On Fri, 26 May 2006 19:12:32 -0700, Someone aka Jeffry Ricker wrote: >On May 26, 2006, at 2:40 PM, Mike Palij wrote: >>Well, at this point in time I'm not willing to equate >>"not-Freudian=Fechnarian", at least until someone provides >>some evidence that Fechner actually used the metaphor > >Exactly. As Dr. Someone stated the other day: > >"I think the quote is potentially important for this reason: >Hall (1912) may have combined the "icy metaphors"--that >(seemingly) were common in the 19th century beginning >with Herbart (1816)--with Fechner's findings. That is, >HALL MAY HAVE BEEN THE SOURCE of the iceberg >metaphor, which he created to clarify Fechner's views. >Those who read Hall's book (was it a popular history-of-psych >book?) then may have attributed the iceberg metaphor to >Fechner, when it actually had been Hall summarizing Fechner."
Hall wrote the following in his Introduction to his 1912 book: | This book is an amplification of six lectures given early |in 1912 at Columbia University to an audience composed |of students and a wider public. They were not addressed |to experts and were only designed to give those who heard |them some general idea of the personality, standpoint, and |achievements of each of the men described. The chapters |are therefore for the most part light and untechnical. They |make no claim to completeness or originality. Hall goes on to say his presentation is based, in part, on his direct contact with the men that the book focuses on (i.e., Eduard Zeller, Rudolph Lotze, Gustav Fechner, Eduad von Hartman, Herman Helmholtz, and Wilhelm Wundt). As Hall writes: |"I do not know of any other American student of these |subjects who came into even the slight personal contact |it was my fortune to enjoy with Hartmann and Fechner, |nor with any psychologist who had the experience of |attempting experimental work with Helmholtz, and I |think I was the first American pupil of Wundt. It seems to me that Hall was writing in a mode/style that might be characterized as part memoir and part popular science, though the "pop science" audience back in 1912 was probably much more limited than in subsequent decades. Whether Hall was actually attributing the iceberg metaphor to Fechner or using what might have been a common conception at that time (can we still use the tern zeitgeist?) which may have originated from Hartmann or Herbert or someone else is unclear, at least on the basis of this source. >Of course, Someone really wasn't sure that the ice-related >metaphors were common; but they seem to have been at >least "in the air." Sounds like Someone was pretty smart. ;-) >So, this is what I've been trying to suggest: I admit to having come to this thread late and not having closely read most of the messages that were posted (there appeared to be a large number and I might have missed a few completely), so I apologize for not properly attributing some ideas to Someone (or Anyone Else) who deserves proper recognition. :-) -Mike Palij New York University [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Jeffry P. Ricker, Ph.D. >Chair >Division of Social & Behavioral Sciences >Scottsdale Community College >9000 E. Chaparral Road >Scottsdale, AZ 85256-2626 --- To make changes to your subscription go to: http://acsun.frostburg.edu/cgi-bin/lyris.pl?enter=tips&text_mode=0&lang=english
