Ron B. >--- In biofuel@yahoogroups.com, Keith Addison <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > Or maybe one of these guys: > > http://www.motherjones.com/news/feature/2004/03/03_100.html > > The Damage Done > > >============================ >The website above speaks for itself....yawn...more commie crap.
Actually it doesn't speak for itself, not if that's what you'd have it say. Rather than the all-too-usual (and sleazy) labelling-and-dismissal of anything that might disagree with you, please unyawn yourself and provide full references evidencing Mother Jones.com's communist affiliations, or even leanings. Also provide an explanation of why the views of invalided US soldiers returning from Iraq would constitute "commie crap" and merit only a yawn. >============================ > > > I suppose that should be an expected response from someone who >lives > > in a country where, out of 128.6 million workers, only 6.4 million > > use public transport - and 77% or rest drive alone in their cars. >The > > public transport option doesn't even enter your mind. >============================== >I'll use the environmentalist blame game What is "the environmentalist blame game"? Please provide valid examples and explain how it's pertinent to public transport issues in the US. >here-> Its the Japanese >fault for making Americans shun public transport. Why? >Here's why: >With American cars so junky and worthless in the 1970's, we would >have switched to public transport by now. But, Ohhh Noooo, the >Japanese had to come along and make beautifully exquisite automobiles >and now SUVs and pickup trucks.....so Americans are really hooked >now. Nissen, Honda, Toyota, etc., etc. They are the best. Where is >the justice? Either withdraw this nonsense or provide a reasoned response. >Back to biofuels, >Ron B. Back, in fact, Ron B, to unfinished business. You've only been here a few days, quite a few posts from you already, but you haven't at all bothered to find out anything about the group you've joined or the people who comprise it, where they come from and what their views might be. That rather goes along with what your views are turning out to be. Anyway, it's a very international list, and it's not a list that will allow unsupported opinionations, and indeed sneering, to go unquestioned. You can say whatever you like here, but you might have to prove it. If you can't, you'll have to withdraw it. NOT an option is simply to ignore demands to justify what you've said. Also as usual, you've of course cut all the inconvenient bits from my response to your message, just leaving the bits you can try sneering at. So I've put it back, below. You were asked some questions. Answer them, and the current crop, in an evenhanded manner. This is unfinished business that you'll have to deal with before you can continue. Keith Addison List owner >>--- In biofuel@yahoogroups.com, "Appal Energy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> > Hiding War's Toll >> > >> > President Bush's rationale for taking us to war in Iraq has >>crumbled. The >> > truth about supposed Iraqi weapons of mass destruction is being >>told. At the >> > same time, another truth remains hidden by the Bush administration: >>the 550 >> > troops who have returned from Iraq in caskets and the thousands >>returning >> > with severe physical and psychological damage. >> > >> > The military planes carrying human remains fly into Dover Air Force >>Base in >> > Delaware under cover of darkness. Unlike Vietnam...<snip>.... >>================================ >>Sorry for disagreeing, but most of the top Democrat leaders agreed >>with Prez Bush about the WMD before the war and many of these were >>either on intellegence committees or in the Administration (Clinton >>and Gore). When no WMD were found, they cried "FOUL", except for Bill >>Clinton. He did not flip-flop. > >Sorry to ask, but how does turning it into a bipartisan argument >change what it says? - which is this: "President Bush's rationale >for taking us to war in Iraq has crumbled. The truth about supposed >Iraqi weapons of mass destruction is being told." > >309 days ... and still no WMD found in Iraq. No link with Al-Qaida. >No link with 9/11. And no change whatsoever from information that >was well-known before the war when all this BS was being spun. > >>As far as not showing caskets, if we would show every single >>automobile and truck accident on TV and in the newspapers, with blood >>and guts spilled all over, there would be a green movement to ban ALL >>cars and trucks and this list would be purely for academic purposes >>only. <G> > >Three things... First, there's more to the world, believe it or not, >than what may or may not happen in the US, and there's a LOT more to >this list and its membership than Americans (a minority) and >American issues. If you don't mind my saying so (and even if you do). > >Second, why would human "blood and guts spilled all over" be a >"green"issue? How would blood and guts and crashed vehicles concern >the environment? Why would televising it mobilise "greens" more than >anyone else? Maybe it would (should) just be a "human" issue? But >then you wouldn't get a dig at the greens, eh? Cheap shot. > >Third, in what way is this a useful comparison, or a comparison at >all? You could say the same about cancer deaths, just as >meaninglessly. > >Maybe this person's view is more pertinent: > >>Do you think the American public is well-informed about what is >>happening in Iraq? >> >>No, I really don't. I see young people on my medical table all the >>time, people who have lost their legs or arms or had other terrible >>injuries. No one back home sees any of that. I've been home for a >>month and I haven't seen a casualty yet on television. I'm still >>waiting. Where are the casualties? It's as if it doesn't exist, as >>if it doesn't happen. >> >>What about Iraqi deaths and injuries? >> >>We don't care about Iraqi deaths. It's something that does not even >>count. The hospital was told not to keep count. The Iraqi >>infrastructure does not keep an account of the deaths anymore. >> >>Why? >> >>The American government told them not to. We do always keep a list >>of the Americans injured and the number that die. But here in >>America you don't see anything about these soldiers coming back. >>You don't read anything about the funeral. It's like it's a secret, >>like these people didn't exist. >> >>Was it like this in previous wars? >> >>No. >> >>What brought about the change? >> >>From what I gather, it used to be that the president would go out >>to the area to meet the [deceased] soldiers coming in. They would >>drape the caskets and they would actually watch and give a moment >>of silence as the coffin came by. The Bush Administration felt that >>was too much for Americans to handle, so they secured that part of >>the ceremony so that no one knows when that fallen soldier comes >>home. It's an injustice to the military, because you gave your life >>to the country and the country should give something back to you. >>Even just a moment of silence. Every day that someone dies, the >>flag should be lowered to half staff. Not just because a politician >>died. >> >>Those guys are good people. They work hard. They do anything and >>everything that is asked of them. And they gave the ultimate >>sacrifice. It should not be that you have to go to a website to >>find out who died. >-- From: "Unknown Soldier" Speaks Out To Bring Troops Home >A soldier back from Iraq discusses the war and the U.S. soldiers >fighting that war, the suicides, and much more. >Interview by Daniel Redwood >http://www.interventionmag.com/cms/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&f >ile=article&sid=668 > >Or maybe one of these guys: >http://www.motherjones.com/news/feature/2004/03/03_100.html >The Damage Done > >>It'll be back to transportation using oats and hay for fuel. > >I suppose that should be an expected response from someone who lives >in a country where, out of 128.6 million workers, only 6.4 million >use public transport - and 77% or rest drive alone in their cars. >The public transport option doesn't even enter your mind. > >Keith > > >>Of course people get hurt riding horses and mules also, but thats >>another story. >> >>Ron B. 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