All elevators have pits. Most have shafts. Fire heat fuses the sprinkler when it banks down from the elevator car's floor. Otherwise the heat goes up the shaft.
On Fri, Feb 25, 2022 at 12:32 PM Ed Kramer via Sprinklerforum < sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org> wrote: > Speculation only, but maybe an "enclosed shaft" (in this context) is one > in which debris originating from outside the shaft is unlikely to collect > at the bottom of the shaft. Conversely, a shaft that is not enclosed can > collect debris originating from outside the shaft. Or not. > Ed Kramer > > -----Original Message----- > From: Sprinklerforum <sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org> On > Behalf Of AKS-Gmail-IMAP via Sprinklerforum > Sent: Friday, February 25, 2022 11:21 AM > To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > Cc: AKS-Gmail-IMAP <aksei...@gmail.com> > Subject: Re: Sprinkler in elevator pit. > > Wire cage elevators in industrial settings are often unenclosed. The > original question, “What constitutes an “enclosed” shaft?”, I think is a > question asking, “Is not a shaft enclosed by definition?”. That makes sense > to me. In certain circumstances building codes require a shaft of specific > wall construction properties to enclose “openings between floors”. That > shaft is enclosed by definition. Penetrations through the shaft wall would > have certain properties, but an unenclosed shaft would not be possible. A > lift between floors has to go through an opening between floors, the > hoist-way, so it winds up getting shafted in typical circumstances. > Remember that the next time you ride an elevator. Now the fire sprinkler > standard comes along wanting to write some rules. Perhaps the sprinkler > standard writers decided to say what they wanted to say without using the > elevator code words and the building code words that better define the > situation. > > > On Feb 25, 2022, at 8:59 AM, Ken Wagoner via Sprinklerforum < > sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org> wrote: > > > > Todd, and Matt, > > > > Speculating here. > > > > Some time ago I stayed in a hotel which had a huge multi-story atrium, > and along two of the four walls were elevators. Both elevator "shafts" > were open to the atrium for the length of travel, save for the pit at the > bottom. > > > > That might be a shaft which is regarded as not being "enclosed." Just my > thoughts. > > > > sincerely, > > *Ken Wagoner, SET* > > *Parsley Consulting > > 500 West Mechanic Street > > Harrisonville, Missouri 64701-2235* > > *Phone: (760) 745-6181 * > > *Visit the website > > <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fwww.parsleyconsult > > ing.com%2f&c=E,1,Y5zKJKPEh1mBEBqSR-VE9cUKl5y-eyP8BpvmE_5j9ZqW2eJbNphYz > > rCMBZ-2YuX6d-RRkHI4gQ1FV-cvOeCfRC58uZS9NiToZv2mx7909oCqLvCW_n5hDHeK&ty > > po=1>* On 2/24/2022 9:14 PM, Matt Grise via Sprinklerforum wrote: > >> Todd, > >> > >> Your question makes me think that you have run across something > unusual... > >> > >> Have you encountered a "non- enclosed" shaft? > >> > >> Matt Grise > >> Alliance Fire Protection > >> 130 w 9th Ave > >> North Kansas City, MO > >> 913.526.7443 > >> > >> sent from mobile device > >> > >> > >> > >> -------- Original message -------- > >> From: Fpdcdesign via > >> Sprinklerforum<sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org> > >> Date: 2/24/22 9:03 PM (GMT-06:00) > >> To: Sprinklerforum<sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org> > >> Cc: Fpdcdesign<fpdcdes...@gmail.com> > >> Subject: Sprinkler in elevator pit. > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> NFPA 13 (2013) section 8.15.5.2 says that sprinklers may be omitted > in elevator pits for “enclosed, non-combustible…” elevator shafts. What > constitutes an “enclosed” shaft? > >> > >> > >> > >> Todd G Williams, PE > >> Fire Protection Design/Consulting > >> > >> Stonington, CT > >> > >> 860-535-2080 (tel:860-535-2080) (ofc) > >> > >> 860-554-7054 (tel:860-554-7054) (fax) > >> > >> 860-608-4559 (tel:860-608-4559) (cell) > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Sprinklerforum mailing list > >> Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > >> https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2flists.firesprinkle > >> r.org%2flistinfo.cgi%2fsprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org&c=E,1,ExS8p1y > >> 0Hr1gez_4FheG_PCYrYK5u7gB3u2dXqKeFW0ElN5FapcOv2AUonWa20Nzx11YndVwKfEQ > >> 3bNXV2NYUcMqO0PubiOKaEuqw3sYI-Y4eg6Kww,,&typo=1 > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Sprinklerforum mailing list > >> Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprink > >> ler.org > > > > > > -- > > This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. > > https://www.avg.com > > _______________________________________________ > > Sprinklerforum mailing list > > Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl > > er.org > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org > _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
