From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Mr. Cleo
Date: Sat, 10 Dec 2005 13:13:22 EST
Blainerb: I actually saw and touched one of the original Sunstones that
were placed in the Nauvoo Temple in Nauvoo Illinois. The state of
Illinois had
retained it for their museum. Thanks for showing us what it looks like.
It
represents--symbolizes--the highest degree of brightness and glory man may
attain too in the resurrection--which glory is likened unto the sun. It
is in
no way a representation of what God actually looks like. (Read more
below)
In a message dated 12/9/2005 5:42:19 A.M. Mountain Standard Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
(http://www.utlm.org/images/masonictemplearticle/nomanknowsmyhistory_p298b.jpg)
temple stone!
Du 17 And hath gone and served other gods, and worshipped them, either the
sun, or moon, or any of the host of heaven, which I have not commanded
Du 18 There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or
his
daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an
observer
of times, or an enchanter, or a witch.
There are seven stars in the sign or constellation of the Big Dipper on
the
Salt Lake Temple, explained by President Harold B. Lee "to represent the
great truth that through the priesthood of God the lost may find their
way."
Harold B.Lee, Stand Ye in Holy Places, p. 251
Blainerb: President Lee is referring to the one star in the Big Dipper
constellation called the North Star. Unlike the other six stars, it
remains
constant as the earth turns on its axis every twenty-four hours, and thus
symbolizes Jesus Christ, who never deviates or changes, but remains a
constant
source of enlightenment for those who seek his counsel and who seek to
emulate
Him. We may, like the mariners of old who kept their course steady by
taking a
fix on the North Star, find our spiritual directions by taking a fix on
Jesus
Christ.
Blainerb: The above photo is of another section of the outer wall of the
original Nauvoo, Illinois, Temple. The star symbolizes the lowest of the
three
degrees of glory man may attain to in the resurrection. Since stars
produce
their own light, these are probably those who stand in their own light and
reject the greater light of Jesus Christ.
The moon represents the middle degree of glory man may be resurrected to.
The glory of the moon is a reflection of the light received from the sun,
and
so shall it be among the inhabitants of this glory/Kingdom. That is, they
will accept the greater light of Jesus Christ, and will be among the
honorable
of the earth, but were not valiant in their testimony of Jesus Christ.
Kevin's nonsense below tells me he stands in his own light. :>)
Amos 5:26 But ye have borne the tabernacle of your Moloch and Chiun your
images, the star of your god, which ye made to yourselves.
2 Kings 23:5,11 And he put down the idolatrous priests, whom the kings of
Judah had ordained to burn incense in the high places in the cities of
Judah,
and in the places round about Jerusalem; them also that burned incense
unto
Baal, to the sun, and to the moon, and to the planets, and to all the
host of
heaven. And he took away the horses that the kings of Judah had given to
the
sun, at the entering in of the house of the LORD, by the chamber of
Nathanmelech the chamberlain, which [was] in the suburbs, and burned the
chariots of
the sun with fire.
_http://www.johnpratt.com/items/docs/lds/meridian/2000/mormastr2.html#fn12_
(http://www.johnpratt.com/items/docs/lds/meridian/2000/mormastr2.html#fn12)
Enoch, Abraham, and Moses all had revelations on astronomy, and Joseph
Smith
called the first newspaper of the Church The Evening and the Morning Star.
Why this preoccupation with the heavens?
In the Book of Revelations, Christ is called the "bright and Morning Star.
This would be Venus, which because of its being closer to the sun than the
earth, sometimes follows the sun down as the Evening Star, sometimes is
hidden
behind the sun, and sometimes precedes the sun arising in the morning, so
is
called the Morning Star. This sequence symbolizes the death (Evening
Star),
burial (star behind the sun) and resurrection (Morning Star) of Jesus
Christ. It is all symbolic. ByTheWay, the Hopi Indians include part of
this
sequence in one of their ceremonies--they have one of their priests wear a
white
robe and a fake beard, and chant, "I am the bright and morning star."
(Book of the Hopi, p. 143, by Frank Waters.)
Just as the Savior was born and sacrificed on special Hebrew calendar
days,
so was the Prophet Joseph Smith. His birth on Monday, 23 December 1805
coincided with the Hebrew day marking the winter solstice, leading to the
suggestion
that it symbolized the return of the light of the gospel to a dark
world.(Proctor, Scot Facer, Witness of the Light, Deseret Book Company,
Salt Lake
City, Utah, p. 22) Moreover, Thursday, 27 June 1844, the day on which the
Prophet went "like a lamb to the slaughter" (D&C 135:4), was one of four
Hebrew
"days of atonement " ( the day of atonement on which joe was "martyed")
The
Law of Moses actually required priests to sacrifice two lambs every day:
one
in the morning and one in the afternoon (Num. 28:3-8). Because the Hebrew
day
begins about sunset, the morning sacrifice was near the meridian of the
24-hour Hebrew day, and the afternoon sacrifice was near the end of the
day. The
morning sacrifice appears to have represented Jesus Christ, who would come
in
the meridian of time, and the afternoon lamb might well have symbolized
the
Prophet Joseph Smith, who came in the latter days and did "more, save
Jesus
only, for the salvation of men in this world, than any other man that ever
lived in it" (D&C 135:3).
Blainerb: GOOD!!
Charles Perry Locke <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Blaine, the resident TT astrologer says, " and the sunstone with the
round-faced image of god". Is god's face round like the sun? Does the sun
have a face like god's? Does god have a literal face? Are god and the sun
the same that anyone should combine them in an image? Can you say "Sun
worship"? "Graven Images"?
"When the suuuuuun is in the seventh house...and Ju-pi-terrrrr aligns with
Mars.....Peeeeaaaace will guide the pla-a-nuts, and loooove will guide the
stars, this is the dawning of the age of aquarius, the age of
aguarius...aquaaaaaaaariuuuus...aquaaaaaaaariiiuuus".
Gee, that was fun. I haven't sung that since Pluto was in the doghouse.
Blaine, can you explain what the age of aquarius is, if we are now in the
age of aquarius, and how that squares with your mormon beliefs, or how it
does not?
Do you believe Nostradamus to be an authentic prognosticator of the
future?
What evidence do you have of the truth of his prophecies?
Thanks,
Perry
>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Reply-To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
>To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
>Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Blaine Autumn equinox Date: Thu, 8 Dec 2005
>21:44:19 EST
>
>
>
>Blainerb: Sounds more like some of Joseph Smith's tom-foolery! He was
>famous for saying ridiculous things for a laugh! Once while the Nauvoo
>temple
>was being built, and the sunstone with the round-faced image of God
>carved on
>it was about to be put into place, someone asked if that was what God
>looked
>like. He replied that it was, except his nose was just a smidgeon wider!
>Both he and the man who asked the question got a good laugh! Where is
>your
>sense of humor, Kevin?
>
>In a message dated 12/7/2005 9:14:07 P.M. Mountain Standard Time,
>[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
>
>Joe was an Occultist who sacrificed animals
>
>Kevin Deegan wrote:
>The angel appeared on September 22 every year four years in a row. None
>of
>the other dates corresponded to Trumpets.
>
>It had more to do with being a observer of SIGNS in the heavens. Jo was
an
>Astrologer who did all his "work" on days of Occult and Astrologic
>significance
>Pagans observe the "holy day" of the Autumn Equinox on the date in 1827
>also. The "angel" of light had appeared on the night of the Autumnal
>equinox,
>between midnight and dawn--hours auspicious for a magical invocation
>
>In what follows most Mormons will not find a story with which they are
>familiar. Instead, they will discover that Joseph Smith evidently
>participated
>extensively in magical pursuits and that he shared with others of his
>contemporaries a magic world view of the world. For myself, I have found
>that the
>'official version' of early Mormon history is sometimes incomplete in
its
>presentation and evaluation of evidence, and therefore inaccurate in
>certain
>respects." (Early Mormonism and the Magic World View, Introduction,
Quinn
>pages
>xx-xxi)
>
>
>In discussing the discovery of the Book of Mormon, Quinn notes that
Smith
>prayed to be guided to the plates for three years in succession on the
>autumnal
>equinox. On September 21, 1823, for example, Smith prayed under the full
>moon on a Sunday night that was ruled by his own ruling planet, Jupiter.
>The
>hours of his prayer and vision were ruled by planets and the moon,
making
>the
>time particularly propitious for the summoning of and communing with a
>good
>spirit. (Smith also owned a talisman which had the magic seal of Jupiter
>and
>the Latin words "Confirmo O Deus potentissimus" on one side, and the
>astrological symbol for Jupiter, Jupiter's magic number (136), and a
magic
>table in
>Hebrew lettering that added up to 136 on the other side.)
>Review of Early Mormonism and the Magic World View D. MICHAEL QUINN
>_http://www.signaturebooks.com/reviews/magic.htm_
>(http://www.signaturebooks.com/reviews/magic.htm)
>
>Joseph Smith, jun. was born December 23, 1805 during the first Decan of
>Capricorn whose ruling planet is Jupiter, which is also the governing
>planet for
>the year 1805.
>Dr. Durham director of the LDS Institute of Religion at the University
of
>Utah as well as president of the Mormon History Association "...The
>purpose of
>the Table of Jupiter is talismanic magic [sic] was to be able to call
upon
>the celestial intelligences assigned to the particular talisman to
assist
>one
>in all endeavors. The names of the deities... who could be invoked by
the
>Table were always written on the tailsman or represented by various
>numbers;
>three such names were written on Joseph Smith's talisman... Abbah,
Father;
>El
>Ab, Father is God; and Josiphiel, Johovah speaks for God... When
properly
>invoked, with Jupiter being very powerful and ruling in the heavens,
these
>intelligences by the power of ancient magic guaranteed to the possessor
of
>this
>tailsman to gain of riches and favor and power and love and peace and to
>confirm
>honors and dignities and councils. Tailsmanic magic further declared
that
>any one who worked skillfully with this Jupiter table would obtain the
>power of
>stimulating anyone to offer their love to the possessor of the
>talisman..."
>
>Dabbling in the occult, Smith apprenticed with a man described as "a
>peripatetic magician, conjurer and fortuneteller," from whom he learned
>the era's
>folk concepts of crystal gazing, divining rods, seer stones, and
rituals
>associated with treasure hunting. He advised others in their pursuits,
>once
>instructing a neighbor he could locate buried money on his property by
>slitting the
>throat of a black sheep and leading it in a circle on the land.
>Increasingly ridiculed as a necromancer and money digger, Smith kept
>details of his
>continuing revelations to himself, confiding only in his parents,
>siblings, and,
>by early 1827, in young Emma Hale, with whom he had eloped. All the
while
>he
>patiently awaited an order from the angel Moroni that it was time to
>retrieve
>the golden book.
>It was an auspicious night for communing with spirits, according to the
>astrological handbooks of the day. "Jews throughout the world celebrated
>the
>Feast of Trumpets, which initiates the Days of Awe," or Rosh Hashanah,
>academic
>journals later noted in an attempt to seek association between Smith and
>Judaism. Almanacs published near Smith's home reported the date was
"both
>the
>autumnal equinox and a new moon, an excellent time to commence new
>projects." A
>publication in nearby Canandaigua reported "the moon was also in Libra,
>when
>one should 'Delve and Dig.' "
>The twenty-one-year-old Smith dressed himself in black, then borrowed a
>black horse and sleigh for the ride to the hill of Cumorah. He had been
>"commanded to go on the 22d day of September 1827 at 2 o'clock," Smith's
>sister later
>wrote.
>American Massacre: The Tragedy At Mountain Meadows, September 1857
Denton
>_http://www.northshire.com/siteinfo/bookinfo/0-375-72636-5/0/_
>(http://www.northshire.com/siteinfo/bookinfo/0-375-72636-5/0/)
>
>
>NOTE The Greater Key of Solomon, page 122, says that "Sometimes white
>animals are sacrificed to the good Spirits and black to the evil."
>
>
>Richard L. Anderson Brigham Young University Studies, Spring 1970, page
>294
>The Professor quotes the following from M. Wilford Poulson's notes of a
>conversation with Wallace Miner: "I once asked Stafford if Smith did
steal
>a
>sheep from him. He said no, not exactly. He said, he did miss a black
>sheep, but
>soon Joseph came and admitted he took it for sacrifice but he was
willing
>to
>work for it. He made wooden sap buckets to fully pay for it."
>
>C. R. Stafford testified concerning the same incident: "Jo Smith, the
>prophet, told my uncle, William Stafford, he wanted a fat, black sheep.
He
>said he
>wanted to cut its throat and make it walk in a circle three times around
>and
>it would prevent a pot of money from leaving." (Naked Truths About
>Mormonism, January 1888, page 3)
>
>
>____________________________________
>
>
>
>
>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2005 9:10 PM
>To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
>Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Emailing: sda.htm
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>You forgot to put LOL after your comment--surely you were jesting!! :>)
>
>
>The angel appeared on September 22 every year four years in a row. None
>of
>the other dates corresponded to Trumpets.
>
>
>
>
>
>Hey did you know the appearance of Elijah to JS and Oliver C. was on 16
>Nisan? It was The Day of the Lord--he was crucified on Friday, 14 Nisan.
> That
>combination happens very seldom. The Jews have been predicting Elijah's
>appearance on the
>Passover (14 Nisan) for centuries--16 Nisan is very close, but not right
>on.. If the devil was in it, as you say, would he not have used 14 Nisan
>instead of 16 Nisan?
>
>
>Blaine
>
>
>
>
>
>In a message dated 12/5/2005 12:55:47 P.M. Mountain Standard Time,
>[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
>
>
>The devil knew, Blaine. Heââ¬â¢s such a cunning fake. iz
>
>
>
>____________________________________
>
>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Marlin halverson
>Sent: Monday, December 05, 2005 12:50 AM
>To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
>Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Emailing: sda.htm
>
>
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>
>
>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED])
>
>
>BTW, I am partially inclined to agree with you that all has not been
>fulfilled--the gold plates were first delivered to the Prophet JS on the
>day of the
>Feast of Trumpets. JS never pointed this out--not sure he even knew
>it--but
>it is true. Check it out--September 22, 1827.
