Am Montag, 13. August 2012 um 20:53 schrieb Hans Aberg: HA> The German WP mentions that in the context of the now HA> discontinued Bildschirmtext, it was called "Raute": HA> https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doppelkreuz_(Satzzeichen) HA> https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bildschirmtext
HA> But otherwise, "Raute" is the same as English "lozenge": HA> https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raute_(Symbol) In fact, I have heavily edited these Wikipedia articles in the last days, Before, they show a mess of "Doppelkreuz", "Raute", and "Nummernzeichen" When I started my current work on a keyboard related paper (which is the first time that I have to write for the general public, rather than for colleagues in the standardizing business), I started with a scheme: "Doppelkreuz" (literally: double cross) is the usual name for "#" as a character. "Raute" is: a. lozenge b. the viewdata square in the now discontinued Bildschirmtext (which roughly corresponds to Viewdata, Videotex or Prestel in other countries.) "Nummernzeichen" (literally: number sign) is a collective term for "#" and the "Numero-Zeichen" № U+2116 NUMERO SIGN, as using it specifically for "#" would cause confusion, as the "#" never was used for marking numbers except on desktop calculators, and the name in fact was used for the NUMERO SIGN also. Then, I extended and edited the Wikipedia articles according to this scheme. Now, after discussing this with several people, I learned that this scheme was too academic, as in fact everybody seems to call the "#" "Raute". The word "Raute" otherwise is unused in colloquial German. You learn in math lessons that there is a geometric form called "Rhombus" (lozenge) which also can be called "Raute", but in the class "Rhombus" is the preferred term. "Raute" also is the preferred term in heraldics, but used by the general public only when referring to the pattern of the Bavarian flag. (Besides, "Raute" is used in the name of some herbs, like Ruta graveolens, but also only by specialists.) The lozenge usually is called "Karo" in colloquial language (like the diamond suit on playing cards), and only "Rhombus" when it deviates too much from a square standing on its corner. Thus, when the "#" came as a new character to the general public with the keypad telephone in the 1970s, together with a name "Raute" which sounds not unknown and not really wrong, thus it got its way into the general public together with the "#" (which, as said, was formerly not used in Germany). "Raute" is e.g. used by customer services which you call when you have a question regarding your mobile phone, and you are told to press the lower right key on your telephone keypad. On the other hand, as far as I know now (and a DIN officer confirmed me this), there is no German standard which uses the term "Raute". Thus, I probably will use the term "Doppelkreuz" but have to remark that I address the character commonly called "Raute". As the discussion so far showed no evidence for any relevant general public use for the lozenge besides the subtotal on desktop calculators, I fortunately do not have to address this in depth. Thanks to all participants so far. - Karl
