I didn't mean to put across that Spanish plumbers don't use metric. If I did then I apologise but I suspect Jerry (John PS)'s rage is more to do with frustration. Anyhow - I would put money on them definitely using metric - to think they won't recognize metric would be as absurd as the 'metric vinyl' debate. I was raising the question of why there were inch based pipes in spain, that's all. By the way - you are very wrong about plumbing parts in the UK - there's a real mix. Some are imperial only. However there's a lot of dual too and metric only. It's probably due to legacy creating such a requirement that they never phased it out. I know I had to buy many imperial based parts recently to fix an outside tap (US: Faucet)
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 2009 21:39:01 -0700 From: jeremiahmacgre...@rocketmail.com Subject: Re: [USMA:44595] RE: Reasoable Language (was Metrication US) To: barkatf...@hotmail.com; usma@colostate.edu Here is another one of those Stephen answers that is conjured up from make believe. Stephen wants everyone to believe that Spanish plumbers don't use metric because plumbing parts have an inch trade name. Yet, that is where it ends with Stephen.. Stephen will want all of you to believe that Spanish plumbers carry inch measuring tapes and measure all lengths in inches. He will want you to think that pipe and other products sold by length in Spanish plumbing shops can be purchased in feet or inches. They can't. Even in the UK plumbing parts are measured and priced in metric only. Stephen and everyone else will pay per metre for pipe and other components sold by length. He can ask for all the feet he wants, but it will be converted to metres, cut that way and sold that way. That is the extent of Stephen's "dual" claim. Asking for something in imperial and receiving it in metric does not constitute dual. Jerry From: Stephen Humphreys <barkatf...@hotmail.com> To: U.S. Metric Association <usma@colostate.edu> Sent: Saturday, April 11, 2009 7:58:59 PM Subject: [USMA:44595] RE: Reasoable Language (was Metrication US) A good answer - based upon fact and experience. I think the piping in Spain using inches are historical - yet I still don't know why - were Brits involved with spanish plumbing or something? You can get a mix in the UK - like length in imperial or metric X width in imperial or metric (sometimes a mix either side!!) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2009 23:27:02 -0600 Subject: [USMA:44566] RE: Reasoable Language (was Metrication US) From: apharper1...@gmail.com To: usma@colostate.edu CC: usma@colostate.edu It is too bad we don't have a US plumber or piping engineer on this list to settle this, so I will do my best. In the US, for good, bad, or otherwise, the following conventions hold for traditional pipe and tubing sizes. For pipe: The published size is based on the nominal ID. Thus, 1/2 inch pipe will have a nominal inside diameter of 0.5 inches and an outside diameter of approximately 0.75 inches This does not matter if it is iron, galvanized, copper, or plastic. It will be the ID that counts and the OD may vary. For Tubing: The published sizes are based on the OD. Therefore, 1/4 inch tubing will have an outside diameter of 0.25 inches, while the ID will depend on the wall thickness of the material, thus causing the ID measurements to vary. Conduit is yet another beast: It depends on the material and type, which relates to wall thickness. I believe the sizes are based on inside diameter. My employer is converting to metric units depending on the requirements of the customer. Since I don't deal with the piping and structural guys very much, I am not yet familiar with how the units are applied, or converted. I just know that all of our control system vendors document and deliver their control cabinets in mm. Aaron Harper On Fri, Apr 10, 2009 at 7:50 AM, Jeremiah MacGregor <jeremiahmacgre...@rocketmail.com> wrote: That depends on what you mean by inch based. Spanish plumbers as well as all others in the world (except the US) buy their pipe by metre lengths. Pipe diameters are express using inch trade names but don't measure according to the name. A half inch pipe is no where near a half inch. It is much, much bigger.. Recently the ISO establish metric names for the pipes based on a closer metric dimension. A half inch pipe has a metric designation of DN15. I have done something you hate to do and actually measured some pipe. I have some half inch (12.7 mm) electrical conduit that measures 16 mm ID, is 1 mm thick and has an 18 mm OD. I find it strange that the pipe is actually 3 mm plus larger then the imperial trade name. Care to explain why? Care also to explain why you are satisfied with the use of a name that does not reflect the real dimension? Why do you confuse trade names with actual measurements? Jerry From: Stephen Humphreys <barkatf...@hotmail.com> To: U.S. Metric Association <usma@colostate.edu> Sent: Monday, April 6, 2009 8:03:44 PM Subject: [USMA:44459] RE: Reasoable Language (was Metrication US) There's the odd exception - eg TV's. Also - isn't Spanish plumbing based on inches for some historical reason? Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2009 12:28:59 -0700 Subject: [USMA:44449] RE: Reasoable Language (was Metrication US) From: slo...@gmail.com CC: usma@colostate.edu To: usma@colostate.edu The Spanish word for inch is "pulgada." Like most words for inch, it is similar to word for "thumb," which in this case is "pulgar." Of course no Spanish-speaking country uses inches or feet. Naturally the original pulgada, pre-metrication, was not equal to 25.4 mm or the barley-based system you mention. But the word "pulgada" now refers to the 25.4 mm international inch. Similarly the word "pie" means "foot," in both the measurement and anatomy. Stephen Mangum On Sun, Apr 5, 2009 at 7:26 PM, Jeremiah MacGregor <jeremiahmacgre...@rocketmail.com> wrote: Martin, I agree that the duim is a body part that some people used it to measure things with in the past like the foot. I don't agree that it is the same as the inch. The inch was defined as three barley corns round and dry. Can you tell me the original official definition of the duim? I would suspect that it was not related to barley corns. Thus my point is, the two are not the same. No disrespect was intended. I'm sure we can find a list of units that were used in various countries that have no equivalent to English units. Jerry From: Martin Vlietstra <vliets...@btinternet.com> To: jeremiahmacgre...@rocketmail.com; U.S. Metric Association <usma@colostate.edu> Sent: Sunday, April 5, 2009 3:53:03 PM Subject: RE: [USMA:44374] RE: Reasoable Language (was Metrication US) Jerry, Two things: 1) Please do Han the courtesy of assuming that is command of Dutch is better than yours – the “.nl” at the end of his e-mail address suggests to me that Dutch is probably his mother tongue.. 2) I can vouch for the fact that the word “duim” means both “thumb” and “inch” in both Dutch and Afrikaans (I speak both languages). In English, the word “foot” can either be part of the human anatomy or it can be a unit of measure. In Dutch and in Afrikaans, both the words “voet” and “duim” are units of measure and are also parts of the human anatomy. From: owner-u...@colostate.edu [mailto:owner-u...@colostate.edu] On Behalf Of Jeremiah MacGregor Sent: 05 April 2009 14:28 To: U.S. Metric Association Subject: [USMA:44374] RE: Reasoable Language (was Metrication US ) … snip Doesn't the word "Duimstok" literally mean "thumb stick"? A thumb and an inch are not really they same thing, even if they are close. … snip Jerry From: Han Maenen < han.mae...@orange.nl> To: U.S. Metric Association <usma@colostate.edu> Sent: Sunday, April 5, 2009 5:54:11 AM Subject: [USMA:44369] RE: Reasoable Language (was Metrication US ) I agree with Bll Potts. Leave expressions like 'inch by inch' or 'not an inch' alone. Those opposed to metric would love it if we wanted to change such things. In the Netherlands a folding measuring stick is called a 'duimstok', which is 'inch stick' in English. I have a wooden duimstok or inch stick with centimetres only on it. I just avoid measuring instruments with dual units like the plague. Just west of of Dublin is the suburb Inchicore, how lunatic it would be to change that to 2.54cmcore, or Sixmilebridge near Limerick to '9.6 km-Bridge'. Of course, the distance to Sixmilebridge is always given in km on road signs: 'Sixmilebridge 10 km'. There is a small place in Ireland called Inch. And people in metric countries should never give an inch to Imperial and/or U.S. Customary in their own environment. That would be very beneficial to metrication. Han ----- Original Message ----- From: Bill Potts To: U.S. Metric Association Sent: Monday, 2009, March 30 22:30 Subject: [USMA:44234] RE: Reasonable Language (was Metrication US ) Pat and John: For years, some of us on this list have tried to be reassuring to the metrication-averse and to also counter some of the stranger statements made by the more virulent opponents of metrication. <snip> -- Stephen Share your photos with Windows Live Photos – Free. Try it Now! Surfing the web just got more rewarding. Download the New Internet Explorer 8 _________________________________________________________________ View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place – Learn more! http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/137984870/direct/01/
