Ok no problem. We can discuss that later over here if you have any question for me.
Sudhanshu Mishra On Fri, Mar 27, 2015 at 9:22 PM, Aaron Meurer <asmeu...@gmail.com> wrote: > I won't have a chance to look at this until after the deadline. > > Aaron Meurer > > On Fri, Mar 27, 2015 at 10:39 AM, Sudhanshu Mishra <mrsu...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > Aaron, > > > > I've updated(Added more description about execution and added timeline) > my > > proposal on wiki as well as on melange. Please have a look and let me > know > > if it looks good. > > > > Sudhanshu Mishra. > > > > On Thu, Mar 26, 2015 at 5:12 AM, Aaron Meurer <asmeu...@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> > >> Yep, I see them. You should be able to edit them up to the deadline. > >> > >> Aaron Meurer > >> > >> On Wed, Mar 25, 2015 at 6:24 PM, Sudhanshu Mishra <mrsu...@gmail.com> > >> wrote: > >> > I've submitted the proposals(PSF and NumFOCUS). Please confirm if it's > >> > visible to you. > >> > > >> > Title: "SymPy: Improving assumptions in SymPy" > >> > > >> > Sudhanshu Mishra > >> > > >> > On Thu, Mar 26, 2015 at 4:28 AM, Sudhanshu Mishra <mrsu...@gmail.com> > >> > wrote: > >> >> > >> >> Yeah. I'll submit them right now. I'll keep editing later. > >> >> I'm submitting my proposal to PSF and NumFOCUS only as it is related > to > >> >> SymPy only. > >> >> > >> >> Sudhanshu Mishra > >> >> > >> >> On Thu, Mar 26, 2015 at 4:23 AM, Aaron Meurer <asmeu...@gmail.com> > >> >> wrote: > >> >>> > >> >>> Don't forget to submit your proposal in Melange. I don't see it > there > >> >>> yet. > >> >>> > >> >>> Aaron Meurer > >> >>> > >> >>> On Wed, Mar 25, 2015 at 1:28 PM, Sudhanshu Mishra < > mrsu...@gmail.com> > >> >>> wrote: > >> >>> > Thanks for pointing these out. I'm a bit slow here because of > exams. > >> >>> > > >> >>> > > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> You should also mention my approach from > >> >>> >> https://github.com/sympy/sympy/pull/7925 to make the new > >> >>> >> assumptions > >> >>> >> read the old assumptions (add handlers). Also, technically, > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> > https://github.com/sympy/sympy/pull/2508/files#diff-e0f95401c86d07d90903363122990de0R227 > >> >>> >> is a way of doing this as well. I'm undecided on which of these > >> >>> >> (including adding to global assumptions) is the best. If you > have a > >> >>> >> preference, you should argue in the application why you think > it's > >> >>> >> the > >> >>> >> best one. > >> >>> > > >> >>> > > >> >>> > Seems like a good plan. I've to say that, I also like this( > >> >>> > https://github.com/sympy/sympy/pull/7926 > >> >>> > ) > >> >>> > approach. > >> >>> > But it has a blocking issue of weakref issue in the cache. > >> >>> > I'm adding my views on these in my proposal. > >> >>> > > >> >>> >> In the execution > >> >>> >> section, can you give your impression of how > >> >>> >> long/hard each item would be (or maybe the timeline is the > >> >>> >> appropriate > >> >>> >> place to do this). > >> >>> > > >> >>> > > >> >>> > I though of discussing this with you before writing it. Anyway, > I'll > >> >>> > write > >> >>> > it according to me. We can always alter it later. > >> >>> > > >> >>> >> What is the difference between "Making API of old assumptions > call > >> >>> >> new > >> >>> >> assumptions internally. The target would be to achieve minimum > >> >>> >> ripple > >> >>> >> effect throughout the codebase as the changes are made." and > "Once > >> >>> >> the > >> >>> >> new assumption is ready to handle things, start modifying the > >> >>> >> codebase > >> >>> >> so that expr.is_* syntax calls the new assumptions."? > >> >>> > > >> >>> > > >> >>> > As I've been maintaining two copies of my proposal, this one got > >> >>> > duplicated > >> >>> > while syncing. Sorry about that. I'll remove one of them. > >> >>> > > >> >>> >> Regarding the last bullet point, what exactly would the find and > >> >>> >> replace > >> >>> >> be? > >> >>> > > >> >>> > > >> >>> > Replacing the use of old assumptions with the new one. > >> >>> > > >> >>> > > >> >>> > Sudhanshu Mishra > >> >>> > > >> >>> > On Tue, Mar 24, 2015 at 9:43 PM, Aaron Meurer <asmeu...@gmail.com > > > >> >>> > wrote: > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> You should also mention my approach from > >> >>> >> https://github.com/sympy/sympy/pull/7925 to make the new > >> >>> >> assumptions > >> >>> >> read the old assumptions (add handlers). Also, technically, > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> > https://github.com/sympy/sympy/pull/2508/files#diff-e0f95401c86d07d90903363122990de0R227 > >> >>> >> is a way of doing this as well. I'm undecided on which of these > >> >>> >> (including adding to global assumptions) is the best. If you > have a > >> >>> >> preference, you should argue in the application why you think > it's > >> >>> >> the > >> >>> >> best one. > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> In the execution section, can you give your impression of how > >> >>> >> long/hard each item would be (or maybe the timeline is the > >> >>> >> appropriate > >> >>> >> place to do this). > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> What is the difference between "Making API of old assumptions > call > >> >>> >> new > >> >>> >> assumptions internally. The target would be to achieve minimum > >> >>> >> ripple > >> >>> >> effect throughout the codebase as the changes are made." and > "Once > >> >>> >> the > >> >>> >> new assumption is ready to handle things, start modifying the > >> >>> >> codebase > >> >>> >> so that expr.is_* syntax calls the new assumptions."? > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> Regarding the last bullet point, what exactly would the find and > >> >>> >> replace > >> >>> >> be? > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> Aaron Meurer > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> On Mon, Mar 23, 2015 at 7:52 PM, Sudhanshu Mishra > >> >>> >> <mrsu...@gmail.com> > >> >>> >> wrote: > >> >>> >> > I've updated the wiki. (Still far from complete) > >> >>> >> > > >> >>> >> > Please provide feedback on the matter so far. > >> >>> >> > > >> >>> >> > Places to look at: > >> >>> >> > > >> >>> >> > * The Project > >> >>> >> > * Execution > >> >>> >> > > >> >>> >> > > >> >>> >> > Sudhanshu Mishra > >> >>> >> > > >> >>> >> > On Sun, Mar 22, 2015 at 3:10 PM, Joachim Durchholz > >> >>> >> > <j...@durchholz.org> > >> >>> >> > wrote: > >> >>> >> >> > >> >>> >> >> Am 22.03.2015 um 01:04 schrieb Aaron Meurer: > >> >>> >> >>> > >> >>> >> >>> On Sat, Mar 21, 2015 at 2:57 PM, Joachim Durchholz > >> >>> >> >>> <j...@durchholz.org> > >> >>> >> >>> wrote: > >> >>> >> >>>> > >> >>> >> >>>> Am 21.03.2015 um 19:54 schrieb Aaron Meurer: > >> >>> >> >>>>>> > >> >>> >> >>>>>> > >> >>> >> >>>>>> I do not think the new assumptions should call the old > >> >>> >> >>>>>> assumptions. > >> >>> >> >>>>>> The > >> >>> >> >>>>>> new > >> >>> >> >>>>>> assumptions work by manipulating data structures, not by > >> >>> >> >>>>>> executing > >> >>> >> >>>>>> code. > >> >>> >> >>>>> > >> >>> >> >>>>> > >> >>> >> >>>>> They do execute code. See sympy.assumptions.handlers. > >> >>> >> >>>> > >> >>> >> >>>> > >> >>> >> >>>> > >> >>> >> >>>> Oh. I've been thinking that that was part of the old > >> >>> >> >>>> assumptions > >> >>> >> >>>> system. > >> >>> >> >>>> But what data is the SAT solver working with, then? > >> >>> >> >>> > >> >>> >> >>> > >> >>> >> >>> Currently, the known_facts > >> >>> >> >>> > >> >>> >> >>> > >> >>> >> >>> > >> >>> >> >>> > >> >>> >> >>> ( > https://github.com/sympy/sympy/blob/5507c86e70f816f95f87b868615502a44cac5853/sympy/assumptions/ask.py#L329-L377 > ). > >> >>> >> >>> In my branch, everything in that file. The known_facts are > >> >>> >> >>> what I > >> >>> >> >>> like to call the "free" facts, in that they can be written > down > >> >>> >> >>> completely free of the expression they apply to. For > instance, > >> >>> >> >>> Implies(Q.positive, Q.real). Facts that depend on the kind of > >> >>> >> >>> expression they apply to (like, if all terms in an Add are > >> >>> >> >>> positive, > >> >>> >> >>> then the whole expression is positive), aren't expressible > >> >>> >> >>> symbolically in the current new assumptions (but they are in > >> >>> >> >>> 2508). > >> >>> >> >> > >> >>> >> >> > >> >>> >> >> Oh, I see. > >> >>> >> >> > >> >>> >> >> I'd want go full length towards making all rules into data > >> >>> >> >> structures, > >> >>> >> >> no > >> >>> >> >> code execution at all (except for generic code to apply rules, > >> >>> >> >> obviously). > >> >>> >> >> I can't even give a hard reason for that, except that I know > >> >>> >> >> from > >> >>> >> >> experience that data is far easier to analyze and do something > >> >>> >> >> new > >> >>> >> >> and > >> >>> >> >> initially unexpected than code where this is essentially > >> >>> >> >> impossible. > >> >>> >> >> Also, > >> >>> >> >> all solvers that I know work that way. > >> >>> >> >> > >> >>> >> >> I don't know whether that would be a wise approach for SymPy, > or > >> >>> >> >> the > >> >>> >> >> right > >> >>> >> >> thing to do right now. > >> >>> >> >> I'm slightly worried that we might want to go full length to > >> >>> >> >> data-based > >> >>> >> >> solving after we get the SAT solver, and then have *three* > >> >>> >> >> solvers > >> >>> >> >> to > >> >>> >> >> deal > >> >>> >> >> with (because the old assumptions system won't die that > >> >>> >> >> quickly), > >> >>> >> >> so I > >> >>> >> >> still > >> >>> >> >> see a small advantage to going that direction right now. > >> >>> >> >> Downside of "right now" would be "who's going to do it" and > >> >>> >> >> "that's > >> >>> >> >> going > >> >>> >> >> to be even more work"... so I don't know enough to have a real > >> >>> >> >> position > >> >>> >> >> about what's the best way forward. > >> >>> >> >> > >> >>> >> >> -- > >> >>> >> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the > >> >>> >> >> Google > >> >>> >> >> Groups > >> >>> >> >> "sympy" group. > >> >>> >> >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from > >> >>> >> >> it, > >> >>> >> >> send > >> >>> >> >> an > >> >>> >> >> email to sympy+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > >> >>> >> >> To post to this group, send email to sympy@googlegroups.com. > >> >>> >> >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/sympy. > >> >>> >> >> To view this discussion on the web visit > >> >>> >> >> > >> >>> >> >> > >> >>> >> >> > >> >>> >> >> > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sympy/550E8E1E.3060701%40durchholz.org. > >> >>> >> >> > >> >>> >> >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > >> >>> >> > > >> >>> >> > > >> >>> >> > -- > >> >>> >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the > >> >>> >> > Google > >> >>> >> > Groups > >> >>> >> > "sympy" group. > >> >>> >> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from > it, > >> >>> >> > send > >> >>> >> > an > >> >>> >> > email to sympy+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > >> >>> >> > To post to this group, send email to sympy@googlegroups.com. > >> >>> >> > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/sympy. > >> >>> >> > To view this discussion on the web visit > >> >>> >> > > >> >>> >> > > >> >>> >> > > >> >>> >> > > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sympy/CAFW_KCS-B%3D2_bs%2BKJakG3fBucmPVB%2BsFfyYffF8G-RfWvndy%2Bg%40mail.gmail.com > . > >> >>> >> > > >> >>> >> > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> -- > >> >>> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the > Google > >> >>> >> Groups > >> >>> >> "sympy" group. > >> >>> >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, > >> >>> >> send > >> >>> >> an > >> >>> >> email to sympy+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > >> >>> >> To post to this group, send email to sympy@googlegroups.com. > >> >>> >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/sympy. > >> >>> >> To view this discussion on the web visit > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sympy/CAKgW%3D6LRH3j2ofpbg_PvH0Qf0qoRKJdebk2mL0%2BXEjj5x5vMfg%40mail.gmail.com > . > >> >>> >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > >> >>> > > >> >>> > > >> >>> > -- > >> >>> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > >> >>> > Groups > >> >>> > "sympy" group. > >> >>> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, > >> >>> > send > >> >>> > an > >> >>> > email to sympy+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > >> >>> > To post to this group, send email to sympy@googlegroups.com. > >> >>> > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/sympy. > >> >>> > To view this discussion on the web visit > >> >>> > > >> >>> > > >> >>> > > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sympy/CAFW_KCRYCx379a3YW82QyJF8gEMnKgfABSVEuiGi3izj%3Dx9ELQ%40mail.gmail.com > . > >> >>> > > >> >>> > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > >> >>> > >> >>> -- > >> >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > >> >>> Groups > >> >>> "sympy" group. > >> >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, > send > >> >>> an > >> >>> email to sympy+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > >> >>> To post to this group, send email to sympy@googlegroups.com. > >> >>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/sympy. > >> >>> To view this discussion on the web visit > >> >>> > >> >>> > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sympy/CAKgW%3D6%2Br6CtjEQ7j59%3D5d_TiaQ7Q_%2BOn%3DwFpGX6WE4SSg8AdaQ%40mail.gmail.com > . > >> >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > >> >> > >> >> > >> > > >> > -- > >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > >> > Groups > >> > "sympy" group. > >> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send > >> > an > >> > email to sympy+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > >> > To post to this group, send email to sympy@googlegroups.com. > >> > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/sympy. > >> > To view this discussion on the web visit > >> > > >> > > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sympy/CAFW_KCQaURSuFkheAySeqUrhw%3DRdy6Uqtr%3DVvY45zq%2B0PbzRmw%40mail.gmail.com > . > >> > > >> > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > >> > >> -- > >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups > >> "sympy" group. > >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send > an > >> email to sympy+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > >> To post to this group, send email to sympy@googlegroups.com. > >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/sympy. > >> To view this discussion on the web visit > >> > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sympy/CAKgW%3D6KfXFCw22PJfc6RZig5ydr2reTR%2BpweR1MeBEX6SrZs9w%40mail.gmail.com > . > >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > > > > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > "sympy" group. > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > > email to sympy+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > To post to this group, send email to sympy@googlegroups.com. > > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/sympy. > > To view this discussion on the web visit > > > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sympy/CAFW_KCTc03b0U9Edm%3Dh2qMQUgGu8%2BALMnrwFidn-Fh0PiJUwbw%40mail.gmail.com > . > > > > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "sympy" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to sympy+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to sympy@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/sympy. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sympy/CAKgW%3D6JMZh6O16%2BvjcW52ESRRAjcczguL2Rouk3k7jubHC0aoA%40mail.gmail.com > . > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "sympy" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to sympy+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to sympy@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/sympy. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sympy/CAFW_KCQO5HtiLUC1-7TTUQt%3DsgAoSJy7%3D8fdH5520tVpfE_%2BVA%40mail.gmail.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
