: Sam Varshavchik mrsam at courier-mta.com writes: I'll probably have a new server with 16 gigs of RAM on the way, soon. With this amount of RAM being sufficient, do I really need a swap partition set up? I do understand that a swap

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-18 Thread Gordon Messmer
On 08/18/2010 04:00 AM, Sam Varshavchik wrote: With this amount of RAM being sufficient, do I really need a swap partition set up? I do understand that a swap partition is needed for hibernation, but this server does not need to hibernate. Depends on the purpose of the machine. Desktops often

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-18 Thread Andras Simon
On 8/18/10, James Mckenzie jjmckenzi...@earthlink.net wrote: Andras Simon sza...@gmail.com wrote: I'm not sure what you mean by need, but Fedora will run without a swap partition. It will, that is true, but from my UNIX training, it is always a good idea to have a swap partition, but you

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-18 Thread Mikkel
On 08/18/2010 10:55 AM, James Mckenzie wrote: Andras Simon sza...@gmail.com wrote: Sent: Aug 18, 2010 4:20 AM To: Community support for Fedora users users@lists.fedoraproject.org Subject: Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty On 8/18/10, Sam Varshavchik mr...@courier-mta.com wrote

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-18 Thread Bill Davidsen
Sam Varshavchik wrote: I'll probably have a new server with 16 gigs of RAM on the way, soon. With this amount of RAM being sufficient, do I really need a swap partition set up? I do understand that a swap partition is needed for hibernation, but this server does not need to hibernate. If

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-18 Thread Phil Meyer
On 08/18/2010 05:00 AM, Sam Varshavchik wrote: I'll probably have a new server with 16 gigs of RAM on the way, soon. With this amount of RAM being sufficient, do I really need a swap partition set up? I do understand that a swap partition is needed for hibernation, but this server does

Re: Is swap really needed when RAM's aplenty

2010-08-18 Thread Gregory Hosler
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 08/18/2010 07:00 PM, Sam Varshavchik wrote: I'll probably have a new server with 16 gigs of RAM on the way, soon. With this amount of RAM being sufficient, do I really need a swap partition set up? I do understand that a swap partition is