texascavers Digest 8 Jun 2011 15:39:03 -0000 Issue 1328
Topics (messages 17991 through 18003):
rope pads
17991 by: Wayne Hutchinson
Re: LowGun's glow-in-the-dark quest
17992 by: Mark Minton
17993 by: John Brooks
Electroluminescent Products
17994 by: Mark Minton
Sarawak Chamber
17995 by: Mixon Bill
17996 by: Mark Minton
Re: Polypropylene rope and caving history
17997 by: Alex Sproul
17998 by: Diana Tomchick
17999 by: Don Cooper
18000 by: Logan McNatt
18001 by: Alex Sproul
Re: Dacron Rope
18002 by: Mark Minton
Pond Party and Sunday Swim
18003 by: pstrickland1.austin.rr.com
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I am cleaning house and found a 20 foot by 1 foot piece of carpet that will
make good rope pads. If anyone wants al ar part let me know
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Here's a highly reflective nylon rope that should be safe
for caving, although it's a bit thin at 5/16-inch
diameter:
<http://www.sterlingrope.com/product/0/PER084/_/8mm_PER_SafetyGlo>.
They also make accessory cord with similar reflective strips, which I
have seen on tent guy wires and the like. Very effective at night,
and it'll never run down like true glow-in-the-dark stuff.
Mark
At 04:35 AM 6/4/2011, Rod Goke wrote:
In the quest for "real caving ropes that glow-in-the-dark", you
might want to check out "glo rope"
http://www.glorope.com/catalog/detail.cfm?Prod_ID=102&Cat=1&SubCat=6
since they claim to make nylon double braided glow-in-the-dark rope
in sizes ranging from 1/8" (tensile strength 1,000 lbs.) to
1-1/4" (tensile strength 50,000 lbs.). They claim "This rope meets
all requirements of the US Military spec. MIL-R-2405-D.", whatever that is.
Please reply to [email protected]
Permanent email address is [email protected]
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For a project a year or two ago....we needed a very thin lighting system...and
we found a lighting product that came in flexible, fabric/vinyl like
sheets...and when electrical current was introduced....the material
illuminated like a light bulb. Interesting product. It wasn't particularly
bright and was extremely expensive. But it was flexible enough that one could
make luminescent knee pads or packs out of it....of course, the manufacturer
said the "lamp life" was only 1200 hours....So for long cave trips, you might
want a "back up" luminescent pack.
Sent from my iPhone
On Jun 4, 2011, at 3:35 AM, Rod Goke <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> Remember the Fibre-Metal hard hats that used to be popular with cavers.
> Fibre-Metal used to make a glow-in-the-dark model, which some cavers used and
> which didn't cost much more than their other color options. If LowGun
> succeeds in convincing cavers to use glow-in-the-dark ropes, then,
> undoubtedly, all the fashion conscious cavers out there will want
> glow-in-the-dark helmets to match. ;-) A number of companies do still make
> glow-in-the-dark helmets and hard hats, but I'm not sure how many, if any, of
> them are suitable for caving.
>
> In the quest for "real caving ropes that glow-in-the-dark", you might want to
> check out "glo rope"
>
> http://www.glorope.com/catalog/detail.cfm?Prod_ID=102&Cat=1&SubCat=6
>
> since they claim to make nylon double braided glow-in-the-dark rope in sizes
> ranging from 1/8" (tensile strength 1,000 lbs.) to 1-1/4" (tensile strength
> 50,000 lbs.). They claim "This rope meets all requirements of the US Military
> spec. MIL-R-2405-D.", whatever that is.
>
> They also advertise "Cave Rope" in sizes 1/16" (tensile strength 200 lbs.)
> and 3/32" (tensile strength 500 lbs.). I realize that recent generations of
> cavers have been trending towards the use of thiner climbing ropes, but isn't
> this getting a bit extreme!!! ;-) Perhaps they think "cave rope" is what
> spelunkers and cave divers unroll through passages so that they can find
> their way out.
>
> Who knows what additional caving equipment items some people might want to
> make easy to locate in the dark. Whatever it is, if you can't find a ready
> made glow-in-the-dark version, I suppose you could always try painting it
> with some of this
>
> http://www.hobbyglow.com/
>
> or wrapping it in some of these
>
>
> http://www.walgreens.com/store/c/night-light-lubricated-glow-in-the-dark-condoms/ID=prod396849-product
>
>
> ;-)
> Rod
>
> -----Original Message-----
> >From: Logan McNatt
> >Sent: Jun 3, 2011 10:06 PM
> >To: Cavers Texas
> >Subject: Re: [Texascavers] polypropylene
> >
> >I want to clarify that I sent the original message tongue-in-cheek; I was
> >not actually recommending that polypropylene rope is suitable for
> >caving. I was just surprised that "caves" is mentioned on the packaging. I
> >have enjoyed the comments. Do any of you know what would be
> >involved (and how much it would cost) to make real caving ropes that
> >glow-in-the-dark? LowGun
> >
> >On 6/3/2011 9:44 PM, Mixon Bill wrote:
> >> I once had polypropylene prusik slings. They worked fine, although I used
> >> them only once in a real pit (~100 ft), just to show that I could.
> >> About that time, Jumars came out, and I could afford the $18 to get a pair.
> >>
> >> A major problem with polypropylene is its low melting point, 130 to 170
> >> degrees C. You could easily get your brakebars hot enough to melt, or
> >> at least seriously degrade, polypropylene. There may once have been a
> >> fatal accident at Gaping Gill (340 feet) in England for that reason. The
> >> nylon used in caving ropes melts at 265C. -- Mixon
> >> ----------------------------------------
> >> No dolphins were killed in the preparation of this e-mail.
> >
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That sort of material is called electroluminescent. It
comes in sheets, tapes, and
cords. <http://electroluminescence-inc.com/>
<http://www.elwire.com/> I've seen it used as a tether for a helium
balloon, which looks really cool at night. It is also great for
Halloween costumes, which can have electroluminescent piping along
the seams, or sewn into designs. Here's an interesting video about
it:
<http://cnettv.cnet.com/systm-diy-electroluminescence/9742-1_53-50003905.html>.
It's also used in watch faces, car dashboards, etc., where it is much
better than old-style back- or side-lighting.
Mark
At 02:23 PM 6/5/2011, John Brooks wrote:
For a project a year or two ago....we needed a very thin lighting
system...and we found a lighting product that came in flexible,
fabric/vinyl like sheets...and when electrical current was
introduced....the material illuminated like a light bulb.
Interesting product. It wasn't particularly bright and was extremely
expensive. But it was flexible enough that one could make
luminescent knee pads or packs out of it....of course, the
manufacturer said the "lamp life" was only 1200 hours....So for long
cave trips, you might want a "back up" luminescent pack.
Please reply to [email protected]
Permanent email address is [email protected]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
A brief report in Descent 220, June/July 2011, on a recent expedition
to Mulu National Park in Sarawak says that a laser scan was made of
the Sarawak Chamber, the largest cave room in the world. It was
scanned from nine places within it. It was also photographed with a
digital camera with the aim of producing a panarama of the whole room.
The main photographic effort used 115 PF300 flashbulbs, but evidently
an additional set of photos was made using Scurion caving lights--
perhaps the only thing I've heard of that would justify the cost of
those things.
The floor area of the Sarawak Chamber is 162,700 square meters, or a
bit over 40 acres.
On the subject of laser scans and photographs, whatever became of that
project at Devils Sinkhole? The in-cave part of that ended quite some
time ago. The plan was to make a 3-D model with actual photos of the
walls draped over it. Can that be seen somewhere?--Mixon
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That would have been an incredibly expensive photo session
to shoot. According to one web site, PF300 flashbulbs sell for $600
per case of 48. Of course the expedition may have been sponsored by
the bulb maker and gotten them cheap or free. They are also big,
like the size of a large household light bulb. Just carrying 300 of
those into a cave would have been a significant effort.
Mark
At 09:28 PM 6/5/2011, Mixon Bill wrote:
A brief report in Descent 220, June/July 2011, on a recent expedition
to Mulu National Park in Sarawak says that a laser scan was made of
the Sarawak Chamber, the largest cave room in the world. It was
scanned from nine places within it. It was also photographed with a
digital camera with the aim of producing a panarama of the whole room.
The main photographic effort used 115 PF300 flashbulbs, but evidently
an additional set of photos was made using Scurion caving lights--
perhaps the only thing I've heard of that would justify the cost of
those things.
The floor area of the Sarawak Chamber is 162,700 square meters, or a
bit over 40 acres.
Please reply to [email protected]
Permanent email address is [email protected]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
LowGun wrote:
>Some of you probably have seen this before, but I had not until a
>Memorial Day visit to Harbor Freight Tools.
>"This 100% polypropylene rope includes fluorescent material that
>can be charged with either natural or artificial light and will then
>glow for up to 5 hours when placed in the dark.
I offer for your perusal these phosphorescent caving and rescue
products from Pigeon Mountain Industries:
PMI Lumi-Line http://tinyurl.com/4y2k658
PMI NiteLine http://tinyurl.com/3rylfml
They used to also make 11mm and 13.5mm static nylon caving
ropes of 100% phosphorescent yarn that was quite bright. I still
have a sample piece that gives me a start when I encounter it in
the dark. These products apparently priced themselves out of the
market.
The 3mm NiteLine, though expensive, remains quite popular for
tent guylines in close quarters like OTR...
Alex
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--- Begin Message ---
> PMI Lumi-Line http://tinyurl.com/4y2k658
>
> PMI NiteLine http://tinyurl.com/3rylfml
>
> They used to also make 11mm and 13.5mm static nylon caving ropes of 100%
> phosphorescent yarn that was quite bright. I still have a sample piece that
> gives me a start when I encounter it in the dark. These products apparently
> priced themselves out of the market.
Besides, who wants to expose their nylon caving ropes to "extended exposure to
a light source" just so it will glow for 7 hours? Not good for the rope.
Diana
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Diana R. Tomchick
Associate Professor
University of Texas Southwestern Medical Center
Department of Biochemistry
5323 Harry Hines Blvd.
Rm. ND10.214B
Dallas, TX 75390-8816, U.S.A.
Email: [email protected]
214-645-6383 (phone)
214-645-6353 (fax)
________________________________
UT Southwestern Medical Center
The future of medicine, today.
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--- Begin Message ---
Diana - I'm not of the opinion that it's enough light to do damage. :-)
But speaking of the history of caving rope -
I saw the transition of nylon parachute lines (550 cord) to dacron and later
to kevlar. Dacron is still.
Dacron has some fine qualities - viscous damping for instance. Not
"stretchy" but not completely static either.
Any ideas why (it seems that) it was never used for climbing or caving?
-WaV
On Mon, Jun 6, 2011 at 11:33 AM, Diana Tomchick <
[email protected]> wrote:
> > PMI Lumi-Line http://tinyurl.com/4y2k658
> >
> > PMI NiteLine http://tinyurl.com/3rylfml
> >
> > They used to also make 11mm and 13.5mm static nylon caving ropes of 100%
> phosphorescent yarn that was quite bright. I still have a sample piece that
> gives me a start when I encounter it in the dark. These products apparently
> priced themselves out of the market.
>
> Besides, who wants to expose their nylon caving ropes to "extended exposure
> to a light source" just so it will glow for 7 hours? Not good for the rope.
>
> Diana
>
> * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
> Diana R. Tomchick
> Associate Professor
> University of Texas Southwestern Medical Center
> Department of Biochemistry
> 5323 Harry Hines Blvd.
> Rm. ND10.214B
> Dallas, TX 75390-8816, U.S.A.
> Email: [email protected]
> 214-645-6383 (phone)
> 214-645-6353 (fax)
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> UT Southwestern Medical Center
> The future of medicine, today.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> Visit our website: http://texascavers.com
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> For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected]
>
>
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Alex, thanks for the info. I'm surprised no one had mentioned it before.
Logan (LowGun)
On 6/6/2011 10:34 AM, Alex Sproul wrote:
I offer for your perusal these phosphorescent caving and rescue products from
Pigeon Mountain Industries:
PMI Lumi-Line _http://tinyurl.com/4y2k658_
PMI NiteLine _http://tinyurl.com/3rylfml_
They used to also make 11mm and 13.5mm static nylon caving ropes of 100% phosphorescent yarn that was quite bright. I still have a sample
piece that gives me a start when I encounter it in the dark. These products apparently priced themselves out of the market.
The 3mm NiteLine, though expensive, remains quite popular for tent guylines in
close quarters like OTR...
Alex
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--- Begin Message ---
>I'm surprised no one had mentioned it before.
So was I! Becky Jones is on the list; I'd have thought she'd pipe
up. I did ask the PMI folks about the larger caving rope -- which
they had dubbed "PIT Glow." It was discontinued in 2006 due to
poor sales (i.e., too expensive).
Good to hear from ya, Logan!
Alex
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Dacron is polyester. There are polyester ropes, such as
that made by
Sterling: <http://www.sterlingrope.com/products/155017> It is fine
for caving. I don't know why it is not called Dacron. That's
probably someone's specific trade name, and any other company or
slightly different formulation is called something else.
Mark
At 06:00 PM 6/6/2011, Don Cooper wrote:
But speaking of the history of caving rope -
I saw the transition of nylon parachute lines (550 cord) to dacron
and later to kevlar. Dacron is still.
Dacron has some fine qualities - viscous damping for instance. Not
"stretchy" but not completely static either.
Any ideas why (it seems that) it was never used for climbing or caving?
-WaV
Please reply to [email protected]
Permanent email address is [email protected]
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The Pond Party is this Saturday. The last Sunday Swim (until it rains a lot)
is 8 days later on June 19th.
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