Yeh, many thanks for this. I do not mean you to waste your time
trawling for evidence to convince me. In fact, I'm already convincing myself by
my assessments re fuels anyway, but I guess the real point is that I should
improve my skill at researching existing scientific and technical research, and
that way I need not get into attempting to assess myself.
I wonder what you will make of the message I have just asked to be
circulated requesting that at least some biofuelers assess KD 420 Combustion
Improving technology. The claims are so hard to believe that 'quack ' status
seeems unavoidable.
Wait til it's out..its a big read with the info' which goes with it ,but I'd
appreciate honest feedback.
Thanks for feedback so far. I'm off for the weekend.....won't be back til
monday pm.
Don Johnston
Environmental Coordinator , Portsmouth City Council
Chair, Solent Energy and Environment Management Group
Winner ; National Champion-Science and Technology, Green Apple Awards 2002
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Tel: 023 9283 4247
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 08 October 2004 15:19
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [Biofuel] Cellulosic Ethanol -was: US
MinnesotaFuelsPlan...MAGNETS
I could quote the years of studies, or I could just point you back to science
101. I'm glad you anticipated this response. The first step in conquering a
problem is admitting you have one. It's not a crime to be scientifically
off-track, and there is help available. Magnets have a few great properties,
but they are not magic. You could start with consumer reports, or any of the
major scientific journals. The quack sites don't count. When one claims that
water is fuel, or that perpetual motion exists, we don't need to refute it, the
onus is on the "promoter" to prove that it does work, as quack status is
already a given. This particular one has been tried and discarded. Look at the
companies that actually try to sell this stuff. They are not mainstream,
respectable companies.
= = = Original message = = =
THis is certainly one type of the responses I anticipated. What evidence do you
have for your statement? I was kind enough to include mine. But you did make me
LOL!
Don Johnston
Environmental Coordinator , Portsmouth City Council
Chair, Solent Energy and Environment Management Group
Winner ; National Champion-Science and Technology, Green Apple Awards 2002
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Tel: 023 9283 4247
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 08 October 2004 14:14
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [Biofuel] Cellulosic Ethanol -was: US Minnesota
FuelsPlan...MAGNETS
Magnets do nothing for combustion or joint pain. They do, however, do wonders
for lightening the load on the wallets of the scientifically clueless.
= = = Original message = = =
Hi all
MAGNETS TO IMPROVE COMBUSTION?...........and OTHER USES
~I have an interest in any means which might improve combustion and this
includes magnets. There seems to be an abundance of contradictory anecdotal
evidence. If it's of interest, here is mine:-
1. A 'Purnash Fuel King' magnet has made no discernible impact on the
performance of a 1.9dti Renault Megane Scenic over 19,120 miles over 1 year and
3 months,as compared with a previously calculated fuel performance history over
4.5 years . It made no difference to 3 MOT emission test results also. HOWEVER,
assessed in conjunction with use of kd 420 Combustion Improver ( which I know
works...but not HOW it works), so magnet may possibly be trying to achieve what
is already achieved by KD420??? So must now stop KD and if performance does
not fall away, then I may be forgiven for considering that magnets and kd
achieve the same thing.
2. Similarly, 2 'ecoflow' magnets, one in above car in conjunction with Purnash
unit failed to imfluence performance in 7,940 miles and 6 months, and in a
Peugeot 106 1.5 diesel over approx 3,100 miles over the same 6 months, also
using KD420.
3. I intend to assess the 2 Eco units in 2 council Pest Control vans with
approx 2 years known fuel consumption history.
4. A Professor at Portsmouth university informs me that the uni has officially
reported that magnets do not enhance combustion.
5. A colleague assessed 4 motor cycle sized magnets ( eco flow units?) by
attaching these to the steel fuel lines as close as possible to the individual
cylinder injectors in a diesel car. He did not record any improvement but this
colleague has recorded similar improvement to myself with KD420 and with ZX1
Friction Eliminator.
6. An Energy Manager whom I hold in very high regard, who is employed in an
organisation which serves 'National Interests' assures me that he has recorded
improved combustion between 8-22% in both gas and oil fired boilers. Thisis
contrary to all my other findings,...could it be that the steady combustion in
a boiler is more influenced? I cannot reconcile his observations with my own.
and ..........
7. My wife and I , and up to approx 200 others, are convinced that american
'Soap Max' magnets are saving us more than 50% of laundry washing powder in our
washing machines.and, and ,and.............
8. I am convinced that I reduced pain and cured a chronic 2 year tennis elbow
condition with a soapmax magnet strapped to my elbow directly over the pain
site! So there! I await the rush of comments that these are not very
'scientific tests', which of course I know. But I would like to add this....a
particular fuel / technology / or fuel device might well perform to x% in a
carefully controlled laboratory test regime. But the scientists or technicians
carrying out the lab test would be cautious of stating that it would perform in
an identical manner in ,say, a london, New York, or Tokyo bus.They would say if
you want to find out how it would perform in a bus under operational tests,
then why do you not put it in a bus? This is what I do. Operational tests and
anecdotal evidence are still evidence.
Don Johnston
Environmental Coordinator , Portsmouth City Council
Chair, Solent Energy and Environment Management Group
Winner ; National Champion-Science and Technology, Green Apple Awards 2002
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Tel: 023 9283 4247
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Jennifer Doty
Sent: 07 October 2004 14:36
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Cellulosic Ethanol -was: US Minnesota Fuels Plan
Peggy,
Please tell me more, or tell me where to read up and learn more about this
new processing. I am very interested in ethanol production, and I work for
a well renown NMR research facility. The idea of using magnetic and
electric fields is huge, if it can work well. How could I get involved in
this research? Thank you -- JRD (Jennifer R. Doty)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Peggy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2004 10:54 PM
Subject: RE: [Biofuel] Cellulosic Ethanol -was: US Minnesota Fuels Plan
> Hello MH,
>
> We are also experimenting with an optional alternative to acid based
> processing via another processing innovation (fluid through electric and
> magnetic fields--and this is very experimental. A previous study done
> in New York published on glucose release from cellulosic material via
> the big bad use of irradiation. So now we are considering trials with
> alternating fields. Actually the device is our own water-cleaning
> apparatus that has proved 5 log reduction in microbes in a stream of
> water. So, I'm not real sure about your statement about acid
> hydrolysis. There are many steps and innovations involved. Please
> qualify your question. I see my message as encouragement for
> alternative biomass feedstock, alternative biomass processing
> techniques, and alternative ways to address concerns while bolstering
> rural economic development. It seems to me that Keith's post today
> highlighting Argentina's decline in individual and small community
> interests is a good example of what not to do.
>
> We don't want to immobilize and invigorate the masses. We want to
> encourage farmers to consider their alternatives. We also think that it
> is possible to just say "no" when faced with options that are not earth
> friendly. The masses live in cities and absorb media and become fat.
> (Obesity--National Geographic lead article from a couple of months ago.)
> The masses have been taught to be gluttonous by advertising and parental
> indulgence. Self-sufficiency by my standards includes community
> cooperation. Who do I want to invigorate??? "People who can make a
> difference" and the people who take the time to participate in this
> Internet exchange are a good starting point.
> Thanks for the email. You make us think, and that is good.
> Best wishes,
> Peggy
>
>
>
> Subject: [Biofuel] Cellulosic Ethanol -was: US Minnesota Fuels Plan
>
> > > Governor Pawlenty Announces Plans to
> > > Double Ethanol Level in Gasoline and
> > > Reduce State Gasoline Consumption by 50% --
> > > Sep 27, 2004
> > > http://www.governor.state.mn.us/Tpaw_View_Article.asp?artid=1120
> > >
> > > ~ Plan also includes greater use of hybrid vehicles ~
>
>
> > Good luck Gov. However, we hope to change the fuel ethanol business
> to
> > be total biomass production and not based on an expensive food crop.
> > And the existing corn producers are doing a great job with their
> > products. We salute them and look forward to joining forces toward a
> > united effort. And its also fine for them to call their state the
> > capital just as long as they don't regulate or control the others.
> > Examples are good. We too expect to be an excellent example only by
> > having many small units in operation. The current processing plants
> are
> > HUGE and really pump out a substantial amount of fuel. Good job! The
> > state's real goal, however, it to attract government research money,
> and
> > if the US government follows their current tact, they will limit
> > production to projects centered on grains. The money powers in the
> DOE
> > seem to have a kind of tunnel vision when it comes to innovation.
> They
> > have a "twenty-year" plan. How's that for stiffening creativity? It
> > means supporting those that are entrenched in the system allowing
> little
> > room for new ideas or expansion. Being a center could mean keeping
> the
> > money for personal projects that tend to be focused on that state's
> > agenda. Well, no offense meant for the good work being done. I'd
> just
> > like to see the money power look around a bit more and stop trying to
> > promote their "cush" researchers to always be included in remote
> > projects. By insisting that they stay involved, they also require a
> > stake in the project thereby keeping control of future expansion,
> future
> > funding, and the future of biofuels. I'm sure that everyone knows by
> > now that our group focuses on community cooperative efforts
> > bootstrapping themselves from their own resources. And many non-food
> > crops can be exceedingly productive as feedstock for fuel ethanol.
> >
> > Best wishes,
> > Peggy
>
>
> From my understanding you want to mobilize and invigorate
> the masses using your acid based cellulosic ethanol fuel,
> correct?
>
> What was the subject line used to describe this process
> as well as personal cost for this endeavor?
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