On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 12:45 PM, Bruno Girin <[email protected]> wrote: > On 03/01/12 18:25, Thomas Mashos wrote: >> >> On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 10:18 AM, Ian Santopietro<[email protected]> >> wrote: >>>> >>>> I don't doubt that this behaviour is already present in a lot of >>>> households> but as technology savvy users, we have to remember that we are >>>> by nature> early adopters of tech so what we find simple and intuitive to >>>> use (such as> Ubuntu) may be bewildering for others. >>> >>> I understand what you mean about early adoption by tech savvy users, >>> but I should point out that I'm the only tech savvy user in the >>> household, and that I don't really watch very much TV at all. This is >>> universal behaviour at my house, and it wasn't influenced by me at >>> all. >>> Like I said, I expect we're a bit of a corner case, but if this sort >>> of behaviour was scarce, I doubt that DVRs themselves would be nearly >>> as widespread as they are now, as this is what they're best at. >>> >>>> In response to "As for interfacing with cable, it wouldn't be very >>>> hard to create a simple DVR program and use that for recording from an >>>> input feed.", I disagree with this statement. It needs to be done >>>> right, and really I think we need to use a solution that already >>>> exists. Basic DVR functionality isn't extremely difficult, but it is >>>> more than just recording (don't forget about scheduling, show >>>> tracking, conflict resolution, space management, etc). >>> >>> Fair enough. I do agree that reusing an existing solution would be >>> better. I probably should have used "implement" instead of "create" as >>> it better conveys the general point. >>> >>> I think, ideally, that Ubuntu TV would be more than a MythTV frontend. >>> I agree that MythTV would make an excellent media backend, but we want >>> to do more with Ubuntu TV than just media. There could be a portion of >>> it that would relay information from a MythTV backend, but we >>> shouldn't limit ourselves to what MythTV can do. >>> >>> I also don't think that we should have a two machine dependency. By >>> default, Ubuntu TV should be ready on its own, single piece of >>> hardware, since that what is easiest to configure. There could be >>> advanced settings for connecting to an external MythTV box, but it >>> should not be a requirement. >>> On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 09:41, Thomas Mashos<[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>> On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 7:27 AM, Bruno Girin<[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> On 03/01/12 14:50, Ian Santopietro wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I don't think channels will play a huge bearing on TV in the future. >>>>>> Channels simply don't make any sense anymore to anyone except cable >>>>>> companies. People will want to subscribe to a TV show and watch only >>>>>> the >>>>>> shows they want, rwather than pay for an entire channel and only four >>>>>> or >>>>>> five out of all of the shows each channel offers. >>>>>> >>>>> I agree with you that TV on demand of that sort is probably the future. >>>>> But >>>>> it needs to be as easy to use as today's live TV, where the simplicity >>>>> of >>>>> switching the box on and then pressing a number on the remote is all >>>>> you >>>>> have to do. This comes back to the original comment made by Thomas >>>>> Söderberg >>>>> about his folks finding MythTV difficult to use compared to a TV. The >>>>> idea >>>>> is to minimise the time and the number of interactions between >>>>> switching the >>>>> device on and being sat in the sofa watching the show you want. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> This sort of behaviour is already present. No one in my house watches >>>>>> live >>>>>> TV anymore. Instead we have the shows we want to watch set up to >>>>>> record, and >>>>>> we watch them after they get recorded. This may be a bit extreme of a >>>>>> case, >>>>>> but I'm pretty sure most people with DVR equipment do this at least a >>>>>> little >>>>>> bit. It makes more sense for these people to simply purchase the show >>>>>> they >>>>>> want, then watch them as new episodes become available, rather than >>>>>> paying >>>>>> for an entire channel. >>>>>> >>>>> I don't doubt that this behaviour is already present in a lot of >>>>> households >>>>> but as technology savvy users, we have to remember that we are by >>>>> nature >>>>> early adopters of tech so what we find simple and intuitive to use >>>>> (such as >>>>> Ubuntu) may be bewildering for others. >>>>> >>>>> Anyway, if supporting live TV is a show stopper in terms of complexity, >>>>> then >>>>> I agree we shouldn't pursue this. But that doesn't preclude thinking >>>>> hard >>>>> about the user interface to make sure that its interaction model is as >>>>> simple as the live TV interaction model. For example, one aspect of >>>>> Unity >>>>> that works extremely well and that would make complete sense for a TV >>>>> is the >>>>> use of the numerical key shortcuts (Super+0-9) to launch an >>>>> application. By >>>>> re-using that concept to enable users to quickly select a show when >>>>> they >>>>> first start UbuntuTV can give you a similar interaction model as live >>>>> TV. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> As for interfacing with cable, it wouldn't be very hard to create a >>>>>> simple >>>>>> DVR program and use that for recording from an input feed. >>>>>> >>>>> Possibly, I can't comment as I don't know what it would involve but my >>>>> experience is that each time I hear the phrase "it shouldn't be too >>>>> hard >>>>> to..." in technology, it usually ends up being a major endeavour, which >>>>> obviously doesn't prevent me from saying this on a regular basis :-) >>>>> >>>>> Cheers, >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Bruno >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-tv >>>>> Post to : [email protected] >>>>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-tv >>>>> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >>>> >>>> In response to "As for interfacing with cable, it wouldn't be very >>>> hard to create a simple DVR program and use that for recording from an >>>> input feed.", I disagree with this statement. It needs to be done >>>> right, and really I think we need to use a solution that already >>>> exists. Basic DVR functionality isn't extremely difficult, but it is >>>> more than just recording (don't forget about scheduling, show >>>> tracking, conflict resolution, space management, etc). >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Thomas Mashos >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-tv >>>> Post to : [email protected] >>>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-tv >>>> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Ian Santopietro >>> >>> Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments. >>> See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html >>> >>> "Eala Earendel enlga beorohtast >>> Ofer middangeard monnum sended" >>> >>> Pa gur yv y porthaur? >>> >>> Public GPG key (RSA): >>> >>> http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x412F52DB1BBF1234 >> >> I agree, and I've said all for a long time (not here though) that the >> power of MythTV is in the backend, and that the frontend feels dated >> in comparison to other alternatives. I also agree that this needs to >> be a single box solution. I don't think you will get any good DVR >> functionality inside a TV (or a small low power box). Perhaps DVR >> functionality should be considered advanced/extra and require the >> extra box? >> > Agreed it should be a single machine install with the option for advanced > users to only install a front-end or a back-end. A bit like the partitioning > options in the current installer: default to a full install but have an > advanced alternative. > > So basically what we're looking at creating is something MythTV-like, with a > swish front-end + back-end model, the back-end being either MythTV or MythTV > + additional stuff? Shall we start a feature list? I'm happy to maintain it. > > Bruno
We've had a feature list for a few months ( http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/UbuntuTV ) as well as an Issues list ( http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/UbuntuTV-Issues ). You (and anyone else interested) might want to join #ubuntu-tv on Freenode. -- Thomas Mashos -- Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-tv Post to : [email protected] Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-tv More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
