Hi All! Just a couple of quick thoughts in response to the thoughtful post about petroleum prices and the future.
Cited was the cost of home heating. That's just the tip of the iceberg. Petroleum price is reflected in just about any product that makes its way to you. Transportation costs are reflected in goods and services, some power plants still burn diesel, believe it or not, it think but don't hold me to it, petroleum is used to make plastic and a plethora of other things you wouldn't think of. So what can St Paul do? St. Paul doesn't exist in a vacuum either. The infrastructure for wide-area district heat is unworkable, and the supply of stuff they use is hardly enough for them already. Biosphere? St. Paul leads the way? Humor understood. Point is, this is a national issue that St Paul will be part of, but we are too puny to do anything but continue the common sense energy saving programs already in place since the '70s. Frankly, it's not really a St Paul issue. We are at the mercy of larger forces. One last thought. Some very persuasive arguments are being made thate nvironmental regulations and the blocking of opening up domestic sources is a huge driver of energy dependence and cost. Sorry not to provide a link, but the San Fran Chronical, that bastion of Conservatism, recently ran a story to that effect. Cheers! PK Wearing a Martha Steward fashion accessory within 200 feet of my home in Falcon Heights -- Paul Kuettel See my site! www.kuettels.com Read my blog! www.wogsblog.com > Send Stpaul mailing list submissions to > stpaul@mnforum.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/stpaul > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > You can reach the person managing the list at > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Stpaul digest..." > > > ------------------------------------------------- > Please - Take the St. Paul Job Shadow Survey > Just 15 Questions: > http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.asp?u=70658501784 > ------------------------------------------------- > > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. The Future of St. Paul (Mike Schoenberg) > 2. Re: Republican Mayor (David Shove) > 3. Meet and Greet Tom Goldstein, DFL School Board Candidate, > TONIGHT! (Jane Prince) > 4. Re: Republican Mayor ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) > 5. Re: The Future of St. Paul ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) > 6. Re: Parks & Recreation - Youth Sports (Tim Erickson) > 7. RE: Parks & Recreation - Youth Sports (Paul Gleeson) > 8. RE: Parks & Recreation - Youth Sports (Tim Erickson) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2005 13:03:41 -0500 > From: Mike Schoenberg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: [StPaul] The Future of St. Paul > To: stpaul@mnforum.org > Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > Has anybody noticed the gasoline prices lately? There rising. But they > don't rise in a vacuum. They rise somewhat in tandem with other fuel > prices, such as fuel used for home heating. This means higher cost for > heating our homes in St. Paul. We probably don't have short term > alternatives. But in the 5- to 10- year range, when petroleum production > maxes out worldwide, today's prices of heating our homes and fueling our > cars will seem like chicken feed. So, other than being like Chicken > Little and bemoan that the sky is falling, what do you as other St. Paul > forum members, think that St. Paul should do to keep our community an > affordable and livable place? > > Possible options could include the development of district heating on an > area-wide basis, modus operendi yet to be determined. It could start to > include city-wide education about redevelopment of high efficiency > neigborhoods. Perhaps, to borrow from science fiction, we could dome our > city and create a sustainable microclimate. Whatever it is, will > probably involve a change as significant as going from a horse-and-buggy > economy to an automobile dominated economy. > > I'd like to hear the thoughts of forum members. I'd particularly like to > hear from people claiming to have the ears of mayoral candidates. > > Whereas we can take the dystopic view of the Chicken Littles of the > world or the utopian views of some currrent day political and judicial > theorist, the solution will probably end up as a muddle: we'll make it > somehow in a tolerable fashion. It won't be great but it won't be terrible. > > Mike Schoenberg > MacGroveland > > P.S. Dann Dobson: I've tried to send you e-mail twice using the address > you use to post on the forum. My message have bounced twice. Please > check the e-mail address you use on the Forum > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2005 14:59:20 -0500 (CDT) > From: David Shove <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Re: [StPaul] Republican Mayor > To: Eric Mitchell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Cc: "Arno A. Karner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "St. Paul Issues Forum" > <stpaul@mnforum.org> > Message-ID: > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > > Partisan (no runoff) elections are hostile to third parties. > > 2/3 of the people poll as being in favor of third parties running. > > If you want to feel even more at the mercy of permanent hacks, help the > big parties squash the small parties with partisan local elections. > > We should return to making state Legislative races non-partisan. Let's > open the system up, not close it down, > > -David Shove > Roseville > > > > > On Mon, 18 Apr 2005, Eric Mitchell wrote: > > > > > > > --- "Arno A. Karner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > 3) Of course the democrats have to eat their young, > > > there are no > > > republicans to eat, after the democrats stack the > > > non partisan ballot, > > > all thats left after the primary is democrats. > > > > > > > There may be something to what you said here. > > If we dropped the charade that these are non-partisan > > races and re-structured them to be partisan races, it > > would make things easier for the parties. > > > > No more DFLer vs DFLer on the November ballot. One > > DFLer, one Republican and maybe a Green and > > Independence candidate as well. > > This being a DFL town, may not change the party of the > > office holder in the end, but it may change the > > internal adverse effects of campaigning among DFLers. > > > > In Pittsburgh, the race for Mayor is partisan. The > > Party endorses in March, the primary is mid-May. > > Pittsburgh is more of a Democratic town than St Paul > > (though more conservative), since they haven't elected > > a Republican since 1939, the Mayoral race is pretty > > much over by mid-May. All that's left to do is spend > > the next six months bringing back the Democrats who > > were supporting other Dems. > > > > Our primary date giving us about six weeks to try to > > reconcile, after six strong months of campaigning, you > > can imagine some feelings are still strong. Being > > non-partisan, the divide among DFLers can lead > > straight into the general and the winning > > administration. It also leads to the image that the > > DFL goes after its own, technically we do because the > > opposition is very likely to be another DFler. > > > > Of course partisan elections will definitly cut down > > on the choice of candidates, but we'll have more > > unified parties and we all can be nice. Probably not. > > > > Eric Mitchell > > Payne Phalen > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > Do you Yahoo!? > > Plan great trips with Yahoo! Travel: Now over 17,000 guides! > > http://travel.yahoo.com/p-travelguide > > ------------------------------------------------- > > JOIN the St. Paul Issues Forum TODAY: > > http://www.e-democracy.org/stpaul/ > > ------------------------------------------------- > > POST MESSAGES HERE: stpaul@mnforum.org > > > > To subscribe, modify subscription, or get your password - visit: > > http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/stpaul > > > > Archive Address: > > http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/private/stpaul/ > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2005 16:26:22 -0500 > From: "Jane Prince" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: [StPaul] Meet and Greet Tom Goldstein, DFL School Board > Candidate, TONIGHT! > To: <stpaul@mnforum.org> > Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > > SPIF, > > I'm hosting a meet 'n' greet for Tom Goldstein tonight (Monday, April > 18) at my house, 1004 Burns Ave., in the Mounds Park neighborhood, from > 6-7:30 p.m. The focus is on the DFL endorsing process, but even if > you're not a delegate, you're invited to come and meet Tom. > > We're just 5 minutes from City Hall. It's a lovely night to stop in > and meet Tom, and then take a stroll in Mounds Park or through the > gorgeous new Bruce Vento Nature Sanctuary below the bluff! > > If you have questions, call me at 651/308-4984, > > Jane Prince > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2005 22:34:20 EDT > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: [StPaul] Republican Mayor > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], stpaul@mnforum.org > Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > > In a message dated 4/18/05 7:27:45 AM Pacific Daylight Time, > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > > > Even if the unknowns are GOPers, they're still coming > > up short. > > I know for a fact that Charlie McCarty (1970 - 1974) ran as a true > independent. > If he had any leanings, it probably was DFL...but he was one of those citizen > watchdogs that got enough public support because he was going to clean up > government. He was known as "Super Mayor" for having one of those devices in > his > car that could change traffic lights as he chased fire engines and cops to > the scene of the crime. Unfortunately, he was outsider enough that the > political machine worked itself against him. > > I am forever grateful to him for having the "Open Air" concerts at St. Paul's > Midway stadium where I got to see Elton John live for the first time, who was > then, the piano man for blues singer Long John Baldry. The band...It's A > Beautiful Day was a highlight. > > Those were great events in my St. Paul history. Thank You, Charlie. > > Myke P. Golben > Battle Creek > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2005 23:33:14 EDT > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: [StPaul] The Future of St. Paul > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], stpaul@mnforum.org > Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > > In a message dated 4/18/05 11:03:57 AM Pacific Daylight Time, > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > > > It won't be great but it won't be terrible. > > Money wise, the overall future looks bleak to me, for alot of us. > Gas prices are going to continue to kill us. And I don't see government > circumventing the impending disaster coming ahead, Chicken Little. > > Frankly, I don't know who these people are who can afford $400,000 condo's on > Lake Calhoun. It ain't me and it never will be. > > Those of us of the baby boomers, who had parents that went through the Great > Depression and saw them make use of every damn little thing, never throwing > out any kind of food, and saying to ourselves "we won't live like > that"....may > just have to do just that in the end. That is, learning to simplify and make > do with less than before. Just so we can pay for increasing prices on food > and > gas and health care. It means maybe living with VHS and never upgrading to DV > D. Once, in 1978, I bought a brand new car, right off the lot. I doubt I > will ever do that in my life again. Making do with second hand cars is what > I'm > about these days. > > I compare what I pay for gasoline today to 20 years ago. And what I paid for > Health Care 20 years ago (which was zilch practically) to today. I mean, > both my boys were born "free". I make more dollars per hour today than ever, > but > my buying power was greater 20 years ago. I did much better then. And it > ain't reverting backwards. I don't think so. > > Perhaps it is meant to be? History's lesson to us being a humbling one. > That maybe, like all great societies, we were given it all and somehow, we > still > weren't happy with it. Always wanting more. We became blind to the fact > that > there was no true assurance of it staying around. > I take for granted the water out of my faucet is clean and drinkable. I > expect it to stay that way. > > The paper today said almost 11 million children from birth to age 5 die each > year in third world countries. 11 million. And I am immuned to that. I > can't fathom that figure to make real. And...those deaths are preventable. > Innocent sufferings. > I should be grateful that my life is better than that. But their world is > somewhere over there away and doesn't affect my immediate. I'm more > concerned > about where to find gas for $1.99 when it's been $2.35. And envy those who > can > live in walking distance to Calhoun Square. > > Myke P. Golben > Battle Creek > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2005 22:43:03 -0500 > From: Tim Erickson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Re: [StPaul] Parks & Recreation - Youth Sports > To: "St. Paul Issues Forum" <stpaul@mnforum.org> > Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" > > Anyone else to care their thoughts on the youth sports program in the city? > > Have they worked for you or NOT? > > Below, you'll find the message I posted over the weekend. > > Best wishes, > > Tim Erickson > Hamline Midway > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > >As a parent with kids that have been participating on city organized > >teams for about five years now, I'd have to say, that I'm fairly > >unhappy with the service that I've been getting at local parks. > > > >A couple of quick anecdotes, then I'd like to hear from others..... > > > >1) One of the first years I signed my son up for soccer, I indicated > >on the registration form that I would be willing to help coach. I > >never heard back from anyone. We finally got a phone call, giving us > >1 day notice for a "parent meeting." As I had other plans that > >night, my wife took my son to the meeting. When she got home, she > >asked me if I knew that I was the coach. Which, I didn't. I had > >never been notified or formally asked to take the job. I did take > >the job and loved it. > > > >2) Last year for soccer, we were told at Park A that my 10 year old > >son was ineligible to play on the 10 & under soccer team (he just > >turned 10 during the season). He was also told that park A had no 12 > >& under team for him to join. We went to Park B. At park B we were > >told that my son DID belonged on the 10 and under team (which made > >sense to us). At his first practice, there we 7 year olds on the 10 > >and under team, because they had been told that Park B had no 8 and > >under team. I asked the park staff and was told the same thing. > > > >Later in the season, I learned that Park A did have a 12 & under > >team. Remember, I went to Park B because I was told they had no 12 & > >under team. I also learned, that despite at least 3 parents being > >told that Park B had no 8 and under team, in fact Park B did have an > >8 and under team. > > > >At the end of the season, I also learned - that in fact, my 10 year > >old son was ineligible to play on the 10 and under team, because he > >would be turning 11 some 10 months after the end of the season. He > >and his other 10 year old friend finished the final 1-2 games of the > >season, despite being a year to old (actually, they were both less > >than 2 months too old). > > > >3) I remember talking to another parent who showed up at an "away" > >game for the final 10 minutes of the game, with a daughter who was > >in tears, because they had spent the last 45 minutes driving around > >the city, based upon written instructions from our "home" park > >staff, that had at least 2 clear and distinct errors in them. > > > >I've had quite a few other experiences of this type, but these are > >the ones that stand out in my mind. > > > >Yes, there are some very good folks that are working very hard in > >this underfunded system. But, I must say, the youth sports program > >is definitely the city service with which I have had the most > >problems in recent years. Overall, I'm an unhappy and reluctant > >client of these programs. > > > >Anyone else care to comment? > > > >Best wishes, > > > >Tim Erickson > >Hamline Midway > >[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > > >-- > >================================================= > >Tim Erickson http://www.politalk.com > >St. Paul, MN - USA 651-643-0722 > >[EMAIL PROTECTED] iChat/AIM: stpaultim > >================================================= > > > > > > > >------------------------------------------------- > >JOIN the St. Paul Issues Forum TODAY: > > http://www.e-democracy.org/stpaul/ > >------------------------------------------------- > >POST MESSAGES HERE: stpaul@mnforum.org > > > >To subscribe, modify subscription, or get your password - visit: > >http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/stpaul > > > >Archive Address: > > http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/private/stpaul/ > > > -- > ================================================= > Tim Erickson http://www.politalk.com > St. Paul, MN - USA 651-643-0722 > [EMAIL PROTECTED] iChat/AIM: stpaultim > ================================================= > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 7 > Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2005 23:40:08 -0500 > From: "Paul Gleeson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: RE: [StPaul] Parks & Recreation - Youth Sports > To: "St. Paul Issues Forum" <stpaul@mnforum.org> > Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > > Tim, > > I had intended a much longer post, but have not had the time. > > In my experience, most (not all) Rec Center youth sports programs emphasize > the recreational aspect of sports. My experience with Rec Center soccer was > similar to yours. Not very well organized, nor well coached. Also, there > is a program called Highland/Groveland Recreation Association (HGRA) that > runs a number of recreational programs in that area of the city. My > experience is that HGRA is a step up from Rec Center sports programs. > > If your child is really interested in learning a sport and competing, you > might want to try a program that will require more of a commitment of time > and money, like the St. Paul Blackhawks, http://www.blackhawksoccer.org I > am not endorsing that program, but it will be much more organized than your > local park. > > Similar programs exist in St. Paul for youth in popular sports - I'm not > intending for this to be a complete list....any other offerings? > > Basketball: http://www.stpaulbasketball.org > > Baseball and Softball: > Midway Baseball at Dunning Park (highly recommended) not sure about a > softball program for girls though: Sign-up this weekend at Dunning Park on > Marshall. Call for times. Affordable, great coaching, beautiful field and > a family atmosphere. > Highland Little League: http://eteamz.active.com/highlandball > > Hockey: There are still some parks that have hockey (Edgecumbe and Langford > are two) and those programs need to be well organized. But for competitive > players, Highland-Central Area Hockey Association or Como Hockey are > probably the choices in your area. > > You can find well organized and well coached youth programs all over the > Metro area for swimming, gymnastics, cross-country and downhill skiing and a > number of other sports, but you have to take the time, ask other parents and > do some research. > > Good Luck. > > Paul Gleeson > St. Paul > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Behalf Of Tim Erickson > Sent: Monday, April 18, 2005 10:43 PM > To: St. Paul Issues Forum > Subject: Re: [StPaul] Parks & Recreation - Youth Sports > > > Anyone else to care their thoughts on the youth sports program in the city? > > Have they worked for you or NOT? > > Below, you'll find the message I posted over the weekend. > > Best wishes, > > Tim Erickson > Hamline Midway > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > >As a parent with kids that have been participating on city organized > >teams for about five years now, I'd have to say, that I'm fairly > >unhappy with the service that I've been getting at local parks. > > > >A couple of quick anecdotes, then I'd like to hear from others..... > > > >1) One of the first years I signed my son up for soccer, I indicated > >on the registration form that I would be willing to help coach. I > >never heard back from anyone. We finally got a phone call, giving us > >1 day notice for a "parent meeting." As I had other plans that > >night, my wife took my son to the meeting. When she got home, she > >asked me if I knew that I was the coach. Which, I didn't. I had > >never been notified or formally asked to take the job. I did take > >the job and loved it. > > > >2) Last year for soccer, we were told at Park A that my 10 year old > >son was ineligible to play on the 10 & under soccer team (he just > >turned 10 during the season). He was also told that park A had no 12 > >& under team for him to join. We went to Park B. At park B we were > >told that my son DID belonged on the 10 and under team (which made > >sense to us). At his first practice, there we 7 year olds on the 10 > >and under team, because they had been told that Park B had no 8 and > >under team. I asked the park staff and was told the same thing. > > > >Later in the season, I learned that Park A did have a 12 & under > >team. Remember, I went to Park B because I was told they had no 12 & > >under team. I also learned, that despite at least 3 parents being > >told that Park B had no 8 and under team, in fact Park B did have an > >8 and under team. > > > >At the end of the season, I also learned - that in fact, my 10 year > >old son was ineligible to play on the 10 and under team, because he > >would be turning 11 some 10 months after the end of the season. He > >and his other 10 year old friend finished the final 1-2 games of the > >season, despite being a year to old (actually, they were both less > >than 2 months too old). > > > >3) I remember talking to another parent who showed up at an "away" > >game for the final 10 minutes of the game, with a daughter who was > >in tears, because they had spent the last 45 minutes driving around > >the city, based upon written instructions from our "home" park > >staff, that had at least 2 clear and distinct errors in them. > > > >I've had quite a few other experiences of this type, but these are > >the ones that stand out in my mind. > > > >Yes, there are some very good folks that are working very hard in > >this underfunded system. But, I must say, the youth sports program > >is definitely the city service with which I have had the most > >problems in recent years. Overall, I'm an unhappy and reluctant > >client of these programs. > > > >Anyone else care to comment? > > > >Best wishes, > > > >Tim Erickson > >Hamline Midway > >[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > > >-- > >================================================= > >Tim Erickson http://www.politalk.com > >St. Paul, MN - USA 651-643-0722 > >[EMAIL PROTECTED] iChat/AIM: stpaultim > >================================================= > > > > > > > >------------------------------------------------- > >JOIN the St. Paul Issues Forum TODAY: > > http://www.e-democracy.org/stpaul/ > >------------------------------------------------- > >POST MESSAGES HERE: stpaul@mnforum.org > > > >To subscribe, modify subscription, or get your password - visit: > >http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/stpaul > > > >Archive Address: > > http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/private/stpaul/ > > > -- > ================================================= > Tim Erickson http://www.politalk.com > St. Paul, MN - USA 651-643-0722 > [EMAIL PROTECTED] iChat/AIM: stpaultim > ================================================= > > > ------------------------------------------------- > JOIN the St. Paul Issues Forum TODAY: > http://www.e-democracy.org/stpaul/ > ------------------------------------------------- > POST MESSAGES HERE: stpaul@mnforum.org > > To subscribe, modify subscription, or get your password - visit: > http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/stpaul > > Archive Address: > http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/private/stpaul/ > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 8 > Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2005 23:58:46 -0500 > From: Tim Erickson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: RE: [StPaul] Parks & Recreation - Youth Sports > To: "St. Paul Issues Forum" <stpaul@mnforum.org> > Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" > > At 11:40 PM -0500 4/18/05, Paul Gleeson wrote: > >In my experience, most (not all) Rec Center youth sports programs emphasize > >the recreational aspect of sports. My experience with Rec Center soccer was > >similar to yours. Not very well organized, nor well coached. > > I understand that the philosophy is meant to be recreational and that > the coaches are pretty bad (actually, some of them were very good). I > was one of the bad ones, coaching kids in a sport I knew almost > nothing about. > > I also understand that there are alternatives. > > I'm not complaining about the lack of competitiveness or untrained > coaches, I'm complaining about some REALLY bad customer service. I'm > complaining about a city program, that based upon my experiences > reflects poorly on the city. > > - If we are going to have a recreational sports program, we ought to > do it well. > - Rec Center staff, ought to be able to answer basic questions about > the programs that they are offering. > - And volunteers coaches should be handled appropriately. > > But, maybe my experiences were isolated or extreme, which is why I'm > eager to hear from others. > > There were times during the last season, in which I wasn't sure if it > wouldn't be better to shut down the program at one park, rather than > offer such a really bad program. It was almost funny how bad it was. > > Best wishes, > > Tim Erickson > Hamline Midway > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > _____________________________________________ > NEW ADDRESS FOR LIST: stpaul@mnforum.org > > To subscribe, modify subscription, or get your password - visit: > http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/stpaul > > Archive Address: > http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/private/stpaul/ > _____________________________________________ > For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html > For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract > > End of Stpaul Digest, Vol 16, Issue 41 > ************************************** ------------------------------------------------- JOIN the St. Paul Issues Forum TODAY: http://www.e-democracy.org/stpaul/ ------------------------------------------------- POST MESSAGES HERE: stpaul@mnforum.org To subscribe, modify subscription, or get your password - visit: http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/stpaul Archive Address: http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/private/stpaul/
