James Cameron wrote: > You replied to me, but that wasn't me you quoted, it was Rahul.
Ya, I know. I just replied to all. > However, it would be wrong > to set expectations of colourful software by adding lots of colour to > the web site. I just meant to update the color palette, never to have many colors. > We also need to remain accessible for vision impaired. True! > Activities for Sugar are presented by activities.sugarlabs.org and by > Fedora SoaS. Activities for Sugarizer are pre-bundled, not presented; > you'll see the https://sugarizer.org/ web site is much better at > getting people to engage with the software. I was not knowing about the latter site. That's really good in terms of user engagement. Overall I agree with your opinion James, and also of other board members and now I too feel this may not be one of the important projects for GSoC. Thanks, Amaan On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 7:19 AM James Cameron <qu...@laptop.org> wrote: > Amaan Iqbal wrote: > > > I don't expect revamping a website to be a _goal_. > > > > Without a proper website with the latest content, how can we expect > > the activities to reach the audience? > > You replied to me, but that wasn't me you quoted, it was Rahul. > > At the moment activities generally reach the audience through OLPC OS, > Fedora SoaS, activities.sugarlabs.org and Sugarizer. Almost never the > web site. > > > > Even if we add a project for improving the website, 2 years down > > > the line we might again face a similar email pointing out the > > > drawbacks of the new model and another revamping of the website. > > > > This doesn't mean that we will have the same website with the old > > foundation 10 years down the line. Web technologies and standards > > have changed significantly in the past 2-3 years and its > > recommended we too keep our components updated. The main reason > > would be similar to why we are updating our activities. Fixing/ > > Updating activities has to do with more engagement with current > > users and improving the website, to try for more new users. I guess > > both are equally important. > > That wasn't me you quoted, it was Rahul. > > Web site components can be kept updated by using a maintained open > source theme and not tweaking it as incessantly as we have been doing > with airspace. > > While it is similar in general to how we update our activities, this > is not relevant, because the web site is not an activity. > > > > Having less projects does not imply our failure in any sense, lack > > > of existing contributors might indicate that > > > > I agree, but it will be underutilization of potential of an > > organization which has participated in GSoC for last 10 successive > > years. We might consider having few more mentors this time if proper > > mentoring was the issue last time. Even if we are not having this > > project, we should think of utilizing GSoC to the fullest with tasks > > related to all the activities wherever significant work is > > pending. Further, even if we desire to have some new activities, we > > should think of including that too. > > That wasn't me you quoted, it was Rahul. > > I'm not worried about underutilisation of potential; there is plenty > to do, and if anyone is attentive and dutiful toward it they will > easily find what to do without having to do any updates to the web > site. I'm also not worried about having less active projects for this > GSoC, because we certainly have less active developers, and the last > thing we want is mentors who aren't active developers, as it leads to > under-mentoring; project never properly defined, mentor has little > idea of what the student is doing, and ultimately the student produces > code that isn't useful, or disappears. See Google Summer of Code > Guides, What Makes a Good Mentor? > > https://google.github.io/gsocguides/mentor/what-makes-a-good-mentor > > Of course, our thanks to all those developers who have made small > updates to our software in the past few weeks, I appreciate it. > > > > I added why a user should get sugar. > > > > > > It’s still a work in progress as I figured even the last design > > > that’s under development now Wouldn’t really solve the problem. We > > > need MORE call to action buttons, more exciting colors, a better > > > navigation processes. > > > > That's what. I would too suggest improving the color palette we are > > currently using. The current color palette is not that pleasing at > > first sight. Also call to action and download buttons on the main > > page itself would be a good idea to improve the conversion > > rate. Further better and clearer navigation is also missing. > > That wasn't me you quoted, it was Peace. However, it would be wrong > to set expectations of colourful software by adding lots of colour to > the web site. Cart before horse error. First, we need Sugar and > Sugarizer to switch to using colour. Then can we increase the colours > on any web site that describes them. We also need to remain > accessible for vision impaired. > > Also, whether colours are pleasing is subjective, and dependent on > culture and environment. While you might not like the colours, they > have been accepted for some time, so you might provide more convincing > evidence than your own opinion of the colours. > > > > Hoping to move most primary information from wiki to the site, > > > instead of breaking their section on the site to go to wiki(it > > > lost them totally) > > > > This is the most important point. I strongly agree with this. Our > > website should only have the important information instead of the > > wikis. It breaks the flow and makes the user end up getting > > confused. > > That wasn't me you quoted, it was Peace. However, this content could > be placed in frames or transformed from GitHub or Wiki using a script. > We continue to have people who maintain GitHub and the Wiki and won't > maintain the web site. Content that has been copied to the web site > has languished unmaintained. > > > > This is as important as improving Sugar Labs tools. Without an > > > actionable site our tools won't reach our potential users. We need > > > the users (students parents, school administration) to be able to > > > download and use Sugar and every other Sugar Labs tools > > > effectively without stress then we can record an increase in > > > downloads of these tools we put in so much to build. > > > > This is why I thought of this idea. My primary intention is not to > > get anything revamped but to improve the way we present our > > activities to the user. Also for better maintenance, it is required > > that we keep our site up to date and consistent with the standards. > > > > Ultimately I would suggest that we should utilize GSoC to the > > fullest in any way we can, be it only with improving the activities. > > > > I will leave further discretion to the board members. > > That wasn't me you quoted, it was Peace. > > Activities for Sugar are presented by activities.sugarlabs.org and by > Fedora SoaS. Activities for Sugarizer are pre-bundled, not presented; > you'll see the https://sugarizer.org/ web site is much better at > getting people to engage with the software. > > GSoC isn't there for us to abuse or on-sell, it's there to help us > with our goals. > > I'm sure the board will continue to listen to what people think. As > chair, nobody in the board has proposed any motion in relation to the > web site, but you've heard from Samson, Walter, and myself. > > > On Tue, Jan 22, 2019 at 6:18 AM James Cameron <[1]qu...@laptop.org> > wrote: > > > > Thanks. But my vote is no. > > > > It's not three months of coding. > > > > It doesn't solve a problem we have with our software products; Sugar, > > activities, Music Blocks, or Sugarizer. > > > > Our problem with the web site is with the content, in turn because we > > have had few content producers, and too many people proposing style > and > > layout changes instead. > > > > Last month, or November, we had a team formed to do A/B testing, but > > the A/B testing has not yet begun. I'm guessing they are too busy. > > Perhaps it is time for more people to speak up in order to slow it > > down even further. > > > > On Mon, Jan 21, 2019 at 07:44:28PM +0530, Amaan Iqbal wrote: > > > Hello, > > > > > > I see we only have 6 projects so far in our Ideas list in > comparison to > > 11 > > > which were selected in GSoC last year. Being a successful Open > Source > > > organization, I sincerely hope we have the potential of having > many more > > > projects in GSoC this year(most probably 15+ if we can come up > with such > > > promising ideas). > > > > > > Here I would suggest an idea for the renovation of our > Website, [1]blog, > > and > > > creation of a customized/integration of existing CMS to our > website from > > where > > > admins can create articles directly. Also some other web pages can > also > > be > > > added to this list if I am missing something. The end product will > be > > expected > > > to have : > > > > > > • Material Designed > > > • no/minimal redundancies in code > > > • faster load time > > > • Use of latest website standards > > > • Wider reach in terms of accessibility > > > • Faster and easier updates from the admins to the website > > > • Elimination of device specific issues > > > • Removal of most of the issues on [2]www-sugarlabs > > > • Easy setup for a new contributor > > > > > > After mentoring for few design tasks in GCI and collaborating with > > several pull > > > requests I found that the website was mostly constructed with many > > components > > > placed forcefully in their places including a search box in the > navbar, > > such > > > that website looks somehow decent. But the design is not at all > generic > > and so > > > as a result there use to be many small issues with looks and > behavior of > > > components on different devices. Also, the website is not updated > to the > > latest > > > web standards. > > > > > > Further, publicity in the best way with > appropriate [3]accessibility of > > the > > > website is important for any organization and I sincerely hope > this idea > > has > > > that potential. > > > > > > Looking forward to hearing your opinion on this before sending a > Pull > > Request > > > on the GSoC ideas list. > > > > > > Regards, > > > Amaan > > > > > > References: > > > > > > [1] [2]http://planet.sugarlabs.org/ > > > [2] [3]https://github.com/sugarlabs/www-sugarlabs/issues > > > [3] [4] > https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Learn/Accessibility/HTML > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Sugar-devel mailing list > > > [5]Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org > > > [6]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > > > -- > > James Cameron > > [7]http://quozl.netrek.org/ > > _______________________________________________ > > Sugar-devel mailing list > > [8]Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org > > [9]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > > > References: > > > > [1] mailto:qu...@laptop.org > > [2] http://planet.sugarlabs.org/ > > [3] https://github.com/sugarlabs/www-sugarlabs/issues > > [4] https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Learn/Accessibility/HTML > > [5] mailto:Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org > > [6] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > [7] http://quozl.netrek.org/ > > [8] mailto:Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org > > [9] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > -- > James Cameron > http://quozl.netrek.org/ >
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