It is surely a sick, sick, sick society that would read perversion into anything Jesus said or did. Trying to project their own filth upon One who is the same yesterday, today, and forever; One who has always been pure and holy. Yes John was the disciple Jesus loved but scriptural love is hardly defiled and perverted bath house sex. It never ever means this to someone with the mind of Christ. The mind of the adversary will try and conform God's Word to it's own image for those tuned to it's voice .... This is SICK indeed. It is time to REPENT!! Right on Terry ... my chain is JERKED. Judyt
On Tue, 27 Sep 2005 12:19:20 -0700 (PDT) Kevin Deegan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > This argument is from the same SICKO who said on the basis of the > following verse he has decided Jesus was GAY. SICK! JN 13:23 Now > there > was leaning on Jesus' bosom one of his disciples, whom Jesus loved. > > > > --- Terry Clifton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > I see no argument for homosexuality. Homosexuals are an > abomination > > to God, yet David was a man after God's heart. David was > therefore > not a homosexual. Whoever wrote the trash you offered was a liar, > or > did not understand the customs of the times, or both. > > _This one should jerk Judy's chain if she is still around. :)_ > > Terry > > > ==================================================================== > > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > > > > > > *In case you were curious, here is a rather well stated > argument > > for > > > homosexuality.* > > > *Enjoy. * > > > ** > > > *JD * > > > > > > > > > > > > The Bible has often been used as a weapon to condemn > homosexuality > > as > > > sinful or > > > immoral. It is often overlooked and even outrightly denied that > > some > > > of the > > > heroes in the Bible were themselves homosexual. The story of > > Jonathan > > > and David > > > is one of the more obvious cases. > > > > > > > > > > > > For the sake of simplicity, I'll let the Bible itself unfold > most > > of > > > the story. > > > > > > > > > > > > After David's heroic victory over the Philistine giant, Goliath, > in > > 1 > > > Samual, > > > Chapter 17, David meets Jonathan for the first time. > > > > > > > > > > > > 1 And it came to pass, when he had made an end of speaking unto > > Saul, > > > that the > > > soul of Jonathan was knit with the soul of David, and Jonathan > > loved > > > him as his > > > own soul. 2 And Saul took him that day, and would let him go no > > more > > > home to his > > > father's house. 3 Then Jonathan and David made a covenant, > because > > he > > > loved him > > > as his own soul. 4 And Jonathan stripped himself of the robe > that > > was > > > upon him, > > > and gave it to David, and his garments, even to his sword, a nd > to > > his > > > bow, and > > > to his girdle. 1 Samuel 18: 1-4 > > > > > > > > > > > > Their souls are knit together, they love each other so much that > > they > > > made a > > > covenant with each other, and Jonathan, son of the King, strips > > before > > > David, > > > who is much lower in rank and status. > > > > > > > > > > > > In the next passages, David's popularity and military > achievements > > are > > > advanced, > > > and King Saul starts getting jealous of all the attention being > > paid > > > to David. > > > In order to trap him, Saul makes David his son-in-law by giving > him > > his > > > daughter, Michal, to wed. > > > > > > > > > > > > Some people may stop right here and say that if David married > > Michal, > > > it's proof > > > that he didn't have a homosexual relationship with Jonathan. > There > > are > > > several > > > flaws to this argument. First, their marriage was probably only > > > political. Saul > > > offers his daughter's hand in marriage only as part of a greater > > plot > > > to get at > > > David. And while it was said that Michal loved David, the Bible > > never > > > says that > > > he loved her back. Also, we know from other ancient cultures > such > > as > > > the Greeks > > > and even the Philistines, that heterosexual marriages weren't > > necessarily > > > exclusive. It's very possible that David could have been > bisexual. > > > > > > > > > > > > In 1 Samuel 19, Saul tries to kill David, and David eventually > > flees > > > in 1 Samuel > > > 20. > > > > > > > > > > > > 1 And David fled from Naioth in Ramah, and came and said before > > > Jonathan, What > > > have I done? what is mine iniquity? and what is my sin before > thy > > > father, that > > > he seeketh my life? 2 And he said unto him, God forbid; thou > shalt > > not > > > die: > > > behold, my father will do nothing either great or small, but > that > > he > > > will shew > > > it me: and why should my father hide this thing from me? it is > not > > so. > > > 3 And > > > David sware moreover, and said, Thy father certainly knoweth > that I > > > > > have found > > > grace in thine eyes; and he saith, Let not Jonathan know this, > lest > > he be > > > grieved: but truly as the LORD liveth, and as thy soul liveth, > > there > > > is but a > > > step between me and death. 4 Then said Jonathan unto David, > > Whatsoever > > > thy soul > > > desireth, I will even do it for thee. 1 Samuel 20: 3-4 > > > > > > > > > > > > David and Jonathan continue talking about what to do about > > Jonathan's > > > father. > > > Then they part ways so Jonathan can go somewhere safe. Again > they > > make a > > > covenant with each other, and swear their love for each other. > > > Jonathan loved > > > David "as he loved his own soul". > > > > > > > > > > > > 16 So Jonathan made a covenant with the house of David, saying, > Let > > > > > the LORD > > > even require it at the hand of David's enemies. 17 And Jonathan > > caused > > > David to > > > swear again, because he loved him: for he loved him as he loved > his > > > > > own soul. 1 > > > Samuel 20: 16-17 > > > > > > > > > > > > In the next passages, they plan to meet again so that Jonathan > can > > let > > > David > > > know whether he should come back safe from Saul, or whether he > > should > > > go away. > > > And Jonathan talks to his father. Saul tells Jonathan that he is > > > > confused in his > > > love for David. He also says that as long as David is around, > > Jonathan > > > won't > > > establish his lineage or kingdom. This certainly has all the > > elements > > > of a > > > com ing out story. > > > > > > > > > > > > 30 Then Saul's anger was kindled against Jonathan, and he said > unto > > > > > him, Thou > > > son of the perverse rebellious woman, do not I know that thou > hast > > > chosen the > > > son of Jesse to thine own confusion, and unto the confusion of > thy > > > mother's > > > nakedness? 31 For as long as the son of Jesse liveth upon the > > ground, > > > thou shalt > > > not be established, nor thy kingdom. Wherefore now send and > fetch > > him > > > unto me, > > > for he shall surely die. 1 Samuel 20: 30-31 > > > > > > > > > > > > Jonathan warns David that his father is still angry, and that > he's > > not > > > safe. > > > They reaffirm their covenant to each other, kiss each other, cry > > over the > > > situation, and I'm not even going to try to interpret what it > might > > > > > mean when > > > the passage says "David exceeded". > > > > > > > > > > > > 41 And as soon as the lad was gone, David arose out of a place > > toward > > > the south, > > > and fell on his face to the ground, and bowed himself three > times: > > and > > > they > > > kissed one another, and wept one with another, until David > > exceeded. > > > 42 And > > > Jonath an said to David, Go in peace, forasmuch as we have sworn > > both > > > of us in > > > the name of the LORD, saying, The LORD be between me and thee, > and > > > between my > > > seed and thy seed for ever. And he arose and departed: and > Jonathan > > > > > went into > > > the city. 1 Samuel 20: 41-42 > > > > > > In 2 Samuel 1, David hears about the death of Saul and Jonathan > in > > > battle. He > > > mourns their deaths, and remembers his times together with > Jonathan > > > > > stating that > > > Jonathan's love for him was stronger than Jonathan's love for > > women. > > > > > > > > > > > > 25 How are the mighty fallen in the midst of the battle! O > > Jonathan, > > > thou wast > > > slain in thine high places. 26 I am distressed for thee, my > brother > > > > > Jonathan: > > > very pleasant hast thou been unto me: thy love to me was > wonderful, > > > > > passing the > > > love of women. 2 Samuel 1:26 > > > > > > > > > > > > Well that's their story as told in the Holy Bible. There are > other > > > Bible heroes > > > that are rumoured to have been gay or lesbian. Among them are > Ruth > > and > > > Naomi, > > > Daniel and an eunuch, and the Apostle Paul (though if he wa s, > he > > had > > > his own > > > issues with sexuality). > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 > http://mail.yahoo.com > ---------- > "Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you > may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) > http://www.InnGlory.org > > If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to > [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you > have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to > [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed. > > ---------- "Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
