I am suggesting that with a database it would be easier to specify a bundle
for each page so you wouldn't have to worry about collisions. The table
might look something like this:
bundle (null = default)
key
value
locale
(or you could normalize it so the bundle/key would have many values in
another table, one for each supported locale)
The bundle could be the page name if that's how you want to break up your
properties. You would have one application that helped you maintain your
data rather than having hundreds of files. Of course, you would probably
want to have an export/import utiltity so you could check the properties
into source code control. You can do global search and replace with SQL
fairly easily if you have to. One file per jsp doesn't sound _too_ bad but
if you then support three languages I think it becomes a maintenance
problem.
It would be a fair amount of work to get that going so it's not really an
option for you anyway.
Hal
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jonathan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Friday, June 01, 2001 12:38 PM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: Resources clarification - is there a work around
>
>
> I totally respect what you are trying to do with the database
> idea, but the
> problem with managing and keeping track keeps re-appearing -
> that is, if you
> are suggesting getting the data from a database. In fact,
> now you have
> added another series of steps:
> "what variables do we have, where are we using them, lets now
> go do a search
> in the database to see what we have, lets now see where we use it."
> It's like working with database normalization. You first
> normalize, then
> you de-normailze to eliminate complexity. In this case I
> will always need
> to know what text appears on what page. If they are bundled
> together than
> it is a matter of finding the associated text file for that
> page. Otherwise
> I have to go hunting and querying. Want to add a page? Add
> a text file.
> Want to change an item on a page? Change it in all the
> associated text
> files (one for each language translation). Yes you cant make a global
> change. But you CAN do a global search and replace!
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Deadman, Hal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Friday, June 01, 2001 12:18 PM
> Subject: RE: Resources clarification - is there a work around
>
>
> > Let me preface this by saying I haven't given this much
> thought. Since
> > struts already supports multiple bundles (i.e. with the
> bundle attribute
> on
> > bean:message) would it make since to have struts read all
> the resource
> files
> > from a particular directory or path and use the base filename of the
> > property file as the name of the bundle? That would allow
> people to break
> up
> > their properties files however they want to. The default
> file with the
> > bundle key Action.MESSAGES_KEY would still be used whenever
> a bundle was
> not
> > specified.
> >
> > I think if I were going to have a huge number of bundles
> like one per
> page,
> > I would pull my resources from a database using a custom
> > DatabaseMessageResourceFactory. I have considered writing a
> such a factory
> > and the accompanying webapp to maintain the translations
> but I haven't
> > followed through.
> >
> > Hal
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Jonathan Asbell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > > Sent: Thursday, May 31, 2001 9:30 PM
> > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > Subject: Re: Resources clarification - is there a work around
> > >
> > >
> > > The problem we found was that a master list is impossible to
> > > manage. For
> > > instance, on the soon to arrive 10th page of the property
> > > file, you will
> > > have to search all of the previous pages to check to see if
> > > you already used
> > > the property name already. Chances are that you did use the
> > > name already
> > > because an individual tends to think in their own way and
> > > come up with the
> > > same naming schemes, and you will have more for the property
> > > name "name" in
> > > many many other pages. Then some designer or manager tells
> > > you to add a
> > > form field which you recognize that you could use "name"
> as the field
> > > property and realize you have to rethink the way you have
> > > been and will
> > > continue naming things, such as "signup_name", "logon_name",
> > > "search_name",
> > > "artist_name", "publication_name"...... after completeing
> > > the 30th jsp page
> > > you say to yourself, "man(sigh), if I just had a properties
> > > file for each
> > > page or include, than I wouldnt have a 3000 line properties
> > > file with which
> > > I cannot sort, group, or categorize all of the property
> names nicely".
> > >
> > > It was easier for us to:
> > > 1) know what was on any page (just look at the like named
> > > proerties file)
> > > 2) fix or add to a page without thinking if the name was
> > > used, and whether I
> > > thus have to come up with a naming scheme for this one or
> all of them.
> > > 3) just hand over translatable content to the translators on
> > > a page by page
> > > basis.
> > > 4) if you later decide to keep it in the database you can
> > > because you just
> > > associate pageName with propertyName
> > >
> > > logon.jsp user.name
> > > logon.jsp user.address
> > > logon.jsp
> > > signup.jsp user.name
> > > signup.jsp user.password
> > > checkout.jsp user.name
> > >
> > > This is much easier. Try it. You will see how managing this
> > > grand list
> > > sucks ;^)
> > >
> > > If your developers are anything like places I have worked
> > > for, than you know
> > > how things
> > > get out of control. I just take this as a given. With my
> > > way, at any time,
> > > I can email out new pages and text to be translated (by a
> > > clerk, designers,
> > > editors). I send a visual and typeographic pair of items
> > > that go together
> > > and that an editor can say, "yes, this is what I want the
> > > caption to say on
> > > this page". Do I repeadedly send the editor chunks of a
> > > 3000+ item list and
> > > then say:
> > > (me) "can you tell me what you want to say in these new lines
> > > of text?"
> > > (editor) "which lines?"
> > > (me) " the ones I highlighted"
> > > (editor) "which of these lines of text is on this page we
> are talking
> > > about?".
> > >
> > > Do you see why I say the benefits from a big list loose out
> > > to a small list?
> > > What if I delete one. What pages does it effect? Which ones
> > > have been left
> > > orphaned? You dont know in any easy way. For search and
> > > replace you now
> > > have to search each particularly named item. If they all
> were called
> > > "user.name" I could just search and replace it everywhere
> > > below a directory.
> > > If one is "logon.user.name" and another "search.user.name"
> > > you now have to
> > > search and find each unique one. Could you get them all, or
> > > did you miss
> > > some because someone was using "logon.User.Name" instead of
> > > "logon.user.name" or "logonUserName".
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Nanduri, Amarnath" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > Sent: Thursday, May 31, 2001 5:50 PM
> > > Subject: RE: Resources clarification - is there a work around
> > >
> > >
> > > > Hi Guys,
> > > >
> > > > From my personal experience it would not be a bad
> > > idea for struts
> > > to
> > > > support multiple resource bundles. I will explain my
> reasons below.
> > > >
> > > > At present struts has one resource bundle in which you can
> > > include error
> > > > messages , confirmation messages , labels on html fileds
> > > etc.... For a big
> > > > application ( like i am on right now. We are going to have
> > > > 50 jsp pages
> > > > minimum) it is quite a pain in the neck to add properties
> > > to a single
> > > file.
> > > > Besides the developers having to compete with one another
> > > to checkout the
> > > > properties file ( from source safe ) maintaining it is an
> > > another pain.
> > > >
> > > > One more problem we encountered is nested exceptions
> > > deep in the EJB's.
> > > > Trying to throw the error msgs (which ofcourse have to be
> > > internationalized)
> > > > and showing it to the user, it was somewhat of a problem to
> > > define all the
> > > > correct error messages in the same property file. After
> > > sometime we were
> > > > able to coordinate properly and get stuff back on track
> > > (without losing
> > > > tempers).
> > > >
> > > > I would propose that struts 1.1 make it a standard to
> > > have separate
> > > > Resource Bundles for different categories. I do not
> agree with one
> > > Resource
> > > > Bundle per page as this would lead to too much confusion.
> > > >
> > > > For example, all the error msgs would be in a
> Resource Bundle by
> > > > themselves. Confirmation msgs would have their own Resource
> > > Bundle. HTML
> > > > related fields will have their own Resource Bundles etc ..
> > > >
> > > > From a performance point of view which would be more
> > > efficient ? Having
> > > a
> > > > single Resource Bundle (or) Multiple Resource Bundles ?
> > > Which one can give
> > > > the user faster lookup access ?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > At present we have close to 2000+ (properties + error
> msgs) in the
> > > > properties file and the number would most likely quadruple
> > > by the time we
> > > > take it to production. I would certainly like to hear your
> > > opinions on
> > > > this....esp from people who have deployed their applications...
> > > >
> > > > just my 2cents
> > > >
> > > > cheers,
> > > > Amar..
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Jonathan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > > > Sent: Thursday, May 31, 2001 10:28 AM
> > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > > Subject: Re: Resources clarification - is there a work around
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Hi Peter. Read the whole thread and you will see some good
> > > examples as to
> > > > why I want to do this.
> > > >
> > > > I think I will end up doing some surgery on the struts
> > > classes. I will
> > > > associate the page I am forwarding to with a properties
> > > file, maybe inside
> > > > the struts-config. That will mean I will have to look
> at the dom
> > > > manipulation which gets the values and ad another group of
> > > items (the
> > > > associated properties file) to a hashtable or object. I
> will put the
> > > > properties files in the same directory as the jsp page but
> > > protected. I
> > > > will try to protect all files that end in ".properties".
> > > >
> > > > I would love to hear suggestions from Niall, Ted,
> Craig, Hal, Jeff,
> > > Nanduri,
> > > > Dave etc....
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "Peter Alfors" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > > Sent: Thursday, May 31, 2001 10:03 AM
> > > > Subject: Re: Resources clarification - is there a work around
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > We are currently using two different resource bundles.
> > > One for our
> > > > messages and
> > > > > another for our constants (that define
> > > > > web look and feel). To do this, we overrode the init()
> > > method in the
> > > > > ActionServlet and added another method to initialize a
> > > second bundle
> > > into
> > > > a
> > > > > different session attribute.
> > > > > This works well for 2 different bundles, but it would not
> > > be practical
> > > for
> > > > a
> > > > > large number or bundles (one per page).
> > > > >
> > > > > Maybe there would be a way to initialize all of the page
> > > bundles at
> > > > startup?
> > > > > Some sort of loop or somethine?
> > > > > I don't have any suggestions on how this would work, but
> > > maybe it is a
> > > > starting
> > > > > point??
> > > > >
> > > > > One supporting reason for a single bundle would be
> > > this... It allows
> > > you
> > > > to
> > > > > easily keep consistent naming across your app.
> > > > > For instance, if each of your pages has the label "Id",
> > > but then later
> > > on
> > > > you
> > > > > (or the customer) decide that "Name" is a better choice,
> > > you only have
> > > to
> > > > change
> > > > > it in one place. There are other situations as well,
> > > this is just one.
> > > > > Also, creating new locales is as simple as handing a
> > > single resource
> > > > bundle over
> > > > > to your translater, rather than 100 different bundles to
> > > duplicate.
> > > > > As for naming problems, there is a simple solution.
> Use a naming
> > > strategy
> > > > for
> > > > > each key.
> > > > >
> > > > > <pageName>.<Key>=Value
> > > > > or
> > > > > common.<Key>=Value <-- if this is common across all pages.
> > > > >
> > > > > HTH,
> > > > > Pete
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Jonathan Asbell wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Thanks Pete. However it just seems strange that Struts
> > > just offers
> > > one
> > > > big
> > > > > > resource file for each Local. I have developed 3
> > > international sites,
> > > > and I
> > > > > > can safely say that when a set of resources are
> > > associated with a
> > > > particular
> > > > > > page it is much easier to manage than 1 resources for
> > > all pages. Has
> > > > anyone
> > > > > > hacked at the Struts code to get around this? I
> dont like the
> > > > concatenating
> > > > > > idea because it is too easy to have duplicates; and you
> > > probably want
> > > to
> > > > use
> > > > > > the same resource names anyway to keep a consistency.
> > > Anyone else
> > > have
> > > > any
> > > > > > ideas?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > From: "Peter Alfors" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > > > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 9:33 AM
> > > > > > Subject: Re: Resources clarification :^)
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > You could combine all of your property files during
> > > your build.
> > > > > > > This would allow you to have as many different
> > > property files as you
> > > > > > > want.
> > > > > > > However, you need to be careful that you do not have
> > > duplicate names
> > > > > > > across multiple files.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > HTH,
> > > > > > > Pete
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Jonathan wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Hello all. It appears that the ActionServlet
> points to a
> > > resources
> > > > > > > > file, and not a ResourceBundle object. Is this
> > > true? The reason
> > > is
> > > > > > > > that I would like to group in the same directory
> > > the following:1)
> > > a
> > > > > > > > particular ActionForm2) the Action class that works
> > > with that
> > > > > > > > ActionForm3) the resources (strings) that work with that
> > > > > > > > ActionForm The reason is that it is much easier to
> > > manage the
> > > > > > > > artifacts on a page by page basis.How can I do this
> > > > > > > > properly ThanksJonathan
> > > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
