Re: [whatwg] WebSocket bufferedAmount includes overhead or not

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 9:56 PM, Boris Zbarsky wrote: > On 3/30/10 10:22 AM, Jonas Sicking wrote: >> >> Making it implementation dependent is likely to lead to website >> incompatibilities. Such as: >> >> ws = new WebSocket(...); >> ws.onopen = function() { >>   ws.send(someString); >>   if (ws.bu

Re: [whatwg] WebSocket bufferedAmount includes overhead or not

On 3/30/10 10:22 AM, Jonas Sicking wrote: Making it implementation dependent is likely to lead to website incompatibilities. Such as: ws = new WebSocket(...); ws.onopen = function() { ws.send(someString); if (ws.bufferedAmount> X) { doStuff(); Can bufferedAmount not change due to d

Re: [whatwg] Workers: What can be done in a worker after call to close()?

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 5:58 PM, Drew Wilson wrote: > I'll note that the spec gives the UA an significant amount of latitude > about its behavior after close() is called: > > User agents may invoke the "kill a worker<#127b1baa1cefaebf_kill-a-worker>" > processing model on a worker at any time, e.

Re: [whatwg] Video Tag Proposal

Boris Zbarsky wrote: On 3/30/10 11:43 AM, Perry Smith wrote: Isn't the concept of a submarine patent also possible against a "patented" algorithm? Yes, but since Apple already ships other H.264 decoders it already has exposure to whatever patents could come up against it. So from their poin

Re: [whatwg] Workers: What can be done in a worker after call to close()?

I'll note that the spec gives the UA an significant amount of latitude about its behavior after close() is called: User agents may invoke the "kill a worker <#kill-a-worker>" processing model on a worker at any time, e.g. in response to user requests, in response to CPU quota management, or when a

Re: [whatwg] Video Tag Proposal

On 3/30/10 11:43 AM, Perry Smith wrote: Isn't the concept of a submarine patent also possible against a "patented" algorithm? Yes, but since Apple already ships other H.264 decoders it already has exposure to whatever patents could come up against it. So from their point of view, the margina

Re: [whatwg] location.reload() on document.open()ed documents

On 3/30/10 10:38 AM, Henri Sivonen wrote: This makes me wonder: If the two engines with the largest market share both take steps to enable document.open()ed docs to be reloaded, is the behavior needed for optimal Web compatibility? At one point, yes. I don't recall many bug reports about this

Re: [whatwg] Video Tag Proposal

On 3/30/10 9:58 AM, Eoin Kilfeather wrote: If a browser supports it in good faith, and subsequently a troll successfully introduces a patent challenge, would the consequence not be that the codec would simply be dropped with the next maintenance release of the browser? IANAL, but as I understa

Re: [whatwg] Proposal for secure key-value data stores

I certainly can't argue against a focus on JS crypto. :) What I'd like to do is eliminate what I believe will be a repeated pattern for developers in the future. It would be really nice if, in addition to having access to crypto functions, there was an area where I could stick data that would ge

[whatwg] Workers: What can be done in a worker after call to close()?

Hi! Trying to fix some bugs for Workers, I've got some questions about close() method on WorkerGlobalScope . In particular, the spec seems to imply that after calling close() inside the worker, the JS does not get terminate

Re: [whatwg] Simple Links

On Tue, 2010-03-30 at 23:44 +0200, Christoph Päper wrote: > If you think about various syntax variants of wiki systems they’ve got one > thing in common that makes them preferable to direct HTML input: easy links! > (Local ones at least, whatever that means.) The best known example is > probabl

Re: [whatwg] Web Workers feedback

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 3:09 PM, Ian Hickson wrote: > On Tue, 30 Mar 2010, Jonas Sicking wrote: >> > >> > I agree that people are less likely to depend on exceptions. The >> > problem is feature detection so that you can use the new feature >> > (sending DOM nodes) in new clients without failing i

Re: [whatwg] Web Workers feedback

On Tue, 30 Mar 2010, Jonas Sicking wrote: > > > > I agree that people are less likely to depend on exceptions. The > > problem is feature detection so that you can use the new feature > > (sending DOM nodes) in new clients without failing in old clients. > > When sending null it's easy; when rai

Re: [whatwg] Proposal for secure key-value data stores

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 2:06 PM, Nicholas Zakas wrote: > Yes, that's precisely what I'm talking about. It seems to me that this will > end up being a pretty common pattern (encrypting/decrypting data stored > locally). > > The idea behind letting the key to be defined by the developer is to allo

[whatwg] Bug in form association algorithm

The spec says "When a form-associated element has a form attribute and the ID of any of the form elements in the Document changes, then the user agent must reset the form owner of that form-associated element." However it does not seem to reset the form owner if a form element with an ID is added

[whatwg] Simple Links

If you think about various syntax variants of wiki systems they’ve got one thing in common that makes them preferable to direct HTML input: easy links! (Local ones at least, whatever that means.) The best known example is probably double square brackets as in Mediawiki, the engine that powers th

Re: [whatwg] What will not work when we do not have server ?

On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 9:50 AM, narendra sisodiya wrote: > Thanks a lot, what about server-sent, websocket ? > At the same time I am thinking for using webshare command too. > alias webshare='python -c "import SimpleHTTPServer;SimpleHTTPServer.test()"' > this command will start simple server at c

Re: [whatwg] Proposal for secure key-value data stores

Yes, that's precisely what I'm talking about. It seems to me that this will end up being a pretty common pattern (encrypting/decrypting data stored locally). The idea behind letting the key to be defined by the developer is to allow any usage that developers deem appropriate for the situation. F

Re: [whatwg] location.reload() on document.open()ed documents

On Mar 30, 2010, at 7:38 AM, Henri Sivonen wrote: The spec says about location.reload(): "Navigate the browsing context to the document's current address with replacement enabled. The source browsing context must be the browsing context being navigated." It appears that this is what WebKi

Re: [whatwg] Proposal for secure key-value data stores

Nicholas is almost certainly discussing the case where the service provider requires any data stored on a customer's computer to be encrypted, not the provider's own computers. (e.g., this could be a Yahoo! policy that data stored on Yahoo! users' computers must be encrypted). Hence they cannot en

Re: [whatwg] whatwg Digest, Vol 72, Issue 63

gt; > > http://www.nczonline.net/blog/securestore-proposal/ > > > > > > -Nicholas > > > > __ > > Commander Lock: "Damnit Morpheus, not everyone believes what you > believe!" > > M

Re: [whatwg] Proposal for secure key-value data stores

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 12:19 PM, Jeremy Orlow wrote: > Lastly, we really should not be creating new APIs that are synchronous that > involve multiple top level windows (like LocalStorage and this API you're > proposing).  It makes it very difficult to achieve isolation and parallelism > between m

Re: [whatwg] More questions about the DnD API

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 2:54 AM, Stef Epardaud wrote: > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 02:33:07AM -0700, Daniel Cheng wrote: > > But what was the rationale for preventing key events while doing > DnD? > > > >I'm not 100% sure, but I'm assume it's so that the process of dragging > and > >dro

Re: [whatwg] Proposal for secure key-value data stores

Most companies that have such policies enforce them with software that encrypts your home directory (or entire hard drive). Since most (all?) browsers store such data within a users home directory, that should be sufficient for the specific case you're mentioning. (Well, except for expiration.)

[whatwg] Proposal for secure key-value data stores

Hi everyone, In attempting to use localStorage at work, we ran into some major security issues. Primary among those are the guidelines we have in place regarding personalized user data. The short story is that personalized data cannot be stored on disk unless it's encrypted using a company-vali

Re: [whatwg] Video Tag Proposal

Isn't the concept of a submarine patent also possible against a "patented" algorithm? Perry

[whatwg] location.reload() on document.open()ed documents

The spec says about location.reload(): "Navigate the browsing context to the document's current address with replacement enabled. The source browsing context must be the browsing context being navigated." It appears that this is what WebKit and Presto do. However, for document.open()ed document

Re: [whatwg] Video Tag Proposal

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 6:58 AM, Eoin Kilfeather wrote: > Forgive my ignorance, I Am Not A Lawyer, but what are the consequences > of a submarine patent on Theora and/or Vorbis? If a browser supports > it in good faith, and subsequently a troll successfully introduces a > patent challenge, would t

Re: [whatwg] Video Tag Proposal

Eoin Kilfeather wrote: Forgive my ignorance, I Am Not A Lawyer, Neither am I.. In fact a court would surely allow a reasonable time for transition. If it's got as far as a court then it probably already cost you a significant chunk of money. Rob

Re: [whatwg] WebSocket bufferedAmount includes overhead or not

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:51 AM, Niklas Beischer wrote: > On Tue, 30 Mar 2010 09:19:33 +0300, Jonas Sicking wrote: >> >> On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 2:33 PM, Ian Hickson wrote: >>> >>> On Tue, 23 Mar 2010, Anne van Kesteren wrote: We (Opera) would prefer this too. I.e. to not impose detail

Re: [whatwg] Video Tag Proposal

Forgive my ignorance, I Am Not A Lawyer, but what are the consequences of a submarine patent on Theora and/or Vorbis? If a browser supports it in good faith, and subsequently a troll successfully introduces a patent challenge, would the consequence not be that the codec would simply be dropped with

Re: [whatwg] More questions about the DnD API

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 02:33:07AM -0700, Daniel Cheng wrote: > But what was the rationale for preventing key events while doing DnD? > >I'm not 100% sure, but I'm assume it's so that the process of dragging and >dropping doesn't trigger unrelated mouse / keyboard listeners. Unrelate

Re: [whatwg] WebSocket bufferedAmount includes overhead or not

On Tue, 30 Mar 2010 09:19:33 +0300, Jonas Sicking wrote: On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 2:33 PM, Ian Hickson wrote: On Tue, 23 Mar 2010, Anne van Kesteren wrote: We (Opera) would prefer this too. I.e. to not impose details of the protocol on the API. If we're exposing nothing from the protocol,

Re: [whatwg] More questions about the DnD API

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:58 AM, Stef Epardaud wrote: > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 01:50:45AM -0700, Daniel Cheng wrote: > > I want to do more than most file managers and let users visit > > subdirectories by pressing control while over them, so they can > continue > > the drag operat

Re: [whatwg] More questions about the DnD API

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 01:31:15AM -0700, Daniel Cheng wrote: > But then it's up to the developer to detect that the keys weren't > pressed before (implement keydown events themselves), which is less > practical. > >If you're copying the behavior of file managers, isn't it simpl

Re: [whatwg] More questions about the DnD API

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 01:50:45AM -0700, Daniel Cheng wrote: > I want to do more than most file managers and let users visit > subdirectories by pressing control while over them, so they can continue > the drag operation inside the directory (and go deeper potentially). > A sep

Re: [whatwg] Web Workers feedback

On 3/30/2010 09:54, Jonas Sicking wrote: > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 12:20 AM, Ian Hickson wrote: > >> On Mon, 29 Mar 2010, Jonas Sicking wrote: >> >> ... >>> Additionally, it's unlikely that converting to null is the fallback >>> behavior you want for downlevel clients. Likely you'd want to

Re: [whatwg] More questions about the DnD API

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:39 AM, Stef Epardaud wrote: > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 01:31:15AM -0700, Daniel Cheng wrote: > > But then it's up to the developer to detect that the keys weren't > > pressed before (implement keydown events themselves), which is less > > practical. > > > >

Re: [whatwg] More questions about the DnD API

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 12:38 AM, Stef Epardaud wrote: > On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 02:04:22PM -0700, Daniel Cheng wrote: > > I'm still trying to use the DnD for a real-world use, and keep > hitting > > problems. This is the HTML 5 draft at 7.9.4 Drag-and-drop processing > > model: >

Re: [whatwg] Web Workers feedback

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 12:20 AM, Ian Hickson wrote: > On Mon, 29 Mar 2010, Jonas Sicking wrote: >> > >> > We could throw an exception, but that would make migrating from this >> > not being supported to this being supported later a lot harder (you'd >> > have to catch exceptions and then remove t

Re: [whatwg] More questions about the DnD API

On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 02:04:22PM -0700, Daniel Cheng wrote: > I'm still trying to use the DnD for a real-world use, and keep hitting > problems. This is the HTML 5 draft at 7.9.4 Drag-and-drop processing > model: > "From this point until the end of the drag-and-drop operation,

Re: [whatwg] Web Workers feedback

On Mon, 29 Mar 2010, Jonas Sicking wrote: > > > > We could throw an exception, but that would make migrating from this > > not being supported to this being supported later a lot harder (you'd > > have to catch exceptions and then remove the nodes, rather than just > > doing null checks in the w