Phoenix has adopted the Uniform Plumbing Code and it basically requires a RPZ for every thing that has a FDC. It considers a fire truck a source of non-potable water. The fire department is trying to get the requirement changed but no luck so far.
Ron Fletcher Aero Automatic Sprinkler Phoenix, AZ -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of John Drucker Sent: Friday, November 14, 2008 6:35 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: Fire line FDC and Inside controls For those that have adopted the National Standard Plumbing Code (NSPC) Section 10.5 provides the requirements for protection of the potable water supply. There are however important distinctions. The 2006 NSPC requires RPZ BFP on all systems with an FDC, the 2003 NSPC requires RPZ BFP on all systems where the FDC is within 1700 ft of a non potable water source. Since the NSPC is a code and not a standard its requirements are superior to those of NFPA-13, although the NSPC does address the issue of BFP device friction loss for fire protection systems. Its also important to note that RPZ's are not permitted to be installed in pits or vaults. For those in NJ we are in the process of reverting back to the 2003 NSPC and the 1700 ft criteria. John Drucker Fire Protection Subcode Official (AHJ) Red Bank, NJ Safe Buildings Save Lives ! -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ed Kramer Sent: Friday, November 14, 2008 1:16 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: Fire line FDC and Inside controls NFPA 13 doesn't address potable water issues other than putting limits on types of antifreeze solutions that can be used (and maybe some other minor things I'm not remembering). Protecting the public water supply is the responsibility of the local water authority and they set the rules within their jurisdiction. The arrangement Jamie describes is acceptable per NFPA 13, but likely won't be acceptable to the local water authority. I agree, it would defeat the purpose of the BFP. Ed Kramer Littleton, CO > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:sprinklerforum- > [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Timothy W Goins > Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2008 10:05 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: RE: Fire line FDC and Inside controls > > This arrangement would defeat the very purpose of a backflow device. > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ed > Kramer > Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2008 4:23 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: RE: Fire line FDC and Inside controls > > > I think 13 allows the FDC to be connected to the fire line, regardless > of what devices are located inside the building. Section 8.17.2.4.4 > infers it is acceptable, but you'll still need to install a check > valve and the control valve upstream of the FDC connection point (to > satisfy > 8.17.2.4.1 > and 8.16.1.1.4). > > Ed Kramer > Littleton, CO > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > [mailto:sprinklerforum- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of > > Jamie Seidl > > Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2008 1:49 PM > > To: [email protected] > > Subject: Fire line FDC and Inside controls > > > > Forum, > > I have a situation where the fire department is requiring a post > > indicator valve and free standing FDC outside the building. We will > > also need a backflow preventer installed inside in the sprinkler > > control room. Is it permissible to install the FDC so it ties into > > the fire line prior to the backflow control valves, or would we need > > to install a separate FDC line into the building? I know > > 8.16.1.1.1.3 does not allow a shutoff valve in the line, but it > > seems contradictory with Figure A.8.16.1.1 2007 NFPA 13. 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