Hello Dave, thank you again for your prompt answer. You exactly got what I was trying to explain, sorry if I wasn't clear.
Your tip on applying the rotational object in the delay feedback path is very interesting and I will try it in the next days. ICST do have a soundfield rotation object separated from the panner/encoder. I am working in 3rd order horizontal only for the moment with just 8 speakers and would like to use a crossover for the subs encoded in 1st order (square) but I am not sure if we have the budget for all the speakers, so probably it will remain just 8 speakers 3rd order. I will try different solution and let you know the output of them. Thank you very much for the help. Regards, Sero On Thu, Jun 7, 2012 at 5:00 PM, <sursound-requ...@music.vt.edu> wrote: > > Message: 8 > Date: Thu, 07 Jun 2012 15:59:28 +0100 > From: Dave Malham <dave.mal...@york.ac.uk> > Subject: Re: [Sursound] B- Format to A-format conversion for an > ambisonics fx (SERO SERO) > To: Surround Sound discussion group <sursound@music.vt.edu> > Message-ID: <4fd0c1d0.7020...@york.ac.uk> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > Hi Sero > > Not sure I understand what you mean by "(current ICST encoder is an > encoder from mono to > B-format + panner)" since the panner is what does the encoding to B > format. However, on to the next > point - for simple effects like pure delay, eq or gain changes, you don't > need to do anything in > terms of further rotations, it will all just follow on. However, if you > want to have a B format > feedback path from the output of the delay to the input, you might like to > put a rotator in the > feedback path so that successive copies of the original soundfield appear > from different angles. I'm > not sure if the ICST externals incorporate a field rotation object (I > could be wrong - it's a while > since I used them) so you might have to look elsewhere for that. What > order are you working at? > > Dave > > > On 06/06/2012 15:57, SERO SERO wrote: > > Hello All, > > > > thank you very much for your responses, very much appreciated. > > > > Dave - Thank you for the links and the ideas regarding the application of > > delay effect to the B-foramt signal; one thing is not clear to me yet is > > the following and I would be very grateful if you can expand further for > me: > > > > I have a mono source that is encoded in B-format and already include the > > rotational information in the encoder (current ICST encoder is an encoder > > from mono to B-format + panner) so if I apply delay to the B-format > signal > > I am assuming I will already have the system responding to source > rotation > > when I rotate my source without further panning the fx soundfield. > > Am I correct or I do need to rotate the delay fx soundfield as well > > according to the source rotation? > > > > Both solution are possible as I will use a typical send/return fx path > > (%wet) for the fx. > > > > Gus - Thank you for the link, Cannot check now in the office but will > have > > a look one evening. > > I am definitely up for sharing ideas and patches. Please feel free to > write > > on my sursound email for any personal communication. > > > > Very grateful for all the help from the list. > > > > Thankyou > > > > Sero > > > > > >> Message: 3 > >> Date: Sun, 3 Jun 2012 21:33:58 +0100 > >> From: Dave Malham<dave.mal...@york.ac.uk> > >> Subject: Re: [Sursound] B- Format to A-format conversion for an > >> ambisonics fx > >> To: Surround Sound discussion group<sursound@music.vt.edu> > >> Message-ID: > >> < > capw+1zrn0w_5hdrbxpss60oy_z7_pgrwjlez_ogyjmpmzxp...@mail.gmail.com > >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > >> > >> Hi Sero, > >> Although there are times that processing A format may be be useful > >> in compositional terms (see Jo Anderson's work) it isn't necessary to > >> change to A format for applying general effects like delay, eq or > >> gain, even if it involves phase shifts - so long as there are no > >> differences between channels in the B Format. So, if all channels have > >> the same delay, no matter what it is. It is entirely possible to > >> provide a B format feedback path via delays which incorporate > >> rotations to increase the complexity of the final soundfield. Dylan > >> Menzies incorporated this in his LAmb software > >> (http://www.tech.dmu.ac.uk/~dylan/z/dylan/project/holog/index.html). > >> The same applies to pretty well any effect - if you apply a boost of, > >> say, +2.65dB at 5kHz to the W channel, you must apply an identical > >> boost of+2.65dB at 5kHz to all the other channels. > >> > >> Dave > >> > >> On 3 June 2012 19:53, SERO SERO<bassi...@gmail.com> wrote: > >>> Hello list, > >>> > >>> This is my first post here so please be patient if I am doing something > >>> wrong with the replies. > >>> > >>> I am working on a patch in MAX 6 for Ambisonics reproduction for a jazz > >>> band and I am looking in creating a series of FX that can be encoded in > >> 3rd > >>> order. > >>> > >>> My main understanding is that for a delay FX type (and any other fx > that > >>> affects the phase of the signal) I need to convert the B-format signal > to > >>> A-format, then apply the fx I want and then reconvert to B-format. > >>> > >>> Does anyone can point me to any resource I can use to understand both > >>> conversions? > >>> Also can you share a patch u have done in Max (if anyone use it) I can > >> use > >>> as a reference? > >>> > >>> I use the ICST tools in Max 6 for all the ambisonics processing. > >>> > >>> I am already using the trick of applying delay FX to a mono source > before > >>> enconding and then use rotation of the sound field to create ping pong > >> like > >>> fx but I would like to do something more creative. > >>> > >>> Thank you very much > >>> > >>> Regards, > >>> Sero > >>> -------------- next part -------------- > >>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > >>> URL:< > >> > https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/attachments/20120603/5b53fa16/attachment.html > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Sursound mailing list > >>> Sursound@music.vt.edu > >>> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound > >> > >> > >> -- > >> > >> These are my own views and may or may not be shared by my employer > >> > >> Dave Malham > >> Music Research Centre > >> Department of Music > >> The University of York > >> Heslington > >> York YO10 5DD > >> UK > >> Phone 01904 322448 > >> Fax? ?? 01904 322450 > >> 'Ambisonics - Component Imaging for Audio' > >> > >> > >> ------------------------------ > >> > >> Message: 4 > >> Date: Sun, 3 Jun 2012 21:55:37 +0100 > >> From: Augustine Leudar<augustineleu...@gmail.com> > >> Subject: Re: [Sursound] B- Format to A-format conversion for an > >> ambisonics fx > >> To: Surround Sound discussion group<sursound@music.vt.edu> > >> Message-ID: > >> < > cabx2jupne7q3zozrbybfe4vio+_k6i_-9ymdyxm5w4b1ndk...@mail.gmail.com > >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > >> > >> Hi Sero, > >> I use ICST quite a lot as well - I do as you say and just apply the > >> effects to the signals before sending them into ambipanning~ > >> I'm not sure why converting to from B - format A - format will > >> necessarily allow you more creative possibilities - I'm not really > >> sure why you would do that, A - format as I understand it is just the > >> raw recordings that come out of a microphone ? > >> You can see a patch Ive made here for spatialising audio in 3d with a > >> wii controller (an electroacoustic granular magic wand): > >> > >> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7cmodvSM5jE > >> > >> Id be happy to share knowledge patches etc , > >> cheers, > >> Gus > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > -------------- next part -------------- > > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > > URL:< > https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/attachments/20120606/1c0bd214/attachment.html > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Sursound mailing list > > Sursound@music.vt.edu > > https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound > > -- > These are my own views and may or may not be shared by my employer > /*********************************************************************/ > /* Dave Malham http://music.york.ac.uk/staff/research/dave-malham/ */ > /* Music Research Centre */ > /* Department of Music "http://music.york.ac.uk/"; */ > /* The University of York Phone 01904 322448 */ > /* Heslington Fax 01904 322450 */ > /* York YO10 5DD */ > /* UK 'Ambisonics - Component Imaging for Audio' */ > /* "http://www.york.ac.uk/inst/mustech/3d_audio/"; */ > /*********************************************************************/ > > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... 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