Just one question on the environmental sustainability of these plants. How much ethanol do they produce for your 300 tonnes of coal? Bob ----- Original Message ----- From: "Hakan Falk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <Biofuel@sustainablelists.org> Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 11:31 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] A Carbon Cloud Hangs Over Green Fuel
> > I am not surprised at all, that coal is going to be a preferred > choice for ethanol distillation. It is a very logical choice for US > sustainability, but maybe not for the environment sustainability. The > reasons are, > > 1. US have around a third of the worlds coal reserves. > 2. US is running out of Natural Gas, wether it is from US, Canada or > Mexico. > 3. US have little resources of NG ships or terminals. > 4. It is probably the easiest process to liquidize the coal reserves. > 5. Using oil to distill ethanol is not efficient nor sustainable. > > The interest of using ethanol is probably not based on environmental > aspects, but rather to lessen the oil dependence. To use the > supporters of ethanol as clean fuel, is rater a marketing byproduct > than a goal. Maybe you could call this ethanol, distilled with coal, > "dirty ethanol". It will however lessen the oil dependence, based on > an abundant domestic energy resource. > > Hakan > > At 11:07 27/03/2006, you wrote: >>http://www.alternet.org/envirohealth/33969/ >> >>A Carbon Cloud Hangs Over Green Fuel >> >>By Mark Clayton, Christian Science Monitor. Posted March 25, 2006. >> >>An Iowa corn refinery, open since December, uses 300 tons of coal a >>day to make ethanol. So just how green can it be? >> >>Late last year in Goldfield, Iowa, a refinery began pumping out a >>stream of ethanol, which supporters call the clean, renewable fuel of >>the future. >> >>There's just one twist: The plant is burning 300 tons of coal a day >>to turn corn into ethanol -- the first US plant of its kind to use >>coal instead of cleaner natural gas. >> >>An hour south of Goldfield, another coal-fired ethanol plant is under >>construction in Nevada, Iowa. At least three other such refineries >>are being built in Montana, North Dakota, and Minnesota. >> >>The trend, which is expected to continue, has left even some ethanol >>boosters scratching their heads. Should coal become a standard for 30 >>to 40 ethanol plants under construction -- and 150 others on the >>drawing boards -- it would undermine the environmental reasoning for >>switching to ethanol in the first place, environmentalists say. >> >>"If the biofuels industry is going to depend on coal, and these >>conversion plants release their CO2 to the air, it could undo the >>global warming benefits of using ethanol," says David Hawkins, >>climate director for the Natural Resources Defense Council in >>Washington. >> >>The reason for the shift is purely economic. Natural gas has long >>been the ethanol industry's fuel of choice. But with natural gas >>prices soaring, talk of coal power for new ethanol plants and >>retrofitting existing refineries for coal is growing, observers say. >> >>"It just made great economic sense to use coal," says Brad Davis, >>general manager of the Gold-Eagle Cooperative that manages the Corn >>LP plant, which is farmer and investor owned. "Clean coal" >>technology, he adds, helps the Goldfield refinery easily meet >>pollution limits -- and coal power saves millions in fuel costs. >> >>Yet even the nearly clear vapor from the refinery contains as much as >>double the carbon emissions of a refinery using natural gas, climate >>experts say. So if coal-fired ethanol catches on, is it still the >>"clean, renewable fuel" the state's favorite son, Sen. Tom Harkin >>likes to call it? >> >>Such questions arrive amid boom times for America's ethanol industry. >> >>With 97 ethanol refineries pumping out some 4 billion gallons of >>ethanol, the industry expects to double over the next six years by >>adding another 4.4 billion gallons of capacity per year. Tax breaks >>as well as concerns about energy security, the environment, and >>higher gasoline prices are all driving ethanol forward. >> >>The Goldfield refinery, and the other four coal-fired ethanol plants >>under construction are called "dry mill" operations, because of the >>process they use. The industry has in the past used coal in a few >>much larger "wet mill" operations that produce ethanol and a raft of >>other products. But dry mills are the wave of the future, industry >>experts say. It's their shift to coal that's causing the concern. >> >>More plants slated for Midwest, West >> >>Scores of these new ethanol refineries are expected to be built >>across the Midwest and West by the end of the decade, and many could >>soon be burning coal in some form to turn corn into ethanol, industry >>analysts say. >> >>"It's very likely that coal will be the fuel of choice for most of >>these new ethanol plants," says Robert McIlvaine, president of a >>Northfield, Ill., information services company that has compiled a >>database of nearly 200 ethanol plants now under construction or in >>planning and development. >> >>If all 190 plants on Mr. McIlvaine's list were built and used coal, >>motorists would not reduce America's greenhouse gas emissions, >>according to an in-depth analysis of the subject to date by >>scientists at University of California at Berkeley, published in >>Science magazine in January. >> >>Of course, many coal-fired ethanol plants on the drawing board will >>not be built, Mr. McIlvaine says. Others in planning for years may >>still choose natural gas as fuel to meet air pollution requirements >>in some states. >> >>Other variations on ethanol-coal are emerging in Goodland, Kan., and >>Underwood, N.D., where ethanol plants are being built next to >>coal-burning power plants to use waste heat. Efficient, but still >>coal. >> >>That could spell trouble for ethanol's renewable image. >> >>"If your goal is to reduce costs, then coal is a good idea," says >>Robert Brown, director of Iowa State University's office of >>biorenewables. "If the goal is a renewable fuel, coal is a bad idea. >>When greenhouse-gas emissions go up, environmentalists take note. >>Then you've got a problem." >> >>Ethanol industry officials say coal-power is just one possibility the >>industry is pursuing. >> >>"I think some in the environmental community won't be all that warm >>and fuzzy about [coal-fired ethanol]," says Bob Dinneen, president of >>the Renewable Fuels Association, the national trade association for >>the US fuel-ethanol industry. "It's fair to say there's a trend away >>from natural gas, but coal is just one approach. Other technologies >>are part of the mix, too." >> >>He cites, for instance, a new ethanol plant in Nebraska strategically >>located by a feed lot, using methane from cattle waste to fire >>ethanol boilers. Another new plant in Minnesota uses biomass >>gasification, using plant material as its fuel. >> >>Coal for now, wood in the future >> >>Coal may end up being merely a transitional fuel in the run-up to >>cellulosic ethanol, including switch grass and wood, says another RFA >>spokesman. While ethanol production today primarily uses only the >>corn kernel, cellulosic will use the whole plant. >> >>Cellulosic ethanol, mentioned by President Bush in his State of the >>Union speech, could turn the tide on coal, too, by burning plant >>dregs in the boiler with no need for coal at all. >> >>"It's a fact that ethanol is a renewable fuel today and it will stay >>that way," says Matt Hartwig, an RFA spokesman. "Any greenhouse-gas >>emissions that come out the tailpipe are recycled by the corn plant. >>I don't expect the limited number of coal-fired plants out there to >>change that." >> >>Still, Hawkins insists that if ethanol is made using coal, the carbon >>dioxide should be captured and injected into the ground. >> >>"We favor getting ethanol production up," Hawkins says. "But we >>obviously favor a cleaner process. We need large cuts in global >>warming emissions from transportation. It's not good enough for >>ethanol to simply be no worse than gasoline." >> >>Mark Clayton is a staff writer for the Christian Science Monitor. >> >>_______________________________________________ >>Biofuel mailing list >>Biofuel@sustainablelists.org >>http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org >> >>Biofuel at Journey to Forever: >>http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html >> >>Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 >>messages): >>http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ > > > > _______________________________________________ > Biofuel mailing list > Biofuel@sustainablelists.org > http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > > Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 > messages): > http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ > _______________________________________________ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
