They like: BIG cars. Perfect lawns - CHEMLAWN SUVS Huge houses Vinyl siding Endless structured "activities" for the kids (Jeez, give them a rest once in a while) working until 8 pm every night to afford the above
I tried all that: Monkey suit, real job, long hours big(er) house, big car (diesel Benz), it doesn't work for me. I'm happier doing what I do. That's why me and Keith are so rich. ;-) Another Mike Mark Manchester wrote: >Dear Mikes, >I'm on to you with wonderful Schumacher, what a delight. With your >neighbours, what IS their problem. This would clearly be an >unpleasant experience, first thing in the morning, when you step out >to smeeeellll the flowers. Now, me, my rainbarrels are municipally >supplied!!! The neighbourhood kids think it's so fun to come over >and get wet! I don't really know how to be sunny about your >neighbourly disparity, but humm, there must be some common ground >somewhere. What do THEY like to do? Play crib? >Further, I feel your presidential aspirations are entirely appropriate. >Jesse >On May 4, 2006, at 2:52 PM, Mike Weaver wrote: > > > >>There are too many Mikes around here. >> >>I'm familiar with Schumacher though it's been years since I read it. >>I'm working on a modified square foot gardening plan now. >> >>Other Mike: No. The immediate neighbors are MAD MAD MAD. They do >>not like: >>1. 12 year old p/u truck >>2. Trarped and stacked wood - quote "it's ugly" They also think >>freshly >>cut Oak stinks. >>3. They don't like the wood smoke >>4. They don't like my BD buddies coming by in 23 year old diesels >>5. My garden is ugly "You've ruined my view". >>6. My lawn is not perfect - I refuse to put weedkiller on it. >>7. I build stuff and make noise. >>8. I have rain barrels >>9. I move oil in big barrels >> >>But, there is a lot of interest in the groups close to my >>neighborhood - >>the local Democrats, parents at my kid's school, people who ask about >>the stickers on my VW, other wood heat nuts, and friends. I'm working >>on a BD coop. for my area. >> >> >> >> >>Keith Addison wrote: >> >> >> >>>Hello Mike >>> >>>I think you need to learn something about the Appropriate Technology >>>approach, essentially technology as if people mattered, the necessary >>>adjunct to Schumacher's "Small is beautiful - economics as if people >>>mattered". >>> >>>An introduction: >>>http://journeytoforever.org/at.html >>>Appropriate technology >>> >>>Generally seen as something for poor countries, but at least as >>>appropriate in rich countries. >>> >>>Best >>> >>>Keith >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>>Mike...during your neigborhood conversion from "neighborhood >>>>crank to having >>>>a steady stream of visitors and questions about BD," are the >>>>neighbors >>>>changing? If so, how? One of my concerns in my post in response >>>>to Keith >>>>is that not everyone will have the ability/interest to set up >>>>their own BD >>>>plant, as well as have access to feedstock. It seems to me, >>>>since you are >>>>already set up with some kind of access to feedstock, you could >>>>be the new >>>>neighborhood "gas pump." Don't you think??? Of course, once >>>>you, or >>>>someone, becomes this person, the community necessarily >>>>transforms your >>>>individual production into the need for an "industrial-scale >>>>process." In >>>>fact, the existence of a community that demands the lifestyle >>>>provided by BD >>>>or any fuel to run our machinery that gives us this lifestyle must >>>>necessarily adopt "industrial-scale" processes. Don't you think?? >>>>Presently, I do. Consequently, I'm especially interested in >>>>learning about >>>>any size community that has developed/is developing "industrial- >>>>scale >>>>processes (that) fit rational biofuels production," to use >>>>Keith's terms. >>>>Another Mike >>>> >>>>----- Original Message ----- >>>>From: "Mike Weaver" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>>To: <biofuel@sustainablelists.org> >>>>Sent: Thursday, May 04, 2006 8:27 AM >>>>Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Iogen - Post to List >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>FWIW - I have not bought ANY petro products for almost a year >>>>>now except >>>>>for diesel on one long trip and the least amount of NG as >>>>>possible for >>>>>cooking and showers. I hope to go to BD heating for water, or >>>>>get my BD >>>>>generator running and use electric. I heat with wood. >>>>> >>>>>I went from being the neighborhood crank to having a steady >>>>>stream of >>>>>visitors and questions about BD >>>>> >>>>>M&K DuPree wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>>Hi Keith...thanks so much for the links to info on Iogen and >>>>>>cellulosic >>>>>>ethanol generally. This whole area is very new to me. Somehow >>>>>>I have >>>>>>been >>>>>>blind for most of my 54 years to the extent that my lifestyle >>>>>>and general >>>>>>"world view" have been dependent upon and propped up by my >>>>>>dependence upon >>>>>>oil as an energy source. All of sudden I am seeing how out of >>>>>>my control >>>>>>my >>>>>>life really is. And to tell you and everyone the truth, I'm >>>>>>damned >>>>>>frightened, and angry, and depressed, and then...is that my .38 >>>>>>over >>>>>>there??? Somehow I have been able to keep the madness of this >>>>>>world at >>>>>>bay, >>>>>>but no more, all because of rising oil prices and my >>>>>>subsequently felt >>>>>>urgency to research and find alternative energy sources. This >>>>>>research >>>>>>has >>>>>>led me into the politics of the whole energy arena and >>>>>>ultimately a world >>>>>>view that, when I include not just me and mine, but the whole >>>>>>freakin 6.5 >>>>>>billion of us (and growing exponentially), has me pretty much >>>>>>freaked. >>>>>>Just >>>>>>another suburban kid gone over the edge (or perhaps, more >>>>>>accurately, come >>>>>>back from having been over the edge into dreamland into the >>>>>>reality of >>>>>>limited resources and the need for a stripped down lifestyle >>>>>>that takes >>>>>>into >>>>>>account the full extent of my actions). This side of the edge, >>>>>>however, >>>>>>isn't something I can easily make my own, because, it appears >>>>>>to me, if I >>>>>>am >>>>>>going to be able to truly regain what little sense of my self I >>>>>>might >>>>>>truly >>>>>>possess, I must be willing to put my tent on my back and just >>>>>>simply begin >>>>>>to wander and then keep wandering until I fall over dead (can't >>>>>>stop by >>>>>>the >>>>>>local Salvation Army for refreshment...that would only be >>>>>>dipping my toe >>>>>>back over the edge into dreamland again). Is this clear...or >>>>>>am I coming >>>>>>off as the probable lunatic I might really be??? >>>>>> Anyway, so I am curious about your own comments. I'm still >>>>>>reading >>>>>>through all the articles connected to the links you have >>>>>>shared, so maybe >>>>>>my >>>>>>questions will be answered along the way. Nonetheless, I want >>>>>>to ask them >>>>>>here: 1) in regards to "how well industrial-scale processes fit >>>>>>rational >>>>>>biofuels production," would you please explain in more detail? >>>>>>Also, >>>>>>perhaps >>>>>>lead me to a model industrial-scale process that DOES fit rational >>>>>>biofuels >>>>>>production? My immediate response to this has to do with a >>>>>>main point I >>>>>>have observed in my own interest in making biofuel: that this >>>>>>is not >>>>>>something me and all of my neighbors can do individually for >>>>>>various >>>>>>reasons, but especially because of limited feedstock and >>>>>>difficulty of >>>>>>distribution. Democracy does not extend to the realm of limited >>>>>>resources. >>>>>>I believe packaging of product for individuals has promoted this >>>>>>appearance. >>>>>>Consequently, it appears to me (and I could still be very blind >>>>>>on this >>>>>>point), we need some level of industrial-scale processes; and >>>>>>2) will you >>>>>>please explain further how "gobbling up crop wastes" is done >>>>>>"at the >>>>>>expense >>>>>>of soil fertility maintenance?" Please understand, I am in NO >>>>>>WAY trying >>>>>>to >>>>>>be argumentative. I really am profoundly concerned about our >>>>>>world >>>>>>situation today and how I can be on the helpful side of it all >>>>>>(knapsack >>>>>>and >>>>>>all???). I don't have that much time left on the planet, and >>>>>>I'd like to >>>>>>go >>>>>>down swinging. Thanks. Mike >>>>>> >>>>>>----- Original Message ----- >>>>>>From: "Keith Addison" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>>>>To: <biofuel@sustainablelists.org> >>>>>>Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2006 1:17 PM >>>>>>Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Iogen - Post to List >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>Hi Mike >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>>Hi...I'd like to hear the list's opinion about the process >>>>>>>>developed >>>>>>>>by Iogen to produce "cellulosic ethanol." Goldman Sachs >>>>>>>>announced >>>>>>>>yesterday (May 1) an investment of $30million Canadian in the >>>>>>>>company. Royal Dutch/Shell, Petro-Canada, and the Canadian >>>>>>>>Gov't >>>>>>>>have also all partnered with or are supporting Iogen. >>>>>>>> The first article below, by Sam Jaffe, an editor with The >>>>>>>>Scientist magazine, discusses cellulosic ethanol as well as a >>>>>>>>fuel >>>>>>>>cell developed by Lanny Scmidt. The second link is to the Iogen >>>>>>>>website itself. Thanks. Mike >>>>>>>>http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2004/0407.jaffe.html >>>>>>>>http://www.iogen.ca/ >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>Here's some previous discussion: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>http://snipurl.com/pxs2 >>>>>>>biofuel >>>>>>>Search results for 'iogen' >>>>>>>94 matches >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Ethanol from cellulose >>>>>>>http://journeytoforever.org/ethanol_link.html#cellulose >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Maybe it'll get off the ground now, it's been around for years >>>>>>>and >>>>>>>nothing happens. Like all the other ethanol-from-cellulose >>>>>>>projects. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>What bothers me about it, other than how well industrial-scale >>>>>>>processes fit rational biofuels production anyway, is that >>>>>>>cellulose >>>>>>>is widely regarded as "waste", but the soil that produced it >>>>>>>might >>>>>>>not think so. There's often plenty of cellulose about that isn't >>>>>>>utilised and could/should be harvested, but if Iogen et al start >>>>>>>gobbling up crop wastes at the expense of soil fertility >>>>>>>maintenance >>>>>>>then clean, green and sustainable biofuels won't be the result. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Best >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Keith >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>_______________________________________________ >>>Biofuel mailing list >>>Biofuel@sustainablelists.org >>>http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/ >>>biofuel_sustainablelists.org >>> >>>Biofuel at Journey to Forever: >>>http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html >>> >>>Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 >>>messages): >>>http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>_______________________________________________ >>Biofuel mailing list >>Biofuel@sustainablelists.org >>http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/ >>biofuel_sustainablelists.org >> >>Biofuel at Journey to Forever: >>http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html >> >>Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 >>messages): >>http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ >> >> >> >> > > >_______________________________________________ >Biofuel mailing list >Biofuel@sustainablelists.org >http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org > >Biofuel at Journey to Forever: >http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > >Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): >http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ > > > _______________________________________________ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
