[TruthTalk] Those who have never heard

[Judy Taylor]

From: Dave <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>     Do you believe the lake of fire is symbolic, Judy?  Will the pain felt from the fires of hell be a mental anguish rather than a physical torture?  If so, I think you are the first TTer I've heard believe that way.   jt: I understand the Bible to teach that it is the soul that is saved and later at the first resurrection we receive a transformed body.  When Jesus told the parable about Lazarus and the rich man they were in Abraham's bosom in a place known as Paradise without physical/transformed bodies but the way he describes how he felt sounds as though he was burning up. He wanted just a drop of water on his tongue. So I don't believe the lake of fire is entirely symbolic, nor do I believe the anguish is entirely mental.  I do know it's reality and that I don't want to go there. daveh: I am not questioning God on this, but rather I am trying to find out why Christians feel comfortable in believing that God is that way when the Bible implies he is not.   jt: The Bible teaches God's judgment as well as God's love. Perry (I believe) made a list. Do you reject that part of God's nature?  Yes he is loving, merciful, and longsuffering but there comes a time when he has had enough; we will not be able to say we have never been warned. What Bible are you reading Daveh?   daveh:  The Bible that said God loved the world so much that he sent his only begotten Son to redeem it.  That doesn't seem to me to portray a loving Father who would eternally punitively physically torture those who transgress without knowledge of Jesus' grace.   jt: The condemnation is that light has come into the world but men love darkness and will not come to the light; this has been true historically and God will not be mocked. Giving him lip service when the heart is far from him just won't fly. Neither will pleading ignorance. One of our daughters would try to get out of doing her share of the work by saying she didn't know how. The Day of the Lord is something that is spoken of all through the Bible; it is a day of darkness, not light. terry: The important thing to know is what will God do about those of us who have all the information that we need.   daveh:  That brings me to another question of curiosity, Terry.   Why do you think you have all the information you need?   judyt: If he has Jesus then he has all the information he needs; I should qualify this and say "Jesus the Word of God" because there are some others floating about out there. daveh:  That is assuming the details don't matter.  Yet there seems to be a lack of unity of belief in Jesus in the Christian world.  To allow for divergent beliefs, there is the assumption that it doesn't matter what one believes (unless one belongs to a cult), as long as one believe in Jesus.....that is all that is necessary.  If that were true, it would seem that even those who purportedly belong to cults would enjoy the same wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption, yet many Protestants prefer to exclude that category.   judyt: Only the truth will make one free and this is in the context of present-progressive. "For the word of God is living and effective and sharper than any two-edged sword, penetrating as far as to divide soul, spirit, joints, and marrow; it is a judge of the ideas and thoughts of the heart. No creature is hidden from Him, but all things are naked and exposed to the eyes of Him to whom we must give an account" (Hebrews 4:12,13)   People belonging to cults use the name of  Jesus but they do not submit themselves to His Word, rather they try to conform him to their own doctrines and vain imaginations.  It does matter what one believes but there is a difference between different stages on the right path and the broad road that leads to destruction.  Even if it is destruction in the name of another Jesus.   Grace and Peace, Judyt       -- ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Dave Hansen [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.langlitz.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ If you wish to receive things I find interesting, I maintain Five email lists... JOKESTER, OPINIONS, LDS, STUFF and MOTORCYCLE.