Exactly, we do 38F coolers with ESFR's. Never had a ..., I better not say that might jinx it. Ron F
-----Original Message----- From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of John Denhardt Sent: Friday, June 27, 2014 11:49 AM To: <sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org> Subject: Re: Cooler Calc If the area is not subject to freezing, no need for dry sprinklers. NFPA 13 only requires dry sprinklers or other method when the area is subject to freezing AND can not be readily maintained above 40 degrees F. The above is my personal opinion ..... John Fire sprinklers save lives Sent from my iPad On Jun 27, 2014, at 11:42 AM, "Bob" <b...@firebyknight.com> wrote: > Ron, > The temperature is maintained at 38F. The sprinklers used were EC OH > SR dry sprinklers. > > Thank You, > > Bob Knight, CET III > 208-318-3057 > www.Firebyknight.com > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Sprinklerforum > [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] > On Behalf Of rfletc...@aerofire.com > Sent: Friday, June 27, 2014 12:37 PM > To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > Subject: RE: Cooler Calc > > A couple questions. If it is a cooler why do you need dry pendent > heads? And if it has to be dry heads and they are on a wet system the > RA could still be reduced couldn't it? > > Ron F > > -----Original Message----- > From: Sprinklerforum > [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] > On Behalf Of Bob > Sent: Friday, June 27, 2014 11:29 AM > To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > Subject: RE: Cooler Calc > > Ron, > Yes this is a remodel adding only the cooler. The existing ceiling > demand was well above the .2 need in the cooler. > > Thank You, > > Bob Knight, CET III > 208-318-3057 > www.Firebyknight.com > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Sprinklerforum > [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] > On Behalf Of rongreenman . > Sent: Friday, June 27, 2014 12:11 PM > To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > Subject: Re: Cooler Calc > > If the job is just the cooler then I think all the heads is sufficient > within the perimeter of the cooler. If it's a part of the larger job > you need to calc all the possible design areas. Not knowing the layout > I can't say but maybe the ceiling somewhere is a design area, the > cooler is potentially a design area, etc. But he's nuts if he thinks > you need to add other sprinklers not in the fire area to make the fire area > be 1500 sqft. > Real is real. Math is math. Often the twin don't meet. > > > On Fri, Jun 27, 2014 at 11:03 AM, Mike Hill <mi...@phoenixfp.net> wrote: > >> I don't suppose that you are lucky enough to have a fire rated cooler. >> >> Common sense would say that you calculate the cooler. >> >> Common practice would say calculate the cooler and/or a 1500 sq. ft. >> area outside of the cooler. >> >> Mike Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Sprinklerforum [mailto: >> sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] >> On Behalf Of Bob >> Sent: Friday, June 27, 2014 1:47 PM >> To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org >> Subject: RE: Cooler Calc >> >> His stand is that I have one of three options that I have not used: >> (1) Density/area curves of Figure 11.2.3.1.1 in accordance with the >> density/area method of 11.2.3.2 >> (2) The room that creates the greatest demand in accordance with the >> room design method of 11.2.3.3 >> (3) Special design areas in accordance with 11.2.3.4 >> >> Keep in mind that this is a jurisdiction that has told me in the past >> that you can't use the exceptions in 13 (this was before they became >> part of the body), and that they can't use common sense. >> >> >> >> Thank You, >> >> Bob Knight, CET III >> 208-318-3057 >> www.Firebyknight.com >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Sprinklerforum [mailto: >> sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] >> On Behalf Of Tim Stone >> Sent: Friday, June 27, 2014 11:41 AM >> To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org >> Subject: RE: Cooler Calc >> >> The Cooler is a closed in room with a space above. You calculate all >> the heads inside the cooler if less than 1500 SF. If the area outside >> the cooler is fully sprinklered then you probably have performed >> calcs already. I'd ask the AHJ to review NFPA 13. >> >> Regards, >> G. Tim Stone >> >> G. Tim Stone Consulting, LLC >> NICET Level III Engineering Technician Fire Protection Sprinkler >> Design and Consulting Services >> >> 117 Old Stage Rd. - Essex Jct., VT. 05452 >> CELL: (802) 373-0638 TEL: (802) 434-2968 Fax: (802) 434-4343 >> tston...@comcast.net >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Sprinklerforum [mailto: >> sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] >> On Behalf Of Bob >> Sent: Friday, June 27, 2014 1:12 PM >> To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org >> Subject: Cooler Calc >> >> I have a 1,392 sf cooler. I calc'ed the entire area of the cooler >> and submitted. The AHJ is telling me that I need to calc additional >> sprinklers at the ceiling to have a 1500 sf design area. I don't >> think I need to do this, I was looking at this as a separate fire >> area, and I don't see it being much different than not adding heads >> below ducts or other large obstructions. Do I need to calc >> additional sprinklers at the ceiling for this application? >> >> Thank You, >> >> Bob Knight, CET III >> 208-318-3057 >> www.Firebyknight.com >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org >> >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprink >> l >> er.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org >> >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprink >> l >> er.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org >> >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprink >> l >> er.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org >> >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprink >> l >> er.org >> > > > > -- > Ron Greenman > Instructor > Fire Protection Engineering Technology Bates Technical College > 1101 So. Yakima Ave. > Tacoma, WA 98405 > > rgreen...@bates.ctc.edu > > http://www.bates.ctc.edu/fireprotection/ > > 253.680.7346 > 253.576.9700 (cell) > > Member: > ASEE, SFPE, ASCET, NFPA, AFSA, NFSA, AFAA, NIBS, WSAFM, WFC, WFSC > > They are happy men whose natures sort with their vocations. -Francis > Bacon, essayist, philosopher, and statesman (1561-1626) > > A problem well stated is a problem half solved. -Charles F. Kettering, > inventor and engineer (1876-1958) > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl > er.org > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl > er.org _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl > er.org > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl > er.org _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
