Le 16/01/2023 à 17:23, David Haslam a écrit :
Seriously, what practical use are you proposing to make of the
transcribed WikiSource text?
It’s far from being fully proofread and validated, as only a cursory
inspection readily indicates.
I am not saying that. I just wanted to point out that we have access to
the text. This does not answer the questions we are interested in. How
to contribute to solve the bugs in the KJV.
For me I'm not going to continue discussing this. Neither you nor DM
Smith seem willing to involve others on this issue. So until we have a
solution like this, here is the link to the KJV where you can propose
your improvements, I won't discuss it anymore unnecessarily.
Personally, I'm not interested in the KJV. I have more important
projects for my own language.
And yes - it remains the case that the text of the KJV is protected by
Royal Letters Patent within the United Kingdom, and that in principle,
this copyright assertion should be upheld by subsequent mutual
treaties in those nations that were signatories of the Berne Convention.
I’ve even discussed this matter with a friend who has worked for many
years in the Bible Society (formerly known as the British and Foreign
Bible Society).
That digital versions of the KJV exist on numerous websites and
through a large variety of Bible software applications doesn’t negate
that.
David
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On Mon, Jan 16, 2023 at 15:49, Fr Cyrille <fr.cyri...@tiberiade.be>
wrote:
Dear David,
I must admit that I am a little surprised by this speech. What is
really protected by a copyright? The text of the KJV bible or the
work done on this text? In our other conversation it didn't seem to
me that it was Crosswire's contributions to the text that you were
trying to protect? You mentioned the copyrights of the English crown...
Thank you for clarifying this point. I don't know what you are
talking about when you say: "*It’s also a derived digital work - not
the actual reference printed hard copy of the 1789 Oxford (Blayney)
Edition*", and about the facsimile of DM Smith. Wikisource text it
the blayney edition. In any case if you are trying to protect the
crosswire additions to the text my surprise is even greater and I
agree perfectly with what Michael says.
Br Cyrille
PS: I would like to say that once again we are wasting our time to
know what to protect instead of looking for solutions to be able to
contribute effectively to solve the bugs related to the module.
Le 16/01/2023 à 15:52, David Haslam a écrit :
Aside: The KJV at WikiSource would only be relevant if someone were
wanting to create a text only KJV module. The CrossWire OSIS source
text is a long way further down the road than plain text. There’s
therefore no reason to keep mentioning it.
It’s also a derived digital work - not the actual reference printed
hard copy of the 1789 Oxford (Blayney) Edition.
At best it might be used to help locate any residual textual
differences that might yet be undiscovered in our KJV module, but
that would involve doing a comparison with the plain text that could
be easily exported from our module, and then checking any such diff
locations in the printed facsimile copy that DM Smith possesses.
Nobody in their right mind is proposing to start with the one at
WikiSource and insert all the feature rich OSIS XML markup that we
already have in the existing source text.
Regards,
David
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On Mon, Jan 16, 2023 at 13:22, Fr Cyrille <fr.cyri...@tiberiade.be>
wrote:
Le 16/01/2023 à 14:01, David Haslam a écrit :
A copy of this reply is sent*bcc*: to DM Smith's personal icloud
address.
Dear Fr Cyrille,
gitlab.com <https://gitlab.com> is simply the _wrong place_ to
host our *KJV* source text!
If necessary, it should be hosted *in-house* under
git.crosswire.org <https://git.crosswire.org> such that only
CrossWire volunteers have access.
*Important*: The KJV module is an _exception_ to our usual
practice of taking source text from a publicly accessible website
or third party supplier. It was always specially developed
*in-house* from the early days of CrossWire. Much of its
development history is documented in the developer wiki at
https://wiki.crosswire.org/CrossWire_KJV and related pages.
CrossWire volunteer *DM Smith* has long been the prime mover in
this process.
AFAIK, he still carries the main responsibility for future *KJV*
module releases.
NB. The related *KJVA*module should be maintained in parallel with
any changes envisaged for the *KJV*module. ie. Special provision
was made in 2014 to use two iterations of *osis2mod*such that the
/Deuterocanonical/books were appended to the /Protocanonical/books
using the *-a*option in the second command line. This implies that
the process needs to be an exception to a semiautomatic module
build script that DomCox now uses for OSIS modules. I helped DM in
the run up to when version *2.10* was released. At that time, we
had not been making use of any git type environment to keep track
of changes for either the KJV or KJVA module.
_Aside_: The emergency release of *KJV* version *2.10.2* was an
exception to the previous process. This was an /ad hoc/ action
that Troy deemed necessary because of the nature of the issue
being fixed.
I could add further observations, but this will need to suffice
for now.
Best regards,
David
Thank you David do put this information on the list so that
everyone can understand the problem. Personally I don't agree with
this restrictive view of KJV treatment but I had submitted to your
decision. Because I don't bring the same importance to this very
particular copyright claimed by the British Crown. The presence of
KJV on wikisource is a proof of this.
However, what I see is that we are still at square one, i.e. nobody
can do anything to improve the module. That's why I gave up, it's
this report of a new error that revives the discussion.
For me if we don't give the tools to the Crosswire community to
improve the module it's just doomed to stay as it is with its errors.
We could put the text on the right git, it would still be necessary
that you allow other users to work on your text, and that the
modification made in the emergency by Troy is validated in the
current version before making other corrections. The corrections
are extremely simple almost anyone can do it. The facsimile is on
wikisource.
https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Index:KJV_1769_Oxford_Edition,_vol._1.djvu
Best regards,
Br Cyrille
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------- Original Message -------
On Monday, January 16th, 2023 at 11:51 AM, Fr Cyrille
<fr.cyri...@tiberiade.be> wrote:
Le 16/01/2023 à 11:27, Fr Cyrille a écrit :
Le 12/01/2023 à 21:44, Matěj Cepl a écrit :
On 2023-01-12, 18:57 GMT, Fr Cyrille wrote:
Unfortunately, the work on KJV is currently at a standstill, and bugs
are piling up on the tracker. I wanted to offer my help but I didn't get
any answer. This is a problem that should be treated seriously,
considering the importance of the KJV.
Well, it would probably help if
https://gitlab.com/crosswire-bible-society/kjv/ actually
contained sources.
I tried to do this, but since some people say there are
copyrights issues on the KJV, although the full text is on
wikisource which has a very strict copyrights enforcement
policy, I gave up the project.
My attempt: https://gitlab.com/crosswire-bible-society/kjv
Best,
Matěj
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