Hi Peggy ; Yes I bought a small autoclave to try out converting waste cardboard to ethanol by dilute acid hydrolysis. Truckloads of cardboard waste from all over Cambodia come back to Thailand through Poipet for recycling. It can be had for 2 baht/kg (about $0.05 per kg). Now that is a cheap feedstock.
Please don't mis-understand. I am very pro biodiesel. It is just that I feel we need a better feedstock than used frying oil to make a difference. That's why I plan to develope a palm oil plantation. I bought a very detailed (and expensive) technical book on how to do it, and it is not a simple project. I am trying to germinate my first plam seeds now. If your read the posts from Conrad (thanks Conrad), you'll see that the government biodiesel program is just a blend of 20% palm oil and diesel, not true biodiesel. Step by step, I guess. Best Regards, Peter G. Thailand --- Peggy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hello Peter, > > It is possible to make fuel ethanol from discarded > paper and food waste > (non-dairy and no meat) making fuel ethanol another > alternative to > biodiesel as well. > > Peggy > > > Hi Caleb ;; > > I agree with you 100% about used frying oil being a > questionable feedstock. There simply isn't enough > of > it to make any significant business out of it, and > it > is spread out over a large geographic area. Yes, > sure > the backyard tinkeres can make a go of it. But as > soon as you start to buy any significant quantites, > the price will surely rise, plus you have > significant > collection costs. > > You can estimate the available quantity by trying to > think about how much frying oil you personally use, > then add in some extra to account for the fried > donut > or fried chicken that you ate at the restaurant. > Then compare that to how much diesel you use. Then > add in the diesel used for your electricity, all the > transportation costs to bring your food to the > supermarket, ect. For me I use about 100 times more > diesel than frying oil. So then we could roughly > estimate that if a city uses for example 1 million > liters of diesel a month, there would be 10,000 > liters > of used frying oil. But only a small fraction could > be recocovered (you couln't recover the used frying > oil that I personally use, for example). > > My conclusion is that a very small number of people > could make it work, but as soon as a few more people > try, supplies will dry up. That's why biodiesel is > irrelevant without an abundant feedstock. Please > don't forget about all the people dying, being > killed, > destroyed lives in the middle east over oil wars. > Then add in the huge cost in military hardware, all > the lost productivity of the men figting instead of > working, and I'm not so sure that the cost of diesel > is lower than the cost of biodiesel made from palm > oil. > > Yes Malasia is the world leader in palm oil > plantations, so this would not interest you. But > Cambodia has no oil plantation and no oil wells > either. They are net importers of both commodities. > > So they are very interested in both possibilities. > > Yes please keep me infomed about the BioFuel > conference in December. > > Best Regards, > > Peter G. > Thailand > > --- kok fong lau <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > Hi Gaug, > > > > Thanks for replying. I'm based in Singapore, but > I > > come from Malaysia. In Malaysia there are plenty > of > > palm oil plantations. The industry is well > > established. There was a push for BioDiesel back > > during the 2002. But since then Palm oil prices > > have > > risen by almost 100%, which makes it more > profitable > > at the moment to export it overseas as cooking oil > > than to convert it to biodiesel for local > > consumption. > > Though rising oil prices might actually reverse > all > > that. > > > > Diesel prices in Malaysia is far too cheap. > > According > > to the latest prices, we're the second cheapest > > after > > brunei. So pushing for BioDiesel is going to be > > hard > > in Malaysia. Plus we're a net exporter of crude > > oil. > > > > I have plans as you to perhaps develope a small > > biodiesel industry in Singapore based on used > > cooking > > oil. Still doing a lot of ground work at the > > momement. Singapore is moving towards euro IV > > emission standards, and biodiesel can help offset > > some > > of the cost of migrating to euro IV disels here. > > Initial investigation into used cooking oil as a > > feedstock here, indicate that it might not be a > > reliable source of feedstock. However we are not > > giving up hope yet. > > > > Yeah the Thailand BioFuels forum is way to > > expensive. > > There's another one coming in december. This time > > it's going to be organized by MPOB from Malaysia . > > > I > > might pop over and take a look if I'm free. I'll > > get > > more details for you if you are interested. > > > > Caleb > > > > --- Guag Meister <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Hi Caleb ; > > > > Thanks for your kind email. I posted it back to > the > > list because you never know who is out there who > > could > > help you. Yes I live about 30 minutes north of > > Bangkok. I have lived here for over 10 years. I > am > > a > > techno type, with experience in many areas > > (electronic > > circuit design, mechanical machine design, pcb > board > > manufacturing, analysis laboratory). The thing > > about > > renewable energy is it almost never pays the > bills. > > Unfortunately, the people most interested in > > renewable > > energy are cheap charlies (sorry list members). > > That > > includes me. > > > > I have always had a gut feeling that renewable > > energy > > was the way to turn back the juggernaut. I have a > > plan to develop a small oil palm plantation in > > Cambodia (100-200 ht, 1-2 sq kilometer) with my > > brother (not my biological brother, but the asian > > style soul mate brother). Land is very cheap, > only > > $100 per acre. Most of the oil will be sold > > locally, > > but biodiesel is an excellent way to utilize the > > excess. Our business plan appears to show that > for > > every dollar invested, we get an annual return > after > > expenses of $1. In other words, 100% annual return > > on > > investment. This assumes stable oil prices. If > > global > > oil prices rise, our profits rise accordingly. > > Additionally, this does not include land price > > appreciation (due to improvements, inflation, > etc). > > > > You need to be a little careful about the > > terminology > > "biodiesel" in Thailand. A few farmers have > blended > > coconut oil with diesel and called it "biodiesel". > > > This was big news. There is a conference (posted > to > > the list) on Ethanol in October in Bangkok, but > the > > $1500 registration fee gave me pause. > > > > Can you tell me a little more about yourself and > > your > > ideas? > > > > Best Regards, > > > > Peter G. > > Thailand > > > > > > --- kok fong lau <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. 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