Dear Freddie,
I don't think I know you, and you are certainly entitled to your
opinion, but what under this world are you implying? I apologize if I am
misinterpreting what you wrote, but do you mean that most cavers now
(sport, science, whatever) are no longer caving for fun? I, for one,
don't willingly do very many things that I consider un-fun, and caving
is certainly not one of them. I have no disdain for any responsible
caver, nor do I know any other cavers who do.
As a scientist, expedition/project caver, and sometimes sport caver, I'd
like to point out that, without cave science, there would be a whole lot
fewer cavers actually going caving today. WNS is a good example. If cave
scientists (speleologists of all types) had not been involved in basic
research about WNS, policy decisions, decon protocol, and education,
caving may have pretty much been shut down in many areas.
Also, I take serious issue with your comment "...if anyone cares to read
such dry boring drivel". While you and many others may not enjoy reading
about science, if you can't at least respect and understand that it has
made our lives what they are today (including the ability to go caving
with more than a cedar torch), perhaps you should consider shunning the
use of all technologies and knowledge that science has advanced and
created and go back to living in a cave with a torch. Actually, I'm sure
that even the torch required some experimentation to find the best wood. :-)
You are correct; I don't consider your comments valid. Not because you
are not a PhD, but because they are a bit narrow minded and out of touch
with what your own organizations stand for. The NSS's founding mission
statement is: "*The National Speleological Society (NSS) is a non-profit
membership organization dedicated to the scientific study of caves and
karst; protecting caves and their natural contents through conservation,
ownership, stewardship, and public education; and promoting responsible
cave exploration and fellowship
among those interested in caves."*
The TSA's Constitution contains similar language: *"The purposes of TSA
are to promote (1) the study and science of speleology, (2) the
protection of caves and the preservation of natural and cultural
resources within caves, (3) the education of members and the
general public, and (4) communication and coordination of speleological
activities in the State of Texas. TSA supports the aims
and goals of the National Speleological Society."*
Note that while scientific study of caves is the first thing listed
(presumably because it was viewed as very important), science is not the
only thing listed. We (The NSS, TSA, etc) are organizations filled with
speleologists, project/expedition cavers, sport cavers, educators,
people who no longer cave, and even a few people who have never been in
a cave. It is time for some folks to stop acting like it is 'us' and
'them', and for everyone to recognize that it is the collective
interests of each person in these organizations, all of us as 'cavers',
that makes them what they are, and that all of us benefit in unseen ways
from this diversity. I, for one, am proud to be a part of these
organizations.
And finally, if folks don't like what is being published in the TC, then
stop complaining and write something different! And Mark, keep up the
good work!
Respectfully,
Benjamin Schwartz
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On May 17, 2012, at 8:34 AM, freddie poer <freddiepoe...@yahoo.com
<mailto:freddiepoe...@yahoo.com>> wrote:
I think that you will find a lot of us "unscientific" or sport cavers
agree with this. I think there should be a sport caving society formed,
that go caving just for the fun of it. Kind of like what the Texas
Cavers were twenty years ago. Maybe the caving community has gone a
little too far toward the scientific side. There are countless
scientific journals out there to cover the needs of the scientific
community, if anyone cares to read such dry boring drivel. The N.S.S.
and the T.S.A. was started by cavers to serve the needs of cavers, not
the academic or science communities. Cavers have drifted so far toward
the attitude that caving should only be done for expedition or
scientific research that the average sport caver is losing interest in
the organizations that were originally formed to benefit cavers. Most of
us started caving because it is fun, not because we were pursuing a
science related career. Now, many cavers look with disdain upon others
who go caving just for the fun of it. Maybe we should go back to being
cavers, and not feel like we have to justify every trip for training,
mapping, or scientific research. Or, we can watch the N.S.S. and Texas
Caver die a slow death, and start the National Sport Caving Society
(N.S.C.S.). This is just my opinion of course, and probably will not be
considered valid because I do not put the letters P.H.D. behind my name.
I am anxiously awaiting the backlash from the academic types.
Freddie I. Poer Jr. ( The Jr. is part of my name, not a paper title)
