texascavers Digest 20 May 2010 00:31:27 -0000 Issue 1053
Topics (messages 14781 through 14808):
Re: Bomber Gear site launch
14781 by: Stephen Fleming
14782 by: Stefan Creaser
14790 by: Nico Escamilla
14791 by: Joe Ranzau
14792 by: Mallory Mayeux
14793 by: Alex Sproul
Neanderthals and Humans
14783 by: mminton.caver.net
Is this noteworthy ?
14784 by: David
14785 by: David
14786 by: Sheryl Rieck
14787 by: Gill Edigar
14788 by: Brian Riordan
14789 by: Rod Goke
Re: Bombed Bomber Gear
14794 by: dirtdoc.comcast.net
14795 by: Joe Ranzau
Pond Party & Sunday Swims
14796 by: pstrickland1.austin.rr.com
East Texas Caver's Cookout - update
14797 by: David
Bomber Gear knee and elbow pads
14798 by: speleosteele.tx.rr.com
14799 by: Andy Gluesenkamp
New map of WNS transmission from BCI
14800 by: Diana Tomchick
14801 by: Charles Goldsmith
14802 by: Jim Kennedy
14803 by: Charles Goldsmith
14804 by: Jim Kennedy
Re: WNS in Oklahoma
14805 by: Mark Minton
14806 by: Jim Kennedy
More on Bomber
14807 by: Alex Sproul
Dr Ann Scott in the news- I only know one...
14808 by: A. Wertheim
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
--- Begin Message ---
On 05/18/2010 7:40, Joe Ranzau wrote:
Folks, Bomber Gear is back! For new folks, they made what some of us
considered to be the best knee pad out there. They are not selling
online right now but I have emailed with the owner and he assures me
they are coming soon. He also says he has some left from the old days
if you need one right now!
You might want to check out http://www.theonlygear.com/products/caving.html
They make what I consider to be the best kneepad. Very nice.
They are available now.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I just checked the site and everything is on backorder, so *not*
available now ;-)
-----Original Message-----
From: Stephen Fleming [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2010 10:07 AM
To: Joe Ranzau
Cc: Cavers Texas
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Fwd: Bomber Gear site launch
On 05/18/2010 7:40, Joe Ranzau wrote:
> Folks, Bomber Gear is back! For new folks, they made what some of us
> considered to be the best knee pad out there. They are not selling
> online right now but I have emailed with the owner and he assures me
> they are coming soon. He also says he has some left from the old days
> if you need one right now!
>
You might want to check out
http://www.theonlygear.com/products/caving.html
They make what I consider to be the best kneepad. Very nice.
They are available now.
--
IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are
confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient,
please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any
other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information in any
medium. Thank you.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
All
Bomber Gear has been trying to make a comeback for a few years now.. soon
they keep saying.
I thought they'd be in full swing when I saw the subject on this email..
back to my corner
Nico
On Tue, May 18, 2010 at 10:19 AM, Stefan Creaser <[email protected]>wrote:
> I just checked the site and everything is on backorder, so *not*
> available now ;-)
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Stephen Fleming [mailto:[email protected]]
> Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2010 10:07 AM
> To: Joe Ranzau
> Cc: Cavers Texas
> Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Fwd: Bomber Gear site launch
>
> On 05/18/2010 7:40, Joe Ranzau wrote:
> > Folks, Bomber Gear is back! For new folks, they made what some of us
> > considered to be the best knee pad out there. They are not selling
> > online right now but I have emailed with the owner and he assures me
> > they are coming soon. He also says he has some left from the old days
>
> > if you need one right now!
> >
>
> You might want to check out
> http://www.theonlygear.com/products/caving.html
>
> They make what I consider to be the best kneepad. Very nice.
>
> They are available now.
>
>
> --
> IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are
> confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended
> recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the
> contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the
> information in any medium. Thank you.
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected]
> For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected]
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Nico, Stefan did not mean Bomber Gear, their stuff is ready now. Just
so happens Kayak gear is a MUCH larger market than Caving Gear.
Joe
On Tue, May 18, 2010 at 11:54 AM, Nico Escamilla <[email protected]> wrote:
> All
>
> Bomber Gear has been trying to make a comeback for a few years now.. soon
> they keep saying.
> I thought they'd be in full swing when I saw the subject on this email..
> back to my corner
>
> Nico
>
> On Tue, May 18, 2010 at 10:19 AM, Stefan Creaser <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>>
>> I just checked the site and everything is on backorder, so *not*
>> available now ;-)
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Stephen Fleming [mailto:[email protected]]
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2010 10:07 AM
>> To: Joe Ranzau
>> Cc: Cavers Texas
>> Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Fwd: Bomber Gear site launch
>>
>> On 05/18/2010 7:40, Joe Ranzau wrote:
>> > Folks, Bomber Gear is back! For new folks, they made what some of us
>> > considered to be the best knee pad out there. They are not selling
>> > online right now but I have emailed with the owner and he assures me
>> > they are coming soon. He also says he has some left from the old days
>>
>> > if you need one right now!
>> >
>>
>> You might want to check out
>> http://www.theonlygear.com/products/caving.html
>>
>> They make what I consider to be the best kneepad. Very nice.
>>
>> They are available now.
>>
>>
>> --
>> IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are
>> confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended
>> recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the
>> contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the
>> information in any medium. Thank you.
>>
>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Visit our website: http://texascavers.com
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected]
>> For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected]
>>
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I was SUPEREXCITED to see this...I love Bomber Gear kneepads!
However, I called them back in January '09 b/c there wasn't any caving gear
available on their website, and they said knee/elbow pads would be ready by
April of that year. So I'm a little bit cynical, but hopefully they will be
up and running soon.
Until then, Crawldaddies are an excellent substitute. :)
Mallory
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Joe Ranzau said:
>Folks, Bomber Gear is back! For new folks, they made what some of
>us considered to be the best knee pad out there.
I, for one, am amazed to learn that. The hutzpah involved is
phenomenal.
Bomber Gear was started back in 1996 by three college roomies in
Durango, CO. They were a starving start-up, leveraged by maxxed-out
credit cards, and -- being cavers -- began by making only caving knee
and elbow pads themselves. IMO was their only retailer, and I helped
them with their business model and designs. As they grew, they hired
Native American laborers. Then they discovered paddle sports and its
much larger market, and caving pads became a sideline, and eventually
just an annoyance. Pads becane increasingly hard to get as their paddle
line expanded.
Volume became such that they began outsourcing work to a company in
Thailand. Pads were available in fits and starts, since they were sewn in
Thailand, shipped infrequently in bulk, and filled with foam in Colorado,
and there were times when no foam was available.
Then, Bomber Gear essentially imploded overnight in 2005. A huge
spring pre-season order coming from Thailand just disappeared, leaving
them with a huge debt and no product to sell. Then, two of the partners
discovered that the third had turned on them and raped the company,
making off with all their cash, their product specs and patterns, and their
customer list, and leaving the country. Bomber Gear just disappeared off
the radar, with the two partners immersed in debt, lawsuits, and attempts
to recover their losses. Bomber products started showing up on eBay,
and I got several offers from no-name companies wanting to sell me
what clearly were relabeled Bomber pads. The Thai company they'd
outsourced to offered to forgive their debt if they would sell them the
company at a loss. Clearly, they were in cahoots with the missing
partner. I don't know how all that turned out, as the Bomber boys (Rob
and John) quickly became unreachable, and wouldn't return calls or e-mails.
The culprit was third partner Rick Franken, who apparently never got
caught, and now has the audacity to revive the company as a solo
operation.
Personally, I would never buy a Bomber Gear product, now or ever, from
a guy who screwed over his two college roommates like that. The
market flowed in and filled Bomber's footprint; there are other, better
knee and elbow pads out there now, so there's no need to patronize this
slimeball.
Alex
PS The Bomber Gear Web site has now crashed -- was it just exceeded
bandwidth, or a DOS attack?
--
Alex Sproul
NSS 8086RL/FE
NSS Webmaster
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Recent genetic evidence may point to interbreeding of
Neanderthals and humans.
<http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/07/science/07neanderthal.html> Maybe
this is where cavers came from. :-)
Mark Minton
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
http://www.foxnews.com/images/605410/0_61_320_oldest_sex_toy.jpg
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,593072,00.html
David Locklear
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
http://www.foxnews.com/images/605410/0_61_320_oldest_sex_toy.jpg
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,593072,00.html
David Locklear
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I think so!
Sheryl
-----Original Message-----
From: David [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2010 10:45 AM
To: Cavers Texas
Subject: [Texascavers] Is this noteworthy ?
http://www.foxnews.com/images/605410/0_61_320_oldest_sex_toy.jpg
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,593072,00.html
David Locklear
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Visit our website: http://texascavers.com
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected]
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Better we call it a 'multi-purpose tool' than a sex toy.
--Ediger
On Tue, May 18, 2010 at 10:45 AM, David <[email protected]> wrote:
> http://www.foxnews.com/images/605410/0_61_320_oldest_sex_toy.jpg
>
> http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,593072,00.html
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Was it used literally to start fires, or is that a metaphorical meaning?
Also, was this the original look of the tool, or did some teenager alter the
fire starter as a joke. I see these types of "jokes" in public restrooms
all the time...
On Tue, May 18, 2010 at 11:00 AM, Gill Edigar <[email protected]> wrote:
> Better we call it a 'multi-purpose tool' than a sex toy.
> --Ediger
>
>
> On Tue, May 18, 2010 at 10:45 AM, David <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> http://www.foxnews.com/images/605410/0_61_320_oldest_sex_toy.jpg
>
>
>
>>
>> http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,593072,00.html
>>
>>
--
Brian Riordan
979-218-8009 (Mobile)
[email protected]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
hardly
;)
-----Original Message-----
>From: David <[email protected]>
>Sent: May 18, 2010 10:45 AM
>To: Cavers Texas <[email protected]>
>Subject: [Texascavers] Is this noteworthy ?
>
>http://www.foxnews.com/images/605410/0_61_320_oldest_sex_toy.jpg
>
>
>http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,593072,00.html
>
>David Locklear
>
>---------------------------------------------------------------------
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>To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected]
>For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected]
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thanks, Alex, for The Rest of the Story. I'd heard part of that and was a bit
amazed myself.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Alex Sproul" [email protected]
I, for one, am amazed to learn that. The hutzpah involved is phenomenal.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
That does add new perspective...
Joe
On May 18, 2010, at 6:32 PM, [email protected] wrote:
Thanks, Alex, for The Rest of the Story. I'd heard part of that and
was a bit amazed myself.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Alex Sproul" [email protected]
I, for one, am amazed to learn that. The hutzpah involved is
phenomenal.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Jocie and I have set the dates for five Sunday Swims and our big event of the
year, the Pond Party. June 6th,20th, and 27th - Sunday Swims 2:00 - 6:00 or so.
Saturday July 10th - POND PARTY 2:00 - late nite (food at 6:00) July 18th &
25th - Sunday Swims 2:00 - 6:00 or so. Mark it down Pete.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I hope this is my last post prior to the Cookout.
Just a few more days until the Cookout near Brenham.
Here is another map:
http://www.bing.com/maps/#JmNwPTMwLjE3MjI5MjkyNTQxNzQzfi05Ni41MDkzMjI2MzU4Mjk0NSZsdmw9MTcmc3R5PXImcnRwPXBvcy4zMC4xNzExODdfLTk2LjUwNjg0NV8yMDUwJTIwSGFwcHklMjBIb2xsb3clMjBSZCUyQyUyMEJyZW5oYW0lMkMlMjBUWCUyMDc3ODMzX19fZV9+cG9zLjMwLjE3MTM3ODYyNzQxOTQ3Xy05Ni41MTE4MDA2NjE2ODMwOF8yNTAwJTIwSGFwcHklMjBIb2xsb3clMjBSZCUyQyUyMEJyZW5oYW0lMkMlMjBUWCUyMDc3ODMzLTY4NjVfX19lXyZtb2RlPUQmcnRvcD0wfjB+MH4=
Hold the cursor over the word Aerial. A pop-up menu will show the
option Bird's Eye. Click on that.
After that, you can click on South on the compass and also zoom in, to
get a different view of Camp Happy Hollow.
The entire camp is already paid for 3 days for my family and 4 other cavers.
The white structure is a picnic pavilion with restroom. The larger
structure is an indoor dining hall with
indoor kitchen.
And the grey rectangles hidden in the forest are the covered picnic
tables of each of the 18 spacious campsites.
You can also spot a rustic amphitheater with wood bench seating.
I plan to do some bicycling up and down the road in front of the camp
with my daughter and any cavers
that want to join us. I hope to find some time to relax in a
hammock under 2 of those oak trees.
It is o.k. to stop by just for a few minutes if your schedule is too
hectic. I will have some food out for breakfast,
lunch and hopefully a full course meal for dinner, which will
definitely include canned beans, and canned fruit.
You don't even need to bring anything. I have reserved a U-haul
van, and it should be full of cots, tents, bicycles and
various cooking gadgets and picnic supplies by Saturday morning.
One caver has volunteered to
bring avocados, and another cheese, and another made a respectable
financial donation.
I will be spending my spare time over the next 3 days, trying to get
the Cookout in gear. ( I am not sure if I am going
to have any spare time though. )
David Locklear
host of the Cookout
281-960-0687
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
What you told us about the history of Bomber Gear is very interesting, Alex,
thanks.
I own some Bomber Gear knee and elbow pads and have an opinion about them.
I think that they're lightweight for lightweight caving. If you get into
sticky mud the Velcro on the knee pads fails to hold and the pads come loose.
And they tend to move around to the back of your calves in squeezes. I take
mine on caving trips as my loaners. I don't use them anymore.
The elbow pads drive me nuts. They've got an overlap of material which
is like the eave of a house that catches when you take your pack off.
It's aggravating as hell when in the type of cave where you repeatedly
have to take your pack off and put it back on because of squeezes or
crawls interspersed with walking passages.
But for lightweight, easy caving, they're fine. There are better kneepads
out there for the same money, and besides, who wants to support the
the business of the sort of guy that Alex has told us about anyway?
Good cavin',
Bill
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I've never tried Bomber Gear pads but I have had good luck with homemade pads.
Just get an old wetsuit (Ask your local diveshop for any junker rentals. I
look for the ones with reinforced knees.) and cut the knees off of it (about
1ft long chunk) and then cut two tennisball-sized holes in the back to make
three wide straps. They fit, they stay, they wear well. I once wore a pair
driving all the way from the Brinco fieldhouse back to the border.
The problem with most pads is buckles and/or velcro. For example: those damned
buckles on GGG pads are impossible to adjust once they've seen mud. They are
ok as emergency rope pads though.
Andy
Andrew G. Gluesenkamp, Ph.D.
700 Billie Brooks Drive
Driftwood, Texas 78619
(512) 799-1095
[email protected]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Check it out:
http://www.batcon.org/images/stories/WNS_StatusMap_20100519_WNS_WebpageLarge.jpg
Diana
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Diana R. Tomchick
Associate Professor
University of Texas Southwestern Medical Center
Department of Biochemistry
5323 Harry Hines Blvd.
Rm. ND10.214B
Dallas, TX 75390-8816, U.S.A.
Email: [email protected]
214-645-6383 (phone)
214-645-6353 (fax)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Are the reports from western Oklahoma too recent for this?
Charles
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 3:13 PM, Diana Tomchick <
[email protected]> wrote:
> Check it out:
>
>
> http://www.batcon.org/images/stories/WNS_StatusMap_20100519_WNS_WebpageLarge.jpg
>
> Diana
>
> * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
> Diana R. Tomchick
> Associate Professor
> University of Texas Southwestern Medical Center
> Department of Biochemistry
> 5323 Harry Hines Blvd.
> Rm. ND10.214B
> Dallas, TX 75390-8816, U.S.A.
> Email: [email protected]
> 214-645-6383 (phone)
> 214-645-6353 (fax)
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> Visit our website: http://texascavers.com
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected]
> For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected]
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
We are waiting for official confirmation to include Oklahoma. A press
release is expected later today. We know the folly of relying on the
internet as your sole source of information. J
Jim "Crash" Kennedy
Cave and Mine Resources Specialist
Bat Conservation International
From: Charles Goldsmith [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2010 3:15 PM
To: Diana Tomchick
Cc: Cave Tex; DFWgrotto; Metroplexcavers
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] New map of WNS transmission from BCI
Are the reports from western Oklahoma too recent for this?
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 3:13 PM, Diana Tomchick
<[email protected]> wrote:
http://www.batcon.org/images/stories/WNS_StatusMap_20100519_WNS_WebpageL
arge.jpg
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I assumed as much. Jim, or anyone, it was said that this expansion to
Oklahoma was definitely a human transmission, not via a bat colony. Is this
because there are no bats that go between Oklahoma and any other infected
area?
I thought I had read a while back that all of the experts were pretty sure
that it was only transmitted via bat, that they didn't think that humans
were the cause of the spread, but I cannot find that tidbit, so I'm not sure
how reliable that is.
Care to clarify, or point me to a link if you have one.
Thanks
Charles
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 3:21 PM, Jim Kennedy <[email protected]> wrote:
> We are waiting for official confirmation to include Oklahoma. A press
> release is expected later today. We know the folly of relying on the
> internet as your sole source of information. J
>
>
>
> Jim “Crash” Kennedy
>
> Cave and Mine Resources Specialist
>
> Bat Conservation International
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Charles Goldsmith [mailto:[email protected]]
> *Sent:* Wednesday, May 19, 2010 3:15 PM
> *To:* Diana Tomchick
> *Cc:* Cave Tex; DFWgrotto; Metroplexcavers
> *Subject:* Re: [Texascavers] New map of WNS transmission from BCI
>
>
>
> Are the reports from western Oklahoma too recent for this?
>
>
>
> On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 3:13 PM, Diana Tomchick <
> [email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>
> http://www.batcon.org/images/stories/WNS_StatusMap_20100519_WNS_WebpageLarge.jpg
>
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
No one responsible has said that the OK occurrence is human-transmitted.
We have zero evidence to prove that one way or another. Let's not start
groundless speculation.
-- Jim
From: Charles Goldsmith [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2010 3:22 PM
To: Jim Kennedy
Cc: Diana Tomchick; Cave Tex; DFWgrotto; Metroplexcavers
Subject: Re: New map of WNS transmission from BCI
I assumed as much. Jim, or anyone, it was said that this expansion to
Oklahoma was definitely a human transmission, not via a bat colony. Is
this because there are no bats that go between Oklahoma and any other
infected area?
I thought I had read a while back that all of the experts were pretty
sure that it was only transmitted via bat, that they didn't think that
humans were the cause of the spread, but I cannot find that tidbit, so
I'm not sure how reliable that is.
Care to clarify, or point me to a link if you have one.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The assumption of human transmission is further elaborated
in this post from another list:
WNS is in Oklahoma
By: Andy Harris (Oklahoma City, Oklahoma)
[email protected]
Got confirmation today from Bill Steele that WNS has been found in a
Myotis velifer colony in western Oklahoma. This crosses the
eastern/western flora fauna line of the United States. This is grave
news I believe, because the cave Myotis is a very robust species and
is the prolific bat in western Oklahoma gypsum caves. There are very
large colonies found across the western half of the state. This jump
shows a very large gap from eastern Missouri to western Oklahoma,
with a question as to the method of transmission. Myotis do not
frequent eastern Oklahoma, and Gray bats do not frequent western
Oklahoma. There are no caves that both species are found in or
share.... and the space between the closest roost sites is several
hundred miles.
I feel this is very grave news.
Keith (Andy) Harris Edmond, OK
------------------------------------
Mark Minton
At 04:37 PM 5/19/2010, Jim Kennedy wrote:
No one responsible has said that the OK occurrence is
human-transmitted. We have zero evidence to prove that one way or
another. Let's not start groundless speculation.
-- Jim
From: Charles Goldsmith [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2010 3:22 PM
To: Jim Kennedy
Cc: Diana Tomchick; Cave Tex; DFWgrotto; Metroplexcavers
Subject: Re: New map of WNS transmission from BCI
I assumed as much. Jim, or anyone, it was said that this expansion
to Oklahoma was definitely a human transmission, not via a bat
colony. Is this because there are no bats that go between Oklahoma
and any other infected area?
I thought I had read a while back that all of the experts were
pretty sure that it was only transmitted via bat, that they didn't
think that humans were the cause of the spread, but I cannot find
that tidbit, so I'm not sure how reliable that is.
Care to clarify, or point me to a link if you have one.
Please reply to [email protected]
Permanent email address is [email protected]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I saw this on TAG-Net this morning, and dismissed it. There are a lot
of assumptions there not based on any known facts. One of the biggest
is that WNS is making huge jumps, when in fact the known localities
positively identified with WNS are an artifact of the limited
observations. WNS is surely in more caves in more states, but people
just aren't (and can't be) looking at them all.
And it is also true that gray bat and cave myotis ranges don't overlap,
but big brown bats and eastern pipistrelles (oops, now called
tri-colored bats!) are found throughout that entire area, and both are
known to be susceptible to (i.e. possible carriers of) WNS.
These kinds of emails, while intended to help inform people, actually do
more harm than good. For up-to-date, OFFICIAL information on WNS, I
always recommend the BCI
(http://www.batcon.org/index.php/what-we-do/white-nose-syndrome.html),
NSS (http://caves.org/WNS/index.htm), and USFWS
(http://www.fws.gov/WhiteNoseSyndrome/) websites.
Jim Kennedy, Conservation Biologist
Cave and Mine Resources Specialist
Bat Conservation International
NSS 26791 FL
-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Minton [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2010 4:52 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [Texascavers] RE: WNS in Oklahoma
The assumption of human transmission is further elaborated in
this post from another list:
WNS is in Oklahoma
<snip>
This jump shows a very large gap from eastern Missouri to western
Oklahoma, with a question as to the method of transmission. Myotis do
not
frequent eastern Oklahoma, and Gray bats do not frequent western
Oklahoma. There are no caves that both species are found in or share....
and the space between the closest roost sites is several hundred miles.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thanks to all of you who appreciated my outing of the Bomber Gear
story.
I had not yet found the About Bomber Gear
page when the site crashed
yesterday. Having just now read it, it dovetails perfectly with my
recollections, minus a few sordid details. I had counseled them about all
their unrestrained growth and quality issues, which actually were what
brought the company down. But despite Rick's telling of the tale, the
truth is that he grabbed the golden parachute and sailed off into Thailand,
leaving his buddies to drown in their shared debt. He clearly colluded
with the Thai company to grab all they could get.
I'm glad to see the bank finally caught up with him, if not the law, and that
he had to sell his soul to eBay to get free. Someone mentioned pads
being sold under the name "Frankenpads," which was undoubtedly
another of his schemes. He wouldn't have dared to try selling anything to
ME using that name!
Rick is a classic megalomaniac, and one to be avoided. I just wonder
what ever became of Rob and John. I've found Rob on Facebook and
hope to hear 'the rest of the story'...
Alex
--
Alex Sproul
NSS 8086RL/FE
NSS Webmaster
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http://www.mysanantonio.com/community/Archaeologists_probe_along_area_creek_greenbelts.html?showFullArticle=y
Archaeologists probe along area creek greenbeltsBy Marvin Pfeiffer - Staff
writer/Northwest WeeklyWeb Posted: 05/06/2010 12:00 CDT
Archaeological investigations along two local greenbelts currently under
development were the topics of interest at the April meeting of the Southern
Texas Archaeological Association.The topic was timely, organizers said, as the
creation of greenbelt hike-and-bike parks throughout the city has led to
increased public awareness of the many cultural resources in the area.
Before work can be done on these greenbelt parks, studies are required to
determine their impact on the valuable prehistoric and historic artifacts and
structures in the area.
The meeting was divided into two parts, the first focusing on the Leon Creek
greenbelt on the northwest side of the city and the second concentrating on the
Salado Creek, spanning a considerable area from the north side of the city to
its southern reaches.
Dr. Ann Scott and Martha Doty Freeman, both of aci Consulting in Austin,
started the program with a discussion of both archaeological and historical
investigations of the Leon Creek area.
Scott spoke of the extensive archaeological survey of an approximately four
mile stretch, segment two of the Leon Creek greenway performed by aci
Consulting in 2009
Their coverage began just south of Loop 1604 on the northern boundary and
continued south to Babcock Road.
The area was subject to 153 soil tests as well as a pedestrian survey and
resulted in the identification of two previously unrecorded prehistoric sites
and one historic homestead.
One of the newly discovered sites, 41 BX 1810 was an early archaic prehistoric
campsite. The other site discovered was a prehistoric campsite that was of
undetermined age.
Aci also attempted to relocate and reassess previously recorded sites during
their fieldwork, many of which had been destroyed by modern landscape
modification, construction, erosion or other similar activities according to
Scott.
Two of those sites, 41 BX 52 and 41 BX 47, within the project area were known
to have very early prehistoric components.
While aci didn't turn up the Paleo Indian components they were searching for at
41 BX 52, they are still considered present and deeply buried. It was also
considered fortunate that only a small portion of the site falls with in the
project area and it was determined that the main site will not be adversely
affected by the trail project.
The other site, 41 BX 47, is a significant site according to Scott, who said a
Nolan point fragment was recovered from a shovel test. Nolan points are
attributed to the early archaic period, generally recognized as from 4000-2500
B.C.
Scott said that data analysis by the University of Texas at San Antonio Center
for Archaeological Research (CAR) investigation in the 1990s led them to
suggest that the site may have focused more on small game rather than large
game based on the relation of projectile points to features.
“So, this site is very significant for the area to learn more about the late
Paleo Indian life ways and Archaic period,” Scott said.
A trail segment ranging off from the main route had been proposed for the Leon
Creek hike and bike trail that would bisect part of the site, but the aci
report recommended that an alternative route be proposed.
They also suggested backfilling existing holes on the site with clean fill and
monitoring procedures to ensure that the site is stabilized and protected.
Freeman's presentation related to the area's “historical” record, beginning in
the mid to late 18th century and culminated with a discussion of one of the few
remaining historical homes in the area.
“In general, the historical investigation followed the creek just as the
archaeological investigation had, but we were also looking at basically the
area anchored by the intersection of 1604 and (Interstate) 10 on the north and
running down to Prue Road on the south and encompassing land on both sides of
the creek,” Freeman said.
“The city of San Antonio asked that we look at a larger geographical area
because there had been specific studies done on a smaller site basis but there
hadn't been an attempt to pull together historical information on a broader
regional basis in order to provide tome context to what we might be seeing
during this project,” Freeman said.
“I think there was also some curiosity into how the area developed
historically,” Freeman added.
The area “was not necessarily a basin area but it was low lying, surrounded by
higher land,” Freeman told the group. “There was a flood plain, there were
terraces. The soil was shallow but deep enough to encourage grasses that would
and be very attractive to people that were interested in ranching.”
Two trails carried human traffic and trade through the area during the late
18th and early 19th century, the Camino Viejo and the Camino Pinto
The Camino Viejo Trail, commonly associated with present day Fredericksburg
Road, criss-crossed Leon Creek and generally paralleled the Camino Pinto
Freeman said human traffic in the area intensified in the 19th century just as
San Antonio itself was experiencing a good deal of growth.
“Some of that growth, in fact a great deal of it was fueled by speculation in
real estate that began soon after the Revolution and intensified in the 1840s
and '50s,” Freeman said. “It was really halted only by the devastating drought
of the 1850s.”
There were old land grants in the area and many of them encompassed about one
league of land. A league is a Spanish measurement of land that encompassed
4428.4 acres
Most of the entire project area covered in the aci report fell within the Selma
Prue league.
By 1860, according to census and tax records, Freeman said that some tentative
settlement had occurred on the grants that surrounded the project area with
familiar names such as Johan Moos, W.J. Locke, Coker, William Bacon, Juan
Uridia, Thomas Odom and the Gillis family listed on the tax records.
Freeman said the Moos family was in the vanguard of settlement in the project
that intensified throughout the late 1800s.
Indian attacks had decreased by that time, and lawsuits concerning ownership of
the land in the area were settled.
“Augustine DeZavala, the father of Medina DeZavala, managed the central part of
the survey and served as the growing community's postmaster,” Freeman said.
The Bacons, who had moved to the area just before the Civil War, began to buy
up land on the Prue and nearby surveys and by 1890, Patty Bacon, the wife, had
assembled a 1,286-acre ranch on both sides of Leon Creek.”
Freeman said the Moos descendents continued to live on the north part of the
subject area where they ranched and would have owned most of the land around
the current UTSA campus.
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