David, allow me this moment to reveal just a tad about the
Smithmeister. Bulldogery is that which speaks of my
passion. Indeed, I have gotten angry twice, here on
TT, both times following one of your priceless comments
. Twice in three years (going back a ways
.)?!! Not bad, I think.
I am certainly NOT emotional in my response(s) on this
subject.
There have been times, in past postings, that you have
been even brilliant in your defense. This is not one of
those times. Science and creation is not one of your
strong points -- at least not this time
around. I suspect that you are distracted with other
things.
To wit: God takes 26 seconds to speak all things
into existence - I say.
But you, wanting to present the act of creation as longer,
say exactly 144 hours (6 days times 24 hours for those of
you living near the Ozarks) retort with this -- For example, if he spoke for the land masses to
divide from the water, it took less than a minute to say it, but
hours for the land and water to do what he said.
Maybe that doesn't sound funny to you,
but honestly, it is a riot over here in my office. "Those
dumb old land masses -- they couldn't just POP into
place. N0 sir-reeeee. It took time
for them to move into place -- upwards of several
hours !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Com'on big D
!! Just admit that the non-literal 24 hour crowd just
might have a point !!
Look -- if you give graduating high school
students your kind of information and send to them to Humbolt
State - why, within minutes, the whole bunch of them
would become atheists !! I have seen
this happen many times. Our young
people have left their individual churches thinking there is
nothing to evolution, or whatever, and when they sit in
front of an antongist, they are left naked, poor and numb.
You might not be impressed with my explanations offered
to my boys at U of Cal at Davies -- but let me
tell you this. I had been working on one line explanations
for years before my boys got to school. All
of those one-liners thoroughly defeated except for that
one brief paragraph of thought I gave in another post (the
eternity of matter and motion aand the philosophical advantage
of going with the eternity of God -
thingy). I have talked about "postulated" truth in the
past -- that such is considered to
be "truth" but without the possibility of
PROOF. I have mentioned that science is as much addicted to
"faith" as a Christian to his God ..... all things I
could communicate in minutes over the phone. And guess
what -- my boys called!!! These guys each won state
wrestling championships and I coached them (AND YES I AM
MOST DEFINITELY BRAGGING). In some venues , they
completely trusted me and with reason. Probably the most
important long distance phone call I will ever receive
from my boys was THAT call -- "Dad, this
prof is killing us !! What do we say?"
There was no doubt in their minds that The Reply would
work. I could have lost both boys the next day in
class !! You should have heard that next phone call
.... the next evening !! Awesome.
How did I know it would work ? I went to several
science classes over the years and used my best stuff in
class -- none of it survived except the
above..... but it was enough.
Use the Bible as a battle ground AND YOU WILL CONDEMN YOUR
CHILDREN TO HELL. Get the educator to admit that his
world of knowing is not that much different than the Christian's
and you have common ground with which to discuss. You
never fight your opponent in his backyard !!
Since TT is almost over - one more story. My
oldest daughter came to me as a14 year old with her first
job. Her boss was an atheist. She tried to
convert him and got beat up in the process. "Dad, how
do I defend inspiration to Bruce?"
"Julie, you don't even try. Do this
-- explain to him that all of the writers of the New
Testament scriptures were murdered for their beliefs and then
ask him, 'Bruce, don't you think you should at least examine
what it was they died for ?"
He told her he was prepared for any response but that one
!! That opened a door that was slammed shut two weeks
later in his drowning death at the lake. Was there light in
life because of that talk? I like to think there
was.
jd
--------------
Original message --------------
From: "Lance Muir"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Interpretation/interpolation/speculation re:Genesis leads
one to that which one has just witnessed over the last week or
so.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: March 23, 2006
17:01
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk]
Fw: Williams on Creationism
I don't know why you are getting so emotional over
this.
I think that when God spoke, in many situations, it took
some time for what he said to take place. For example,
if he spoke for the land masses to divide from the water, it
took less than a minute to say it, but hours for the land and
water to do what he said. He also may have been
involved in other ways that we don't understand right
now. Do you see it differently? It does not have
anything to do with resting for the next day.
David Miller
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, March
23, 2006 4:36 PM
Subject: Re:
[TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism
David !! Honestly, this is one of the
sorriest posts you have ever written. First, an
atheist mocks God and I am no atheist.
Secondly, the reason you are confused with what I said
(144 hours of time to speak the words of creation that took
only 26 seconds to actually speak) is rather simple
-- you have somehow lost the context of my
statement. My comments go the the notion that "day" is
not a 24 hour period. To say that it is
metaphorical does not mean that God did not
create the world and even in the sequence
depicted -- at least not to me. Such
an admission , on my part, does not mean that I believe the
Genesis account to be "scientific" as we understand that
term , today. Look -- do you really
believe that God worked so hard in His creation activity
that he needed a 24 hour period of time to rest up
!!!?? And "rest up " for what?
Com'on David, this is impossible.
jd
--------------
Original message --------------
From: "David Miller"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Are you mocking the concept that God created the
world through faith and speaking? What does how long
it takes for him to speak words have to do with how long
it took for the world to come into being? I don't
understand your point.
David Miller
----- Original Message
-----
Sent: Wednesday,
March 22, 2006 5:29 PM
Subject: Re:
[TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism
So which fundamentalist version of creation
do you support. That A & E were spirit
people. A 6000 year date or a 10,000 or an
"unknown" e.t. ? The version that says
it took God 144 hours to speak words that
can be spoken in 24 seconds
!!! I just did it in 24 big ones
!! including a drink of water because my
mouth was getting dry.
Consensus has NOTHING to do with !! Rad
Fundies cannot agree on much of anything.
Which version goes into the school system ??? We
are still waiting??
jd
--------------
Original message --------------
From: Kevin Deegan
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Don't you get it JT?
TRUTH is found in CONSENSUS!
The opinions of Men are the
key.....
Judy Taylor
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
So?
There isn't a single fiew
of the whole church that is agreed upon
by the whole church
either. What does that prove?
judyt
Perhaps the Bishop has the same concerns I
do. I know this --
there isn't a single view of creationism that
is agreed upon by the whole church.
jd
--------------
Original message --------------
From: "David
Miller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
John wrote:
> The world in which we live would
reject
> any mention of God in the evolutionary
process,
> IMO. But creationism
in the schools? Could
> that not be considered the beginnings
of a fanatical
> fundamentalist take-over of the
culture?
ROTFLOL. I sure hope you were
being facetious on purpose.
John wrote:
> But to allow a mere statement
that suggests God
> is somehow in control as the
Creator(?) If this
> could be presented into the secular
system of
> education without it being coopted by
the fundies
> -- go for it. But I
doubt that it can. What a shame
> that radical fundamentalism within
Christiandom forces
> the Body to dismiss a perfectly
wonderful opportunity
> to introduce the Creator to
others.
In case you did not notice, the
fundamentalists are not causing the
acknowledgement of our Creator to be forbidden
in schools. It is the liberal loonies
like this Archbishop of Canterbury who are
doing this.
David Miller
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