There are two kinds of Christianity in the world: True Christianity and
false Christianity. True Christianity is found only in the Church of Jesus
Christ of Latter-day Saints. --JWR
//
/// ZION LIST CHARTER: Please r
I recall Joseph Smith having a vision (could it be in DC 137?), where he
sees his non-baptized brother Alvin in the Celestial Kingdom. Alvin is
obviously considered a 'true Christian' even though he has not yet been
baptized.
I would imagine that this largesse by Christ would be given to others,
s
I guess the meaning of a true Christian depends on one's definition. Does
true Christian mean one who understands and accepts and acts righteously
on all the things Christ teaches to the smallest minutiae? If so, then
NONE of us are true Christians, even in the LDS Church, except Jesus
himself.
If
So, until you get your eating habit under control, you aren't following
the D&C, and this means you aren't a true Christian because you aren't
following the prophets? I definitely wouldn't be considered one under
your definition, either, since there are many things I struggle with and
do not follow
You are thinking of the short mortal term we live in. All will bow the
knee and profess Christ as Lord. The majority of them will eventually
accept Christ, and though they may not merit the Celestial Kingdom, they
still will accept the gospel someday. It is just that they will not have
the ability
Regardless, in 1836 when the revelation was given, Alvin still had not
been baptized, but was considered by God good enough to be in a vision of
the Celestial Kingdom. This tells me that the man was accepted as a
'true' Christian.
K'aya K'ama,
Gerald/gary Smithgszion1 @juno.comhttp://www
No, it isn't a straw man. It is exactly my point. Just where does a
mortal being draw the line between what is a 'true' Christian and what
isn't? Your definition keeps shifting on me. You said it was someone who
fully followed Christ and his living prophets. Yet, King Benjamin told us
that none of
>There are two kinds of Christianity in the world: True Christianity and
>false Christianity. True Christianity is found only in the Church of
Jesus
>Christ of Latter-day Saints. --JWR
That's exactly right, John. If any Latter-day Saint were to join up with
any of those false Christian churc
Unfortunately, however, many members of the Church are not true Christians,
and many members of other Churches are (which, of course, is not
unfortunate - the only unfortunate thing is that they are not in the true
Church).
Jon
John W. Redelfs wrote:
> There are two kinds of Christianity in the w
After much pondering, Jon Spencer favored us with:
Unfortunately, however, many members of the Church are not true Christians,
and many members of other Churches are (which, of course, is not
unfortunate - the only unfortunate thing is that they are not in the true
Church).
I agree that many mem
I agree with JWR in so much as a true Christian must be a baptized member
of the church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and have a testimony
given by the Holy Ghost.
Paul O
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sign Up for Juno Platinum Internet A
If someone (a) takes on the name of Christ, and (b) keeps His commandments
which he has given them, then that person IMVHO is a true Christian. They
may not have as many commandments given to them as we have, but then again
the Nephites didn't have all the commandments given to them that we have h
John, our BLT said (but without so many sideways carrots as appear in
this reply - but that's because I can't get Zion to appear in my e-mail
box and have to use this clunky reply system on Topica. Rant, rave. Oh
- where was I?):
> > I agree that many members of the Church are not true Christ
have them read and explain
the hundreds of segments that say they are wrong. but that, of course, is
the NM in me.
Jon
- Original Message -
From: "Chet" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Sunday, December 01, 2002 11:45 AM
Subject: RE: [ZION] True C
After much pondering, Jon Spencer favored us with:
If someone (a) takes on the name of Christ, and (b) keeps His commandments
which he has given them, then that person IMVHO is a true Christian.
The first thing a person must do to qualify as a true Christian is to
believe in him. Then he must
I think what John's trying to say, if I may be so presumptuous, is that the
principle is clear. It is the judgement at the individual level that we are
cautioned about. I believe my grandmother, who passed away in April at 96 to have
been one of the most Christian people I ever knew, yet she never
To add to this perspective, how many people who claim to be true Christians:
1. Visit the sick.
2. Visit people in prison.
3. When they have a feast they invite the halt, lame and the blind.
Stacy.
At 05:56 AM 12/02/2002 -0900, you wrote:
After much pondering, Jon Spencer favored us with:
If we only go by that definition, then those living up to the only light
they know and following Christ all the way to the best of their ability
cannot be considered Christians. I think I'd have a problem with
that. Can they go to the celestial kingdom? Maybe, in some cases. Can
they progre
Stacy Smith wrote:
> To add to this perspective, how many people who claim to be true
> Christians:
>
> 1. Visit the sick.
Regularly. Of course, some of them weren't sick before I arrived.
> 2. Visit people in prison.
I visit people in political office and members of the Southern Baptist
-- Stacy Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
From: Stacy Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [ZION] True Christians
Date: Sun, 01 Dec 2002 21:48:15 -0800
If we only go by that definition, then those living up to the only light
they know and followin
> I recall Joseph Smith having a vision (could it be in DC 137?), where he
> sees his non-baptized brother Alvin in the Celestial Kingdom. Alvin is
> obviously considered a 'true Christian' even though he has not yet been
> baptized.
Joseph Smith had the vision in 1836 in the Kirtland temple.
After much pondering, Stacy Smith favored us with:
If we only go by that definition, then those living up to the only light
they know and following Christ all the way to the best of their ability
cannot be considered Christians. I think I'd have a problem with
that. Can they go to the celesti
After much pondering, Stacy Smith favored us with:
To add to this perspective, how many people who claim to be true Christians:
1. Visit the sick.
2. Visit people in prison.
3. When they have a feast they invite the halt, lame and the blind.
I have met many saints who do these things. --JWR
After much pondering, Gary Smith favored us with:
Maybe someday I can become a true Christian in John's definition. Until
then, I'm glad that Christ accepts me with all the shades of gray and
excess baggage I carry with me.
You are already a true Christian by my definition. You follow Christ, o
After much pondering, Gary Smith favored us with:
If it means those who are considered at least honorable by God (DC 76),
then all heading toward the Terrestrial and Celestial are true
Christians. These are, in fact described as 'children of Christ' in a few
areas of the scriptures.
Even if they
After much pondering, Gary Smith favored us with:
So, before any of us less than perfect people try to proclaim such a
strong statement as some have given, how about defining just which one of
these definitions you are using. Otherwise, you are painting with a very
broad brush against those who Ch
After much pondering, Gary Smith favored us with:
I recall Joseph Smith having a vision (could it be in DC 137?), where he
sees his non-baptized brother Alvin in the Celestial Kingdom. Alvin is
obviously considered a 'true Christian' even though he has not yet been
baptized.
Alvin was was most c
I honestly don't know. I believe baptism is required -- this is what we are
taught. But I don't claim to know all of God's ways, just that He is just and He
is merciful. Whatever that might end up meaning. I'm also reminded not to be too
judgemental by the parable of the labourers who were hired a
Some of my best friends do these things!
Jon
John W. Redelfs wrote:
> After much pondering, Stacy Smith favored us with:
> >To add to this perspective, how many people who claim to be true
Christians:
> >
> >1. Visit the sick.
> >2. Visit people in prison.
> >3. When they have a feast they in
Gary Smith wrote:
> So, until you get your eating habit under control, you aren't following
> the D&C, and this means you aren't a true Christian because you aren't
> following the prophets? I definitely wouldn't be considered one under
> your definition, either, since there are many things I stru
After much pondering, Gary Smith favored us with:
So, until you get your eating habit under control, you aren't following
the D&C, and this means you aren't a true Christian because you aren't
following the prophets? I definitely wouldn't be considered one under
your definition, either, since ther
> Regardless, in 1836 when the revelation was given, Alvin still had not
> been baptized, but was considered by God good enough to be in a vision of
> the Celestial Kingdom. This tells me that the man was accepted as a
> 'true' Christian.
I have no idea what God condsiders a true Christian (o
--- Gary Smith ---
Regardless, in 1836 when the revelation was given, Alvin still had not
been baptized, but was considered by God good enough to be in a vision of
the Celestial Kingdom. This tells me that the man was accepted as a
'true' Christian.
--- Mark Gregson ---
Joseph Smith had the visio
At 08:37 12/5/2002 -0900, BLT scares us all:
--- Mark Gregson ---
Joseph Smith had the vision in 1836 in the Kirtland temple. In the
vision he saw his father, mother and Alvin in the celestial kingdom.
However, his father and mother were still alive when Joseph Smith had the
vision. Therefore,
After much pondering, Mark Gregson favored us with:
What do we know about being a true Christian? Not much, really, because
God has never revealed any definition for "true Christian". He has given
the requirements for entering the Celestial Kingdom, however, and if you
want that to be your de
"There can be no real and true Christianity, even with good works, unless
we are deeply and personally committed to the reality of Jesus Christ as
the Only Begotten Son of the Father, who bought us, who purchased us in
the great act of atonement."
Spencer W. Kimball, The SaviorThe Center of Our
After much pondering, Gary Smith favored us with:
You are thinking of the short mortal term we live in. All will bow the
knee and profess Christ as Lord. The majority of them will eventually
accept Christ, and though they may not merit the Celestial Kingdom, they
still will accept the gospel somed
On Thu, 05 Dec 2002 08:11:16 -0900 "John W. Redelfs"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> After much pondering, Gary Smith favored us with:
> >So, until you get your eating habit under control, you aren't
> following
> >the D&C, and this means you aren't a true Christian because you
> aren't
> >followin
At 09:49 12/5/2002 -0900, BLT wondered :
For years we referred to those outside the Church as "gentiles." Then
that word wasn't good enough, so we stated saying "nonmember." Even that
term is considered too politically incorrect. So what do we call them today?
Lost
Till the ever helpful
I look at it this way:
There are two kinds of Christians; those who have the fullness and those
who don't.
Celestial Christians = Latter-day Saints
Terrestrial Christians = Baptists, Catholics, and the rest
In this way we can believe our General Authorities when they refer to
other churches as "
Perhaps we need two different definitions: Christ-like, and Christian?
"John W. Redelfs" wrote:
> After much pondering, Mark Gregson favored us with:
> >What do we know about being a true Christian? Not much, really, because
> >God has never revealed any definition for "true Christian". He has
potential converts. :-)
"Elmer L. Fairbank" wrote:
> At 09:49 12/5/2002 -0900, BLT wondered :
>
> >For years we referred to those outside the Church as "gentiles." Then
> >that word wasn't good enough, so we stated saying "nonmember." Even that
> >term is considered too politically incorrect.
After much pondering, Paul Osborne favored us with:
I look at it this way:
There are two kinds of Christians; those who have the fullness and those
who don't.
Celestial Christians = Latter-day Saints
Terrestrial Christians = Baptists, Catholics, and the rest
In this way we can believe our Gener
Marc A. Schindler wrote:
> Perhaps we need two different definitions: Christ-like, and Christian?
Either you're being ironic (in which case, congratulations for such a
clever pun!) or you're feeling just as frustrated as I. We should avoid
labels, it is true, but we do need terms and definitio
Chet wrote:
> Marc A. Schindler wrote:
> > Perhaps we need two different definitions: Christ-like, and Christian?
>
> Either you're being ironic (in which case, congratulations for such a
> clever pun!) or you're feeling just as frustrated as I. We should avoid
> labels, it is true, but we do n
Gary Smith favored us with:
No, it isn't a straw man. It is exactly my point. Just where does a
mortal being draw the line between what is a 'true' Christian and what
isn't? Your definition keeps shifting on me. You said it was someone who
fully followed Christ and his living prophets.
Nope. Th
Gary Smith favored us with:
My definition of a 'true' Christian, is one who seeks his/her best to
follow Christ and good works (including those who have not yet learned of
Jesus or the fulness of the gospel). This is a person who listens to the
Light of Christ (or Holy Ghost for members) and seeks
Except for the fact that there are probably many Latter-day Saints who are
just as likely going terrestrial as well.
Stacy.
At 04:51 PM 12/05/2002 -0900, you wrote:
After much pondering, Paul Osborne favored us with:
I look at it this way:
There are two kinds of Christians; those who have the
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