There is no club environment for a 21.00/1:51/4:05/14.00 hurdles/ level
athlete in this country after college ... because there is NO destination
for this athlete, competitively.
If a man has reached the 1:51/4:05 level by 23 (after, perhaps redshirting a
year) it is highly unlikely that he will ever reach the 1:47/3:42 (800/1500)
level they would need to be at to compete at the National level. They would
have already figured this out, when they failed to ever qualify for the NCAA
championships.
A 1:51/4:05 college senior is a good athlete, and a valuable part of the
team. However, he would have probably been around 1:55-56/4:13-16 for
800m/1600m in high school. I think most runners and college coaches would
agree with this.
By 23 years old, after 8 years of solid training, it is not likely this
level of athlete would improve the same amount (4 seconds/8 seconds) in the
800/1500m that he did while maturing from an 18 year old to a 22-23 year
old. A lot of his improvement from 1:55/4:15 to 1:51/4:05 comes EXCLUSIVELY
FROM MATURATION, and a lot comes from harder college training.
While improvement can (and does) occur from 24-28 ... there is very little
physiological maturation occurring at this age ... so you can't expect the
level of improvement experienced from 18 to 23 to continue. With time and
training (and financial support) he would more likely make it to 1:49 and
4:01 ... and most people would ask, "What good has this done? Except for
the individual?"
In sprinting and hurdling, the situation is even more pronounced. I have
never been a sprinter or a hurdler, but we all have to realize that even
though Michael Johnson continues to sprint at the highest levels at 33 ...
it is VERY UNUSUAL historically ... and physiologically. Usually by this
age many physical characteristics required for sprinting have started to
decline ... permanently. If you are 14.00 or 21.00 at 22-23, that is very
close to your lifetime potential in those events.
The likelihood of a 21.00 sprinter/14.00 hurdler/ (1:51/4:05) MD guy
becoming a 20.30/13.40/ 1:47/3:55 performer capable of something close to
the NATIONAL level is really LOW. You could throw money at this guy all
day, you could give him great coaches, and give four years to try and
develop ... but it wouldn't happen.
If the athlete was a 1:51/4:05 guy or a 10.70/21.00 sprinter in College ...
there was a reason. This level of athlete is not bound for the Olympics ...
he is bound for 5k road races and 4-on-4 basketball tournaments.
-Brian
-----Original Message-----
From: Conway [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Sunday, January 07, 2001 12:34 PM
To: Mike Trujillo; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: t-and-f: Re: Clubs
Mike Trujillo wrote:
> The Mikes (Roth and Rohl) and Ed all bring up some interesting
> points about the club system, or lack thereof, in this country. Another
> Mike (Platt) maintains that there IS a club system in place; I disagree
> with him.
> The club system, as it now exists, serves one of four different
> functions. It can be a youth/developmental club, aimed at introducing our
> sport to novices. It can be an elite club, producing national-level (and
> beyond) performers. It can be a masters club, which needs little
> explanation. Or it can be a social club, usually limited to runners, with
> little or no organized coaching or training.
> I think most of us can think of local examples of the first, third,
> and fourth types. (Here in what's known as the Quad Cities, we have only
> the last of these [Cornbelt Running Club], with a couple of small youth
> clubs on the horizon.) The second type is HSI, the Enclave, and a few
> others. The shoe companies are NOT clubs; they are sponsors.
> Illustrating story: I have a photo that Bill Leung took at the winter XC
> champs from Washington on the desktop of the computer in my classroom.
> Sometimes students will comment, "Wow that team is really good! Look at
> how many of their runners are in the front!" They're referring to the
Nike
> uniforms and assume (erroneously) that they are members of a team that
> trains together-after all, that's true for other sports, right? Same
> uniform means same team which means same coach, arena, etc.? Obviously,
> shoe companies aren't clubs.
> What's wrong with this picture? WHERE ARE THE POST-COLLEGIATE,
> SUB-ELITE, SUB-MASTERS, NON-SOCIAL CLUBS? There aren't more than a
handful
> of these in the country, and that IS the problem with our sport. There
> OUGHT to be a fifth type of club, are there just isn't. (For convenience,
> let's call this fifth type a True Club.)
While I am sure that there are lots of "track clubs" out there .. And a lot
of successful ones .. This is what I was thinking about when I asked the
initial questions about clubs .. There are many clubs here in Northern
California too .. A lot of them .. However, As Mike stated in his post they
are either social type clubs .. or Youth oriented clubs which basically
gives the kids something to do when they are not running for their schools
.. The HSI type clubs are few and as much as I am an HSI fan they are not
"developmental" / "grass roots" clubs .. They are businesses designed to
aid the elite Professional level athletes .. And that is great because they
need something too !!! Schools (primarily high schools and colleges) are the
"developmental programs" for the under 21 group of track athletes .. And
HSI, the Enclave and others will take care of the elite athletes over 21 ..
What is there for the 23 year old sprinter recently out of college with no
eligibility who is say a 21.00 sprinter .. Or a 14.00 hurdler .. Or a 1:51
half miler .. Or a 4:05 miler .. What is there for these athletes who may
just be developing physically and a couple of years or so away from maturity
in the sport ?? No offense but I don't think there is room for the 21.00 at
HSI .. Maybe if he could get down to 20.40/20.50 in a couple of years .. And
he may be ready to do that .. Except he doesn't have the opportunity .. It's
not too big a stretch to think that the 1:51 guy might be able to get to
1:46/1;47 in another year or two with the right work (and be in the thick of
it right now in the US) .. And given the recent thread regarding early
bloomers and late bloomers perhaps some of our best talent goes uncultivated
.. For lack of a system to help them .. And as Darrell alluded to in another
post that system is more than pulling people together to work out/train they
would also need a series of competitions to compete in .. And I am aware of
the "All Comers meets" that take place all over the country .. I am thinking
more along the lines of organized team competitions and championships ..
Perhaps regionally and then nationally .. Or some type of series of meets
here in the states that while the golden league is taking place in Europe,
guys running 10.40 - 10.60, 21.00 - 21.40, 46 - 47, 1:50 - 1:53 are going at
and honing their skills ... Where a 10.50 guy has a chance to get to 10.25
and go against "the big boys" ... Where in a National Championships setting
there are winning times of 10.31/20.90/45.99/1:49.80/3:45 .. With relays
that go 39.50/3:05 ... Guys (and girls) that are just short of Olympic trial
caliber who might get there in the next 4 years given an opportunity ...
That system would be developmental !!!!!
Conway Hill
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
