On Sun, 6 Feb 2005 09:27:26 EST [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
In a message dated 2/5/2005 9:56:11 AM Pacific
Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
There is no strife or disunity in Christ and He is not divided
JD: On the surface, this is untrue.
jt: Had you ever considered that maybe what we see 'on the surface' is not the reality?
There is no strife or disunity in Christ and He is not divided
JD: On the surface, this is untrue.
jt: Had you ever considered that maybe what we see 'on the surface' is not the reality?
No. There are reasons why surface impressions are what they are. The truth, in this case, is more involved than one might originally think........but the surface is reality.
Not always and men are
afflicted with their own fleshly bias. Proverbs says "It is nto good to
have respect of persons in judgment. He that saith unto the wicked. Thou art
righteous, him shall the people curse, nations shall abhor him" (Prov
24:23)
Surface reality is judging after the flesh and Jesus
said to the Pharisees "Ye judge after the flesh; I judge no man and yet if I
judge my judgment is true for I am not alone, but I and the Father that sent
me." (John 8:15)
Jesus is our example and the one we are to follow
after. He is the one we are to emulate. Jesus says:
"Judge not
according to the appearance but judge righteous judgment" (John
7:24)
God says the same thing to
the prophet Samuel "Do not look at his appearance or at the height of his
stature because I have rejected him for God sees not as man sees, for man looks
at the outward appearance, but the Lord looks at the heart. (1 Sam
16:7)
But, perhaps I do not know what you mean with the phrase "no stife or disunity in Christ."
jt: It means just what it says -
No it doesn't or I wouldn't have asked the
question.
the Church he is coming for will have no spot,
wrinkle, or blemish; wouldn't you categorize strife and disunity as wrinkles and blemishes?.
And here is where we part company
-- I on the right and you on the left (I just love talking like you
guys -- it gives me such a sense of power , anyway) I
beleive that the unblemished Church is the redemptive work and consideration of
God in Christ. You think it has to do with your efforts.
I didn't say that did I? However it will never happen
without our cooperation "Christ loved the church, and gave himself for it
that he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word;
that he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot or
wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish. (Eph
5:25-27)
When can we say unity has occurred?
jt: When we are of one heart and one mind. When we are all say the same thing and doing what He says.
What is the situation with God and disciple(s)
until that happens as in the case with you and I? Are they in Christ
or what?
jt: We should separate ourselves from some
things (see Ephesians 5:3-6) because we were once darkness ourselves but now we
are to walk as children of light and have no fellowship with the unfruitful
works of darkness but rather reprove them - all things are reproved as they are
made manifest by the light. To answer your question. We are in Christ as we walk
in the light as He is in the light. If we fall we go to the throne of grace,
repent, get back up and continue on.
When a division occurs and assuming one believer in definitely in Christ -- how does the onlooker tell the difference in the two opponents?
jt: Eventually, as ppl grow into Christ and His love is perfected in their hearts a wolf will be exposed in spite of the sheepskin by what is coming out of his mouth.
"grow into Christ" you say. So there
is a time when the church is not united in lockstep teaching and doctrinal
verbage. You do include "verbage," correct?
jt: I've never included "lockstep"
anything John - this is your term and to me it sounds like Hitler's army but
then maybe that is how you want it to sound..
