Anything of note for rigid drops to drop ceilings with ceiling tiles?
Kevin Law, PE Sr. Fire Protection Engineer HVAC/Fire Protection, M&PE Bechtel National - WTP Project Ph. 509-371-3280 Cell 509-531-5715 -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Chris Mak Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2011 6:10 PM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: supporting/bracing long drops Sorry - have been very busy and have not had time to read the posts, so if my comments are out of kilter.... We have had two major earthquakes in the city of Christchurch, last September and in late February. A report on the New Zealand's efficacy of sprinkler system seismic design standards will be published in the near future by our Fire Protection Association. One of the things that has become apparent is that on some sites, that hard piped drops to fixed ceilings did not perform well - the ceilings damaged/sheared the heads off. However, on the same sites, where flexible droppers were used, no issues were noted. Trust this helps Regards Chris Mak | Aon New Zealand Sprinkler Certification Manager Level 1, 4 Fred Thomas Drive,;PO Box33-1240 Takapuna t: +6494869761 | f: +6494860112 | m: +64274344058 e: [email protected] Please consider the environment before printing this email. -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Todd Williams Sent: Thursday, 17 March 2011 11:17 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: supporting/bracing long drops I'm not going to get into the seismic debate with the clouds. That's for the Building inspector and the building owners. I'm just going to deal with this as an existing condition. (I believe that the last major earthquake in NE was 1755 off the MA coast. Although there was one off Newfoundland in 1929 that caused a tsunami along the New England coast). I figure I need to keep the drop fairly rigid to maintain the integrity of the system. The Flexheads should be able to compensate for any movement. At 04:49 PM 3/16/2011, you wrote: >I don't think you need to support your drop horizontally but being from >the shaky side of the country I would. But then the ceiling could not >be as described. So if you were here, the ceiling would need to be >seismically joined to the structure. The clouds would need to be >seismically one with the structure. The system would also be >seismically joined to the structure so the building, system and ceiling >would move together. All very Zen. The flex would be rigid to the cloud >and absorb any stray accelerations of the drop itself, or the drop >could be rigid to the cloud making all one. The concept is to keep all >the parts moving in the same direction at the same time. You have >problems when you cloud is still moving south (given your description >this is the most lagging element in a seismic shift) when everything >else has reversed and is moving north. > >On Wed, Mar 16, 2011 at 1:31 PM, Todd Williams <[email protected]> wrote: >> I looked at a building today with 4 10ft x 10ft ceiling clouds that need to have protection underneath. Three of them are at 12' and one at 10'. The clouds are suspended from above on wires and are not rigid. The suspended ceiling in the room is 22'. >> >> Given the geometry of the space, the only realistic way to get protection under the clouds is to drop a line from the system above the suspended ceiling at 22 ft. What I would like to do is to run 4 drops down through the ceiling to a point about 1 ft above the clouds and connect to sprinklers using 2 ft Flexheads. The drop length will be 10' to 12' (figuring 1 ft above the ceiling. My question is how to support the drop. My thought is an arm-over from the main to the drop with a hanger 6" from the elbow. In addition, attach a horizontal brace from the drop to a structural member above the ceiling. >> >> Any thoughts or experience? >> >> Todd G. Williams, PE >> Fire Protection Design/Consulting >> Stonington, CT >> 860.535.2080 >> www.fpdc.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum >> >> For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] >> >> To Unsubscribe, send an email >> to:[email protected] >> (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) >> > > > >-- >Ron Greenman >Instructor >Fire Protection Engineering Technology >Bates Technical College >1101 So. Yakima Ave. >Tacoma, WA 98405 > >[email protected] > >http://www.bates.ctc.edu/fireprotection/ > >253.680.7346 >253.576.9700 (cell) > >Member: >ASEE, SFPE, ASCET, NFPA, AFSA, NFSA, AFAA, NIBS, WSAFM, WFC > >They are happy men whose natures sort with their vocations. -Francis >Bacon, essayist, philosopher, and statesman (1561-1626) >_______________________________________________ >Sprinklerforum mailing list >[email protected] >http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > >For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > >To Unsubscribe, send an email >to:[email protected] >(Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) Todd G. Williams, PE Fire Protection Design/Consulting Stonington, CT 860.535.2080 www.fpdc.com _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) This communication (and any attachments) is directed in confidence to the addressee(s) listed above, and may not otherwise be distributed, copied or used. The contents of this communication may also be subject to privilege, and all rights to that privilege are expressly claimed and not waived. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us by reply e-mail or by telephone and delete this communication (and any attachments) without making a copy. Before opening or using attachments, you should check them for viruses and defects. 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