This may be another one of those issues that is not clearly stated but possibly 
assumed by the writers.
 I have designed many DIPA systems in MRI and Computer equipment rooms that 
only had 10 maybe 14 sprinklers on them.For whatever reason the client spec'd. 
a DIPA they expect the best possible protection and supervision we could 
provide.If you aren't going to supervise the system , you're playing Russian 
Roulette with the situation.
 Maybe like buying a Mercedes because it is a good road car and then putting 
used recap tires on it.It defeats the purpose.

Lamar Vaughn,SET


---- [email protected] wrote: 
> Exactly.
> 
> Here's another question:
> 
> 7.3.2.4.1 Sprinkler piping and fire detection devices shall be automatically 
> supervised where there are more than 20 sprinklers on the system.
> 
> -So does this is there a "non-automatic" (non-alarming) allowance for 
> supervision of piping for small PA systems or is no supervision required at 
> all? 
> 
> Craig L. Prahl, CET   
> Fire Protection Specialist
> Mechanical Department
> CH2MHILL
> Lockwood Greene
> 1500 International Drive
> Spartanburg, SC  29304-0491
> Direct - 864.599.4102
> Fax - 864.599.8439
> [email protected]
> http://www.ch2m.com 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] 
> Sent: Wednesday, June 09, 2010 2:24 PM
> To: [email protected]
> Cc: Prahl, Craig/SPB
> Subject: RE: non-supervised preaction
> 
> But that is exactly what would happen if you don't at least maintain 
> supervisory air on the system (SIPA).You could remove sections of 
> pipe,sprinkler heads,etc. and no one would know until the detection devices 
> tripped the system and you really have a problem.
>  If their problem is personel , hire someone to train them and then contract 
> a sprinkler contractor who has the required experience to inspect and 
> maintain the equipment as it should be.There are plenty of them out 
> there.Maybe not cheap,but available.
> 
> Lamar Vaughn,SET
> 
>  
> ---- [email protected] wrote: 
> > Their problem is with non-experienced personnel and contractors doing 
> > maintenance and testing and setting off the systems because they don't 
> > understand the role of the air compressors.  Yeah I know it is a bad excuse 
> > to use but that's what they said is driving them to this.
> > 
> > Even non-interlocked PA systems supervise the piping from every description 
> > I've read otherwise if a line broke you would not know it until you had a 
> > flow event, which is a bad time to find out.
> > 
> > Craig L. Prahl, CET   
> > Fire Protection Specialist
> > Mechanical Department
> > CH2MHILL
> > Lockwood Greene
> > 1500 International Drive
> > Spartanburg, SC  29304-0491
> > Direct - 864.599.4102
> > Fax - 864.599.8439
> > [email protected]
> > http://www.ch2m.com 
> > 
> > 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [email protected] 
> > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of 
> > [email protected]
> > Sent: Wednesday, June 09, 2010 1:55 PM
> > To: [email protected]
> > Subject: Re: non-supervised preaction
> > 
> > Craig,
> >  Does this client have a problem with air compressors? I guess if you don't 
> > want to maintain supervisory air on the system then you could eliminate the 
> > air compressor. But that would be a noncompliant way of doing the 
> > system.This would then be a non-interlocked system no better than a simple 
> > dry pipe system.But then again,a dry pipe system requires an air supply.So 
> > see my original question.
> > 
> > Lamar Vaughn,SET
> > 
> >  
> > ---- [email protected] wrote: 
> > > Can someone provide commentary on the wording relating to "...air that 
> > > might not be under pressure..."?
> > > 
> > > The client wishes to eliminate air compressors based on this wording.
> > > 
> > > 
> > > NFPA 13, 2010
> > > 3.4.9* Preaction Sprinkler System. A sprinkler system employing automatic 
> > > sprinklers
> > > that are attached to a piping system that contains air that might or 
> > > might not be under
> > > pressure, with a supplemental detection system installed in the same 
> > > areas as the sprinklers
> > > 
> > > Craig L. Prahl, CET   
> > > Fire Protection Specialist
> > > Mechanical Department
> > > CH2MHILL
> > > Lockwood Greene
> > > 1500 International Drive
> > > Spartanburg, SC  29304-0491
> > > Direct - 864.599.4102
> > > Fax - 864.599.8439
> > > [email protected]
> > > http://www.ch2m.com 
> > >
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