Hi Missed one…
On Jul 29, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Scott McGrath <scmcgr...@gmail.com> wrote: > I'm not for prohibiting ownership of as that would break a lot of companies > test programs including the one I work for as we have a spirent in a cage to > test LTE systems. And every avionics shop would be out of business > > But if the FCC catches someone USING a jammer to access to GPS i dont have a > problem with FCC throwing book at miscreant > > There is a big difference between unintentional interference and actively > disrupting the only publically available precision navigation and time source > > Keep a jammer up long enough near a cell tower and you can bring tower down > as well. Where do you think all those Tbolts come from. And because of GPS > you no longer need a Cs reference in the CO for clock as you have all those > flying clocks up there The whole Stratum 1, 2, 3 world is still alive and well in the CO world. In normal operation, everybody swims on time from upstream. You need: 1) GPS denial (hasn't happened yet, so rare) 2) CO with Stratum 1 as a possibility (rare, but they do exist). 3) CO looses sync over it's land lines (again, rare) The same holdover / maintenance process works there as well. Things have to be out for a while (days) to have much of an impact. Even then the main issue is a few more clicks on the line. The downstream stuff world will track the CO for a *long* time before anything truly looses lock. Bob > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Jul 29, 2013, at 12:23 PM, "J. Forster" <j...@quikus.com> wrote: > >> Prohibition never works. It's been tried with booze, drugs, pay sex, and >> guns, at least, and failed every time. >> >> If people want something badly enough, they will get it. >> >> Ask yourself, is the collateral damage worth it? >> >> MMV, >> >> -John >> >> ================= >> >> >> >> >> >>> We've been discussing both GNSS denial/spoofing vs Loran denial/spoofing >>> and the relative difficulty of doing same to determine which system is >>> most survivable >>> >>> That being said the penalty for using the truck stop/spy shop GPS should >>> be in the hundreds of thousands per day and carry serious jail time. As >>> most of them are easily capable of affecting a square mile as if you look >>> at the specs from their Chinese suppliers. >>> >>> If you want to keep your boss from finding that you spent more than >>> allocated time eating lunch just wrap the antenna in Al foil >>> >>> >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Jul 29, 2013, at 1:12 AM, "Fuqua, Bill L" <wlfuq...@uky.edu> wrote: >>> >>>> The idea behind GPS spoofing is that one or several surface antennas >>>> and sources could be set up in such a way that they would produce >>>> believable position data that would take a vessel off course. The >>>> problem with this concept is that the person in charge of the GPS >>>> spoofing hardware has to know exactly where the vessel is at all times >>>> to start with and other vessels some distance away, and not very far >>>> from the target vessel would get contradicting signals from the virtual >>>> satellites. >>>> Software could be used to detect changes in position data that is >>>> inconsistent with present course and recent data. And in most cases >>>> there would be a period of very inconsistent signals from satellites and >>>> more obvious, signal strengths. >>>> Another way to limit spoofing is to use directional antennas that >>>> prevent reception from near horizon signals. Or detect low angle signals >>>> and sound the alarm or implement a means of ignoring those sources. >>>> The problem very high tech systems are often defeated by low tech >>>> solutions. Successful GPS spoofing would be very high tech. >>>> Many high tech systems that the government had developed in the past >>>> have been defeated by low tech methods. An example is the microwave >>>> system that is intended to turn back rioters by inducing burning pain. >>>> It was defeated by using thick wooden shields which absorbed the RF >>>> energy. >>>> Human resourcefulness and determination often defeats technology in low >>>> tech ways. And the more complex a system is the easier it is to defeat. >>>> “The more they overtake the plumbing the easier it is to stop up the >>>> drain.” >>>> Most discussions have been about wireless spoofing. However, the most >>>> reliable way to do it would be an “inside job” where a device would >>>> be put on board and patched in the antenna lead. The correct GPS data >>>> would be received by the device and then it would produce a virtual >>>> constellation of satellites that would direct the vessel off course. >>>> However, the programmer would have to know the course that the pilot >>>> intended to take in the first place if his goal is to >>>> take the vessel to a different destination. >>>> 73 >>>> Bill wa4lav >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >>>> To unsubscribe, go to >>>> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >>>> and follow the instructions there. >>> _______________________________________________ >>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >>> To unsubscribe, go to >>> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >>> and follow the instructions there. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >> and follow the instructions there. > _______________________________________________ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. _______________________________________________ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
