The morale of the story is instead of spending time and money to
travel to the TC about an issue (and then get frustrated because you
can't address the group), SUBMIT A PROPOSAL. This way the subject
MUST be addressed and as the submitter you can speak at the TC meeting.
Educational item two: I disagree with using an allowance for
preaction systems (and its much higher cost) as a basis for allowing
a bell. This is not a case of saving pennies but spending dollars
(ie the Congressional model of budgeting) since the preaction is an
option likely applied in high-end homes. The bell would be a
requirement for all homes.
For what it's worth, we support having a bell but sit in the minority
corner. It is NOT for the benefit of the occupants, though. That is
well addressed by smoke detectors. The value of the bell is the hope
that an unoccupied home that has water discharge would get the
attention of the neighbor in order to reduce the amount of water
damage. IT appears that saving a few pennies is more important than
the negative PR that could result for a weekend long discharge.
The size of the system is a building code and owner issue. It does
seem silly to protect a 12 million house with a 13D system. The
biggest I've heard of was just over 200,000 sf with a creek running
through one of the rooms so the owner could fish for trout in
comfort. That sounds more like a commercial lodge but what can you say.
Roland
On Feb 22, 2008, at 11:57 AM, Mike Brown (TECH- GVL) wrote:
George;
I was at the NFPA 13D meeting before the 2007 Edition of NFPA 13
came out and I went with one purpose and that was to discuss the
questions that I get all of the time as a technical service
manager. What do I (designer or engineer) do when I have a sloped
ceiling more than 8 in. in 12 in. and what do I do it the sloped
ceiling that also has beams. Additionally what do I do (designer
or engineer) do I do when have a bunch of decorative beams creating
pockets. Is it good fire protection to put 16 residential
sprinklers in a room with beams and only calculate two sprinklers?
I was not allowed to speak because I was not a member of the
committee so I packed my bags and went home. I know that there are
a lot of opinion about everything but it was really difficult to
watch some of the members who really did not seem to know a lot
about sprinklers but were there to protect their turf. My opinion
was that put they could put in the code that there that you have to
treat it like light hazard or whatever (say calculate six
sprinklers) but give the designers and engineers some direction.
What they did was dumped it back on the sprinkler designer or his
company or the engineer and mostly the AHJ. In my opinion the
committee abdicated their responsibility. There are also some
other areas that need attention. The voted to allow dry and
Preaction systems in single family homes. I answer questions all
of the time about Preaction systems from sprinkler contractors that
do more kinds of sprinkler systems than residential. Many
residential sprinkler contractors do not know anything about
Preaction nor have they ever done a Preaction system. Some of the
people seemed to think that you could use the normal detectors in a
home spaced any way you wanted to or that you would need a
releasing panel. The reason was one of the members had a client
that had ten million dollars worth of art and was concerned about
accidental discharge. In my opinion if you have ten millions
dollars worth of art you do not need a 13D sprinkler system.
Another issue was not addressed and that is there is no limitation
on the size of a single family home. In my opinion a 44,000 square
foot home does not need a 13D system.
Another question is why do we not require and alarm on a 13D
sprinkler system. The answer was the cost. That is BS since an
electric bell is not expensive and yet they pass dry and Preaction.
Overall, I was embarrassed and somewhat ticked off at the rampant
attempts of certain parties to get the code changed to meet a
product they either made or wanted to make. But that may be had it
has always been.
All of this may be a moot point when you see the flows and
pressures that are going to be required to pass the new UL testing
requirements for residential sprinklers.
The insanity continues!
The above is my personal opinion and is not way intended to be the
opinion of my company.
Sorry that I got carried away but that is the way I feel.
Mike Brown
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